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Topic: Is this a clear sign of high inflation? (Read 404 times)

legendary
Activity: 2534
Merit: 1873
Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform
December 10, 2021, 10:21:04 AM
#50


When we think of inflation we usually think of how much food, electricity or gasoline costs.

But there is another aspect as well: how much it costs us to buy financial assets.

The above chart at first glance may appear to be due to the strong performance of the 500 largest U.S. companies. But this is misleading: I believe it reflects more the effects of massive printing and inflation than how companies are doing.

The charts for the stock markets of countries with high inflation are similar: the more currency printing and inflation, the more the stock market rises.

That the S&P, which has an average return of about 10% on average has risen 30% in the last year is sobering. Let's think that in November 2020 we were already out of the stock market slump that was the COVID.

At the end of the day, anyone like me who has money invested in the S&P 500 can't be too happy about the 30% return because if we discount inflation it comes to almost nothing.
No this can't act as a barometer for Inflation, If we are going to value everything that rises in price as Inflation then even Bitcoin will expand due to Inflation one day.

It's true that the more the money is printed more the money reaches into the market and higher the stock prices rally, but this thing is generally temporary in nature because if the money printing isn't backed by enough economic development eventually it will fall one day because companies that would have promised these valuations won't be able to justify their valuation using their profits/ Revenues and eventually the market would fall like a house of cards when people would ultimately take their money out of overvalued stocks.

It is very interesting about overvalued stocks, but there is something that worries me, or perhaps it is just a small intuition, whenever problems arise regarding falls in the global economy, who applies as fundamental is some variant of covid-19, I do not know if they do it on purpose or as a strategy, but it happens that it is always the perfect excuse for entertainment, in several countries the way to close their borders is being evaluated, obviously all economic problems are skewed towards these fundamentals.
legendary
Activity: 2534
Merit: 1338
December 09, 2021, 04:17:50 PM
#49
I have studied finance at university and I can say and inflation affects all financial assets.
Especially the stock market.Only real estate(besides Bitcoin) can provide enough protection against inflation,which means that the real price growth minus the nominal price growth(caused by inflation) cannot become negative.Real estate assets cannot get devalued due to the inflation.Stocks can get devalued and government/treasury bonds can also get devalued by inflation.
It is pretty clear that the Federal Reserve money printing boosted the S&P 500 index a lot,during the last decades.Traditional financial markets are a giant bubble.Crypto markets are a giant bubble as well,thanks to the money printing made by the central banks.
At the end the only thing we can do to protect ourselves is to invest in fundamentally strong assets, real estate maintains its value because we all need a place to live so there is always going to be demand for it, however since real estate can be so costly it is difficult to sell during a time of crisis, so it is important to have a significant amount on assets that can be traded more easily, and under a scenario of hyperinflation gold, silver and bitcoin seems like the best assets to have.
legendary
Activity: 2086
Merit: 1058
December 09, 2021, 10:08:38 AM
#48
it’s not stocks that get devalued, it’s the currency. Increasing inflation is a effect of the money printer. It increases the money supply, and therefore increases demand, and increases the prices of stocks, real estate, used cars, almost everything. Then because of it, it creates bottlenecks on the supply side, causing inflation to increase further/faster.
This is quite bad, and it is as if no one wants to fix this problem of inflation. It just got worse during this coronavirus pandemic. For the fact that people had to stay indoors, during the lockdowns and then things are also getting costly to the extent that most of them wouldn’t be able to achieve it, that’s very bad.  It’s really got a lot of things destabilized this year. I know how costly things got in my country and people are just finding it difficult.

There were even people who lost their job as a result of the pandemic as well. Those are the ones who I pity the most. Especially the ones who have families to take care of. Solving this issue of inflation should be a priority for the government. Printing too much money wasn’t really a way to go, because they knew this was going to affect the economy later.
legendary
Activity: 2898
Merit: 1823
December 08, 2021, 02:38:26 AM
#47
You can't really blame inflation for that.
When you think one thing is caused by that you should look at others to see if they match, let's check a country which experiened deflation, Japan:



Then something else must also be happening, DJI is  19,86 %  while NDAQ is 60%, so the growth is triggered clearly by some industries, and not all of them.

OP, that IS a very clear sign of high inflation. All that extra money going to stocks, commodities, real estate, AND cryptocurrencies. But it will come down crashing soon, and prepare for the next cycle, OR hyperinflation.

Hyperinflation in the US? I don't understand why you're happy about this, trust me even if your coins will be worth 1 billion and you could buy everything you wanted you wouldn't want to live in such a period. Unless you enjoy seeing people suffering.


I didn’t notice stompix’s post. Happy about this? No, why would I be happy? Plus it isn’t a jeer on the people, it’s a jeer on the Federal Reserve, and government as the lying becomes more shameless. They are treating plebs like shit, manipulated, gaslighted and brainwashed. The majority believe their lies, believe it or not.
legendary
Activity: 2534
Merit: 1873
Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform
December 07, 2021, 07:23:53 PM
#46
When we think of inflation we usually think of how much food, electricity or gasoline costs.

But there is another aspect as well: how much it costs us to buy financial assets.
Inflation is a pretty bad thing, you’re holding huge amount of money, but that money is totally useless, because things are costly in the market and before you know what’s happening you’re already done spending all the money on just a few things.

The covid-19 situation has really turned a lot of economies around the world upside down and causing them all to struggle. It has been the same way in most countries, and it’s worst in a case whereby the government is filled with leaders that doesn’t care to carry out their responsibilities to the citizens. Inflation keeps going up and the cost of things are high, and people are now looking for ways to save their value.
Inflation seems to be felt by many countries, especially during the pandemic which is getting worse and this is felt by the lower middle class whose impact is very significant because they are no longer maintaining values but looking for values to survive while the government does not seem to want to be burdened by them and hands off
The best weapon against inflation is buying solid fiat, or gold, or the best BTC, if it is BTC better because in a fully inflationary economy, it does not matter that the BTC falls in price, in the same way it will continue to be worth a lot with respect to the internal economy that the country owns.
Another way to protect against inflation is by buying material things that are later sought by people and at that time it is possible to sell more expensively, and resort to looking for extra income at all costs, starting a simple business that can give money is another way to attack the problem.


I think that running your business with products that are not prone to financial crises is most likely the best way to protect your wealth from inflation. When we come up with material things right now I guess one problem could be that markets are overheated already., wouldn't you agree? I am not necessarily talking about the housing market, but also about watches and other assets. Right now things are expensive.

Of course, in times of high inflation everything is possible, however the business with watches, or with any other asset is valid, in my country people passed food, medicines and anything to be able to change them to foreign currency, even today what is happening is gasoline, copper, some thieves chose to pass the copper from the electric power cables, they stole it and they passed it to earn more money, and only then to be able to find or buy food and any basic item.
legendary
Activity: 2310
Merit: 1598
Do not die for Putin
December 07, 2021, 05:24:49 AM
#45
You can't really blame inflation for that.
When you think one thing is caused by that you should look at others to see if they match, let's check a country which experiened deflation, Japan:



Then something else must also be happening, DJI is  19,86 %  while NDAQ is 60%, so the growth is triggered clearly by some industries, and not all of them.

OP, that IS a very clear sign of high inflation. All that extra money going to stocks, commodities, real estate, AND cryptocurrencies. But it will come down crashing soon, and prepare for the next cycle, OR hyperinflation.

Hyperinflation in the US? I don't understand why you're happy about this, trust me even if your coins will be worth 1 billion and you could buy everything you wanted you wouldn't want to live in such a period. Unless you enjoy seeing people suffering.

Japan is no longer on deflation, there are clear signs of economic recovery and even though the Japanes CEOs are extremely conservative when they set their expectations, the growth is more clear if you look at the small caps. Many of them with a high technological component. Also, Japan is a country that is particularly well suited to embrace several of the key technological drivers expected by the future: mid and high tech manufacturing, robotics, AI,... they do not make as much noise, but they are certainly embracing the change.

There is inflation and that is the cause of a general index growth - simply the FED giving money to every zombie company out there - NASDAQ increase has a concurrent factor: COVID advanced work from home and app based services by 10 years.
legendary
Activity: 2898
Merit: 1823
December 07, 2021, 03:36:41 AM
#44
I have studied finance at university and I can say and inflation affects all financial assets. Especially the stock market. Only real estate(besides Bitcoin) can provide enough protection against inflation,which means that the real price growth minus the nominal price growth(caused by inflation) cannot become negative. Real estate assets cannot get devalued due to the inflation. Stocks can get devalued and government/treasury bonds can also get devalued by inflation.

It is pretty clear that the Federal Reserve money printing boosted the S&P 500 index a lot,during the last decades. Traditional financial markets are a giant bubble. Crypto markets are a giant bubble as well,thanks to the money printing made by the central banks.


Yes, but it’s not stocks that get devalued, it’s the currency. Increasing inflation is a effect of the money printer. It increases the money supply, and therefore increases demand, and increases the prices of stocks, real estate, used cars, almost everything. Then because of it, it creates bottlenecks on the supply side, causing inflation to increase further/faster.
hero member
Activity: 3094
Merit: 929
December 07, 2021, 03:25:41 AM
#43
I have studied finance at university and I can say and inflation affects all financial assets.
Especially the stock market.Only real estate(besides Bitcoin) can provide enough protection against inflation,which means that the real price growth minus the nominal price growth(caused by inflation) cannot become negative.Real estate assets cannot get devalued due to the inflation.Stocks can get devalued and government/treasury bonds can also get devalued by inflation.
It is pretty clear that the Federal Reserve money printing boosted the S&P 500 index a lot,during the last decades.Traditional financial markets are a giant bubble.Crypto markets are a giant bubble as well,thanks to the money printing made by the central banks.
hero member
Activity: 2086
Merit: 603
December 07, 2021, 02:38:32 AM
#42
Idk, this looks like mis matched example of inflation or may be it does not connect the dots properly. The share chart which you have shown here is incremental over the year period which indicates the performance value of the 500 companies included in it. It's not inflation. The company share value will rise all the time if they are having good performance. If the value is rising then it means their products and services are being liked by everybody and they are using it for their good terms. Moreover as they keep growing they are actually hiring more an d more employees to lower the burden of company work force.

I see it completely different way. Its more or less companies growth. Inflation would make the companies dead, bankrupt, resignations of employees and what not. If their products get costlier then they should see lesser users of the same who would go and search alternatives. That way company share should ideally go down and not up.
legendary
Activity: 2534
Merit: 1338
December 06, 2021, 03:09:15 PM
#41
When we think of inflation we usually think of how much food, electricity or gasoline costs.

But there is another aspect as well: how much it costs us to buy financial assets.
As someone who lives in a nation with clear high inflation and not even debatable, I can tell you that even stocks do not go up when things goes to shit. Why? Because the value of money becomes so worthless and people become so poor that people can't even buy stuff from those companies who are in the stock market, which results with those companies losing customers and losing profits and that ends up with losing value in stock market.

So, imagine an inflation so high that, even stock market doesn't go up when money becomes worthless. That is the true inflation, and god forbids any other nation to have something like that and I hope we will never have it again.
This is true, at the early stages stocks go up as people have too much money which was printed by the government and they need to choose a place to put it, and many choose stocks to do this as for a time it seems it can outpace inflation, however eventually things get so bad that assets like that begin to perform poorly, governments try to rescue them by printing more money but this only makes the problem worse, eventually crashing the stock market and the whole economy with it.
hero member
Activity: 2114
Merit: 618
December 05, 2021, 03:33:50 PM
#40


When we think of inflation we usually think of how much food, electricity or gasoline costs.

But there is another aspect as well: how much it costs us to buy financial assets.

The above chart at first glance may appear to be due to the strong performance of the 500 largest U.S. companies. But this is misleading: I believe it reflects more the effects of massive printing and inflation than how companies are doing.

The charts for the stock markets of countries with high inflation are similar: the more currency printing and inflation, the more the stock market rises.

That the S&P, which has an average return of about 10% on average has risen 30% in the last year is sobering. Let's think that in November 2020 we were already out of the stock market slump that was the COVID.

At the end of the day, anyone like me who has money invested in the S&P 500 can't be too happy about the 30% return because if we discount inflation it comes to almost nothing.
No this can't act as a barometer for Inflation, If we are going to value everything that rises in price as Inflation then even Bitcoin will expand due to Inflation one day.

It's true that the more the money is printed more the money reaches into the market and higher the stock prices rally, but this thing is generally temporary in nature because if the money printing isn't backed by enough economic development eventually it will fall one day because companies that would have promised these valuations won't be able to justify their valuation using their profits/ Revenues and eventually the market would fall like a house of cards when people would ultimately take their money out of overvalued stocks.
legendary
Activity: 2338
Merit: 1124
December 05, 2021, 01:14:34 PM
#39
When we think of inflation we usually think of how much food, electricity or gasoline costs.

But there is another aspect as well: how much it costs us to buy financial assets.
As someone who lives in a nation with clear high inflation and not even debatable, I can tell you that even stocks do not go up when things goes to shit. Why? Because the value of money becomes so worthless and people become so poor that people can't even buy stuff from those companies who are in the stock market, which results with those companies losing customers and losing profits and that ends up with losing value in stock market.

So, imagine an inflation so high that, even stock market doesn't go up when money becomes worthless. That is the true inflation, and god forbids any other nation to have something like that and I hope we will never have it again.
sr. member
Activity: 2436
Merit: 272
Hire Bitcointalk Camp. Manager @ r7promotions.com
December 04, 2021, 06:58:59 AM
#38
I can understand what you are trying to say its just the value of the stocks aren't really growing its in the green simply because of the value of our currency is dropping and especially after 2020 but 30% growth is really a good figure if we just look at it from the returns perspective but do we really make any profits? And don't forget the tax factor we also have to deduct the tax rates from the growth so companies are in more beneficial and making money not the actual investors.
legendary
Activity: 2534
Merit: 1338
December 03, 2021, 05:41:23 PM
#37
I'd say it's a clear sign that governments all around the world have been buying assets and printing money like crazy. It has been going on for far too long now, pretty much since the 2008 recession and it kicked back into overdrive mode at the start of Covid. Sure, they might have averted an immediate recession but it just tends to push the problem down the road and now we're starting to see runaway inflation. It's going to hurt a lot of people when interest rate rises kick in - credit has been so cheap for so long that people won't be able to cope when their mortgages start to double or triple in cost in a few years time. It was reckless behavior by central banks and rather lazy, they tend to change their minds and adapt too slowly while claiming to be super experts.
Sometimes I do ask myself, is it that the government doesn’t know the consequences of the actions that they are taking? How can a government that is filled with lots of people who can sit down and discuss any issue, not know that there are going to be consequences to the actions that they are going to be taking? Seriously, I do think about this a lot, because I’m sure that before the government takes any action there are lots of people there who would have to sit down and discuss about the action that the governments are going to take and whether it is a good one or not, and how it is going to affect the economy of the country.
There are two things that happen which causes politicians to act the way they do, to begin with they believe they are above the rest of the population, so even if what they do ends up affecting people they do not believe they will be part of the ones that are affected, the other reason is they believe this time will be different and they will be able to control the inflation they are generating, but we know that every single government before has thought the same and they have failed, and many times they will not realize their mistake until heads are rolling on the street, sometimes literally, but by that time it is too late to do anything about it.
full member
Activity: 1120
Merit: 140
December 03, 2021, 04:43:59 PM
#36
I’m sure that before the government takes any action there are lots of people there who would have to sit down and discuss about the action that the governments are going to take and whether it is a good one or not, and how it is going to affect the economy of the country.
Yeah, this is what my assumption as well. Still, if governments really know the conditions and what it is going to lead to, but they still go ahead and take that same action that they know is going to be very bad for the country? Despite that there will be a lot of citizens who will complain and point out to them what are likely to be the consequences of those actions that they are about to take, but they still go ahead and do it. I really hope that they find a way to fix all these problems that they’re creating now that inflation is about to blow up because of it.
legendary
Activity: 2660
Merit: 1074
December 03, 2021, 08:22:35 AM
#35
I'd say it's a clear sign that governments all around the world have been buying assets and printing money like crazy. It has been going on for far too long now, pretty much since the 2008 recession and it kicked back into overdrive mode at the start of Covid. Sure, they might have averted an immediate recession but it just tends to push the problem down the road and now we're starting to see runaway inflation. It's going to hurt a lot of people when interest rate rises kick in - credit has been so cheap for so long that people won't be able to cope when their mortgages start to double or triple in cost in a few years time. It was reckless behavior by central banks and rather lazy, they tend to change their minds and adapt too slowly while claiming to be super experts.
Sometimes I do ask myself, is it that the government doesn’t know the consequences of the actions that they are taking? How can a government that is filled with lots of people who can sit down and discuss any issue, not know that there are going to be consequences to the actions that they are going to be taking? Seriously, I do think about this a lot, because I’m sure that before the government takes any action there are lots of people there who would have to sit down and discuss about the action that the governments are going to take and whether it is a good one or not, and how it is going to affect the economy of the country.
legendary
Activity: 2688
Merit: 1192
December 02, 2021, 05:31:24 PM
#34
When we think of inflation we usually think of how much food, electricity or gasoline costs.

But there is another aspect as well: how much it costs us to buy financial assets.

The above chart at first glance may appear to be due to the strong performance of the 500 largest U.S. companies. But this is misleading: I believe it reflects more the effects of massive printing and inflation than how companies are doing.

The charts for the stock markets of countries with high inflation are similar: the more currency printing and inflation, the more the stock market rises.

That the S&P, which has an average return of about 10% on average has risen 30% in the last year is sobering. Let's think that in November 2020 we were already out of the stock market slump that was the COVID.

At the end of the day, anyone like me who has money invested in the S&P 500 can't be too happy about the 30% return because if we discount inflation it comes to almost nothing.

I'd say it's a clear sign that governments all around the world have been buying assets and printing money like crazy. It has been going on for far too long now, pretty much since the 2008 recession and it kicked back into overdrive mode at the start of Covid. Sure, they might have averted an immediate recession but it just tends to push the problem down the road and now we're starting to see runaway inflation. It's going to hurt a lot of people when interest rate rises kick in - credit has been so cheap for so long that people won't be able to cope when their mortgages start to double or triple in cost in a few years time. It was reckless behavior by central banks and rather lazy, they tend to change their minds and adapt too slowly while claiming to be super experts.
legendary
Activity: 2618
Merit: 1105
December 02, 2021, 05:28:25 PM
#33
I think that running your business with products that are not prone to financial crises is most likely the best way to protect your wealth from inflation. When we come up with material things right now I guess one problem could be that markets are overheated already., wouldn't you agree? I am not necessarily talking about the housing market, but also about watches and other assets. Right now things are expensive.

I never thought of a way which can help me create products which can never be wasted and are not prone to financial crisis because if such products would have come in the market, every businessmen would be successful. No business comes without risks and businesses also run on commitments. If S&P 500 is rising only, I duly believe that inflation is not too far from hitting the markets when we will be paying very high against the earnings we get from our work.
legendary
Activity: 2310
Merit: 1598
Do not die for Putin
December 02, 2021, 05:11:47 PM
#32
You can choose any index, even the price of property and possibly the best would be a commodities index. They all tell the same story: while growth is stagnant and there has been a massive real economic impact from COVID, the cannons wielded by the central banks are sprouting all the printed money and that goes to either paying debts, buying goods, saving or - most commonly - into stocks investments 401k's and the like. With the massive amount of index investing, this graph is only natural.
hero member
Activity: 1708
Merit: 553
Play Bitcoin PVP Prediction Game
December 02, 2021, 10:32:20 AM
#31
When we think of inflation we usually think of how much food, electricity or gasoline costs.

But there is another aspect as well: how much it costs us to buy financial assets.
Inflation is a pretty bad thing, you’re holding huge amount of money, but that money is totally useless, because things are costly in the market and before you know what’s happening you’re already done spending all the money on just a few things.

The covid-19 situation has really turned a lot of economies around the world upside down and causing them all to struggle. It has been the same way in most countries, and it’s worst in a case whereby the government is filled with leaders that doesn’t care to carry out their responsibilities to the citizens. Inflation keeps going up and the cost of things are high, and people are now looking for ways to save their value.
Inflation seems to be felt by many countries, especially during the pandemic which is getting worse and this is felt by the lower middle class whose impact is very significant because they are no longer maintaining values but looking for values to survive while the government does not seem to want to be burdened by them and hands off
The best weapon against inflation is buying solid fiat, or gold, or the best BTC, if it is BTC better because in a fully inflationary economy, it does not matter that the BTC falls in price, in the same way it will continue to be worth a lot with respect to the internal economy that the country owns.
Another way to protect against inflation is by buying material things that are later sought by people and at that time it is possible to sell more expensively, and resort to looking for extra income at all costs, starting a simple business that can give money is another way to attack the problem.


I think that running your business with products that are not prone to financial crises is most likely the best way to protect your wealth from inflation. When we come up with material things right now I guess one problem could be that markets are overheated already., wouldn't you agree? I am not necessarily talking about the housing market, but also about watches and other assets. Right now things are expensive.
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