Topic: Is there a Bitcoin backed bank? - page 2. (Read 1767 times)

I don't think there will be one, but I think there're banks that holds bitcoins as assets.
For instance they hold Euros as assets but also Bitcoins.

You are talking about a drop in the ocean  btc is  so tiny.


 btc needs to be big .  no banks will touch a little thing like btc.

My post shows you a tiny little bank in New York is bigger then all of bitcoin.

I am not against a bank doing it.  but any bank would need backing from the country it is in.  lets Say Germany.

Next the bank is only going to have at most 5% of the worlds coins. (there is a reason I picked 5% )

 so that would be 5% of a 3.5 billion of about 175million in btc.  So any fiscally responsible bank would need to guarantee coins and the fiat value.

Or they would not be a bank they would be an exchange. 

Do German laws allow this kind of thing?


It's not illegal but it's not legal too. It's kind of a grey area. There's no law about this situation AFAIK.

Banks will get more into Bitcoin and it will make it more valuable. The ideas surrounding banks are so negative but there are also good banks.
Why would we be happy when Facebook accepts Bitcoin and not when Barclays would get involved.

This is what already happens in altcoin:
http://bitcoinprbuzz.com/national-aten-coin-foundation-accepted-into-aba-aligning-cryptocurrency-aten-black-gold-coin-with-top-regulatory-agencies/

Atencoin will be available on 4th of July!
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/aten-black-gold-coin-available-131600955.html

its illegal.



edit: and doesnt make sense.

I seriously hope nobody remembers to make a Bitcoin backed bank... That's just subverting the deepest meaning of Bitcoin.

Thanks, it's kind of what I was saying but their failure doesn't mean the concept is flawed, it just means they didn't successfully run the business, the concept I know is sound, unless banks don't work? it seemed a bit convoluted with shares offers etc.  Plus it was trying, it seems to keep a consistent fiat price for their customers which seems foolish. people depositing fiat in the kind of bank I'm talking about would have to know their investments could fluctuate but also of course in their favour.


In many ways what I'm suggesting kind of works like some Gold backed funds that also give you a credit card you can use just like any other. I think Peter Schiff runs a gold account like this from outside the U.S.

There was an attempt to do that in 2013, early 2014, it didn't end well.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/ipvo-multiple-exchanges-neo-bee-lmb-holdings-289730

I said nothing about looking for a bank that does it, I'm saying now why not just start one?

of course a bank makes money from loans to pay interest. that's exactly my point. Why are people referencing exchanges which are often anonomous and don't do what I'm suggesting ie provide a front of shop service which would work like any other bank and holds your money for you and gives you a card you can use that is denominated in fiat.

I think people have such a distorted view of what a bank is that they simply can get their head around the fact banks existed in the past and were not much bigger a business that a hardware store. A bank simply stores people money safely and loans as much as it thinks is viable to keep them in business and attract savers. it's not rocket science. An exchange isn't anything like what I'm saying. With this concept users wouldn't use Bitcoin they would use fiat up to the value of their Bitcoin in their account. YOU WOULDNT DEPOSIT BITCOIN, YOU WOULD DEPOSIT FIAT.

If I was Greek right now I would run at a bank that was backed by Bitcoin and if it existed and worked just like any other bank that even your mom could relate too, no Bitcoin wallets not secret keys, none of the shit that stops average people touching Bitcoin. A bank like this would have to focus on security, just like banks used to, ie vault etc. So they would want to hold Bitcoin in the most secure wallets and have multiple wallets etc, everything encrypted etc. Maybe if possible insurance that guarantees a persons deposits.

This is where Bitcoin needs to go for the mainstream.

It's not a bank your talking about, but a currency exchange (which a lot of banks do), but there are also places that just offer currency exchange. It would be nice if you could go to a currency exchange and convert bitCoins to cash and visa versa.

You originally put your money into banks to make interest and the banks would loan out that money at a higher interest. Banks used to beg for your money (they actually did give away toasters if you opened a account and you actually made ok money with the interest when I was a kid). Banks suck you dry now with all their fees.

The only way a bank would work with bitCoins is if they could make money from your deposits. bitCoins is not big enough at the moment for banks to make money from it. Until that happens, you'll be hard lucked to find a bank to take bitCoins as a deposit. They would also have to offer a incentive for people to want to deposit bitCoins into the bank.

I think you are thinking of something very similar to an exchange. There are a few exchanges that will pay interest on your holding, mostly Chinese exchanges, and mostly are probably not a good idea to deposit your fiat/bitcoin in any of them.

There is also bitfinex which allows you to lend your bitcoin/fiat to traders on the exchange and as long as you trust bitfinex and as long as bitfinex has sufficient controls to prevent traders from having negative equity in their accounts, then you should be safe from losses.

Let me also ask you this: How do you think it is that banks are able to afford to pay interest on their deposits? The answer is that they lend out money their deposit holders give them prudently, and charge an interest rate greater then that they are paying to deposit holders. This means that any "bank" that will pay interest on your bitcoin holdings will, by nature need to lend it out in order to afford to pay you interest. It would not be realistic to believe that a bank will not touch your money and then turn around and pay you interest on it.

Why does a bank need to be big?

Maybe i'm being naive but all someone needs from an average bank is for their money to be held safely. Plus a bank makes money from loaning money. So why can't it be scaled as the bank grows? I imagine there are a lot of laws and red tape to jump through I'm not going to suggest it would be easy but actually without red tape its an incredibly simply business model. You simply hold Bitcoin and pay a small interest of even none and loan Bitcoin for a charge. Community co-operative farming banks etc have been around for decades. Small banks were actually more the norm in the past I expect.


*Sorry but an exchange does not self the basic function of a bank i.e. keep your assets safe within reason. Exchanges are the opposite of safe.

three questions with the answers for you.

what is a btc in usd?  about 250.
how many mined btc coins are there? about 14,323,000
how much is btc market cap? 3,580,750,000

What size is a small bank.

well this is a list of the top 100 banks in New York-Northern New Jersey-Long Island, NY-NJ-PA Area

http://www.bankbrief.com/city_results_by_assets.php?cbsa=35620




   

 
Banks in New York-Northern New Jersey-Long Island, NY-NJ-PA Area

Ranked by Assets

Records 1 to 100 of 195

View Ranked by Profitability - View Ranked by Asset Size - View Ranked by Deposits

Bank   City   Assets ($1,000)   ROA  so 1000 x each number below give you dollar value of assets at that bank.



The Bank of New York Mellon   New York, NY   $218699000   0.9%
Hudson City Savings Bank   Paramus, NJ   $51616117   0.9%
Deutsche Bank Trust Company Americas   New York, NY   $43932000   0.3%
Merrill Lynch Bank & Trust Co., FSB   New York, NY   $35845565   -0.4%
New York Community Bank   Westbury, NY   $29874746   0.0%
Bank of China   New York City, NY   $27194990   0.0%
Astoria Federal Savings and Loan Association   Long Island City, NY   $22135889   0.4%
TD Bank USA, National Association   New York, NY   $19800540   0.3%
Valley National Bank   Wayne, NJ   $14269419   0.7%
Banco Popular North America   New York, NY   $12801641   -1.3%
Emigrant Bank   New York, NY   $10705750   -0.2%
Israel Discount Bank of New York   New York, NY   $9395580   0.5%
Metlife Bank, National Association   Bridgewater, NJ   $9371443   0.5%
Apple Bank for Savings   Manhasset, NY   $7086683   0.6%
Investors Savings Bank   Short Hills, NJ   $7025628   0.3%
Signature Bank   New York, NY   $6699455   0.6%
Bank Hapoalim B.M.   New York, NY   $6512996   0.0%
The Provident Bank   Jersey City, NJ   $6436021   0.7%
Bank Leumi USA   New York, NY   $5605467   0.4%
Morgan Stanley Trust   Jersey City, NJ   $5254105   0.3%
Amalgamated Bank   New York, NY   $4573953   -0.3%
Columbia Bank   Fair Lawn, NJ   $4510686   0.7%
Bank of Tokyo-Mitsubishi UFJ Trust Company   New York, NY   $4146675   -1.1%
Ridgewood Savings Bank   New York City, NY   $4101225   0.5%
The Dime Svgs. Bank of Williamsburgh   Brooklyn, NY   $3814342   0.9%
Safra National Bank of New York   New York, NY   $3777224   0.5%

Flushing Savings Bank, FSB   New York City, NY   $3613431   0.2%  this one little bank with 7 or 8 buildings in NYC has more then all the BTC in the world


Mizuho Corporate Bank (USA)   New York, NY   $3539479   0.2%


All of the above have more then 3.5 billion.  Which is all of the BTC in the world.

 My point is BTC is  far too small for the banks at this moment to even consider your idea.




Provident Bank   Montebello, NY   $2976498   0.9%
State Bank of India   New York, NY   $2710410   0.0%
New York Commercial Bank   Islandia, NY   $2628001   0.5%
Amboy Bank   Old Bridge, NJ   $2575682   1.6%
Lakeland Bank   Oak Ridge, NJ   $2571555   0.9%
Intervest National Bank   New York, NY   $2108233   0.5%
Sterling National Bank   New York, NY   $2097818   0.9%
Kearny Federal Savings Bank   Kearny, NJ   $2030926   0.3%
Spencer Savings Bank, SLA   Elmwood Park, NJ   $1934664   0.4%
OceanFirst Bank   Toms River, NJ   $1874790   0.9%
Bank of Smithtown   Smithtown, NY   $1689491   1.3%
The Suffolk County National Bank of Riverhead   Riverhead, NY   $1626694   1.7%
Northfield Bank   Staten Island, NY   $1605513   1.0%
State Bank of Long Island   New Hyde Park, NY   $1589310   0.6%
Oritani Bank   Township Of Washington, NJ   $1535736   0.5%
Ameriprise Bank, FSB   New York, NY   $1462413   -5.4%
Peapack-Gladstone Bank   Gladstone, NJ   $1363390   1.0%
Maspeth Federal Savings and Loan Association   Maspeth, NY   $1358740   1.8%
Interaudi Bank   New York, NY   $1286740   0.4%
The First National Bank of Long Island   Glen Head, NY   $1224208   1.2%
Boiling Springs Savings Bank   Rutherford, NJ   $1195091   0.2%
Emigrant Savings Bank - Manhattan   New York, NY   $1189722   0.4%
Union County Savings Bank   Elizabeth, NJ   $1099985   0.9%
Woori America Bank   New York, NY   $1083857   1.0%
Emigrant Savings Bank - Bronx/Westchester   Bronx, NY   $1047241   0.3%
Union Center National Bank   Union, NJ   $1043714   0.6%




When and if BTC gets to 10k per coin vs 250 usd a coin   or 40x bigger then it is now then we have a shot.

For now just exchanges.

me too, I get that. But we aren't sick of banks for mainstream sensible banking ie deposits, loans etc we are against banking for debasement of money, fractional reserve banking, risk taking derive ratios trading ect. I'm talking about returning banks to the original meaning. Plus I'm only talking about making the FRONT SHOP of banking normal and accessible to the masses, Bitcoin would be the foundation it's built on.



You know what, I'm just thinking aloud but if a bunch of large holders got together they really could make something like this happen. The thing is people here are hoping people will accept using money that disappears if they make a mistake or are hacked. not going to happen, this gives a user friendly face to what we all believe in here.

*You wouldn't have private keys, you would just have a bank account just like any other bank. It would be the banks job to insure its wealth, have comprehensive unhackble systems and wallets, risk shared around many wallets etc. let's professionals deal with security. Otherwise one little old lady loses their Bitcoin once they won't go back to it.

at the moment I do not think so. if would be really great if there was.

I found this http://www.techradar.com/us/news/internet/a-major-bank-just-gave-bitcoin-some-of-its-mojo-back-1292575

i know there are some bank about bitcoin that are in project like those in Switzerland , if they could offer something about interest, that aren't few pennies like we can earn with faucets, than maybe they could see some use in the future, especially because of security

What would the point be? Most of us are using crypto currencies because we got sick of banks and their shitty practices.

Who would be having control over your private keys? {The bank}? I would not trust a central controlled entity with my private keys.

Nope, let's just get rid of the banks and be done with it. They dropped us before and they will do it again. It's like walking backwards... no point to it. 

I hope you understand the concept of Bitcoin digital gold better than me, according to the knowledge given to me. since the most currency issued by central authority that controls the money supply, and to avoid that Bitcoin digital currency has been invented which is purely based on peer-to-peer network, so in this case, it they bank give such monthly statement as you mentioned, then we are inviting banks to act as a central authority to control the Bitcoin.

not yet. a very bitcoin friendly bank is the Fidor Bank in germany. probably they would be the first to do such thing.

Its an obvious question but is there a bank backed by Bitcoin?


Imagine a bank you walk into or online that simply took your fiat and gave you whatever the value of Bitcoin was at that point gave you a monthly statement that said how many Bitcoin you own and the fiat value alongside it. It could work exactly like a bank so it therefore took guaranteed your deposit by keeping Bitcoin safe in offline wallets etc, paid interest charged interest for loans etc like any other bank does. I don't think the average person wants to worry about Bitcoin wallets and security, let the bank worry about it. My point is have everything looking like from the front a normal bank but back the fiat up with Bitcoin. I mean banks originally owned Gold to back up deposits, so why not use Bitcoin to do the same function.


I think people need the interface of a bank but one clearly stating they are Bitcoin backed would for some actually be quite attractive. e.g Greeks right now.


Has anyone tried it?