It's because of crazy people like this...

goatpig

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Quote from: Alex Beckenham on May 15, 2011, 10:56:22 PM

Quote from: rezin777 on May 15, 2011, 10:41:54 PM

Quote from: Alex Beckenham on May 15, 2011, 10:17:44 PM

I'm not in support of caging children, or murdering the parents.

Putting a child in a cage long enough to result in the child eating it's own skin in an attempt to survive is enough criminal negligence to require complete removal from society, imo. At this point the parents have clearly expressed their ability to initiate force against others and should have no expectation of gentle treatment at the hands of others.

I agree, I wouldn't handle them gently if they came anywhere near me or my family.

But I wouldn't go out of my way to have them whacked either.

And you wouldn't go out of your way if I went out of mine to whack them. That's the beauty of anarchy. On a more fundamental level, these people have given up on their right to live by forcefully putting the life of another in danger. As such, I have no responsibility to respect their life and a legitimate motive in opposing these people with force. You, on your end, have no motive to stop me from harming them in my attempt to save the child.

JohnDoe

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Quote from: Alex Beckenham on May 15, 2011, 10:17:44 PM

I'm not in support of caging children, or murdering the parents.

That's fine. The world is big so I don't think your school of thought would end up clashing with mine over our key differences if we lived in anarchy. I guess I would just go to a place where people think like me and like to take care of problems quickly and efficiently rather than fairly and rightly (which in my opinion would be slow and inefficient).

Alex Beckenham

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Quote from: rezin777 on May 15, 2011, 10:41:54 PM

Quote from: Alex Beckenham on May 15, 2011, 10:17:44 PM

I'm not in support of caging children, or murdering the parents.

Putting a child in a cage long enough to result in the child eating it's own skin in an attempt to survive is enough criminal negligence to require complete removal from society, imo. At this point the parents have clearly expressed their ability to initiate force against others and should have no expectation of gentle treatment at the hands of others.

I agree, I wouldn't handle them gently if they came anywhere near me or my family.

But I wouldn't go out of my way to have them whacked either.

rezin777

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Quote from: Alex Beckenham on May 15, 2011, 10:17:44 PM

I'm not in support of caging children, or murdering the parents.

Putting a child in a cage long enough to result in the child eating it's own skin in an attempt to survive is enough criminal negligence to require complete removal from society, imo. At this point the parents have clearly expressed their ability to initiate force against others and should have no expectation of gentle treatment at the hands of others.

Alex Beckenham

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Quote from: JohnDoe on May 15, 2011, 09:58:09 PM

Quote from: MoonShadow on May 15, 2011, 09:03:11 PM

what if another neighbor considers you a threat because they don't see it the same way as yourself.

Then I have a big problem obviously. In reality though I would never have acted in the first place if I wasn't sure I'd have the support of the rest. If the rest instead supported the caging of children then it means I'm in hostile territory and should get the hell outta there.

I'm not in support of caging children, or murdering the parents.

JohnDoe

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Quote from: MoonShadow on May 15, 2011, 09:03:11 PM

what if another neighbor considers you a threat because they don't see it the same way as yourself.

Then I have a big problem obviously. In reality though I would never have acted in the first place if I wasn't sure I'd have the support of the rest. If the rest instead supported the caging of children then it means I'm in hostile territory and should get the hell outta there.

MoonShadow

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Quote from: JohnDoe on May 15, 2011, 06:04:18 PM

Quote from: JA37 on May 15, 2011, 05:49:33 PM

The couple in question doesn't seem to be a threat to society, just to their own offspring. Should we kill them anyway, just to be on the safe side? Who else should we go after while we're at it?

You are right, not a threat to society but maybe only to their neighborhood. If I was their neighbor I would kill them anyway to be on the safe side since they are clearly very mentally unstable and because I'd feel good about rescuing the kid.

what if another neighbor considers you a threat because they don't see it the same way as yourself.

rezin777

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Quote from: JA37 on May 15, 2011, 06:07:48 PM

Ah, maybe. There are lots of people who may be a threat. You have a lot of people to kill.

This isn't a case of may be a threat, if the story in the OP is factual, these people are a threat and there is evidence to prove it.

JA37

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Quote from: JohnDoe on May 15, 2011, 06:04:18 PM

You are right, not a threat to society but maybe only to their neighborhood. If I was their neighbor I would kill them anyway to be on the safe side since they are clearly very mentally unstable and because I'd feel good about rescuing the kid.

Ah, maybe. There are lots of people who may be a threat. You have a lot of people to kill.

JohnDoe

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Quote from: JA37 on May 15, 2011, 05:49:33 PM

The couple in question doesn't seem to be a threat to society, just to their own offspring. Should we kill them anyway, just to be on the safe side? Who else should we go after while we're at it?

You are right, not a threat to society but maybe only to their neighborhood. If I was their neighbor I would kill them anyway to be on the safe side since they are clearly very mentally unstable and because I'd feel good about rescuing the kid.

JA37

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Quote from: JohnDoe on May 15, 2011, 01:57:22 PM

The point is getting rid of a threat to society right? Both methods achieve the same effect, the first one being the most efficient.

The couple in question doesn't seem to be a threat to society, just to their own offspring. Should we kill them anyway, just to be on the safe side? Who else should we go after while we're at it?

JohnDoe

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Quote from: JA37 on May 15, 2011, 01:29:03 PM

I'm sure you can see the difference between murder and inprisonment. At least I hope so. Otherwise you should seek help.

The point is getting rid of a threat to society right? Both methods achieve the same effect, the first one being the most efficient.

JA37

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Quote from: JohnDoe on May 15, 2011, 10:14:57 AM

You just whack them and be done with it. Not sure what's the difference between that and using police to arrest them and put them in jail.

I'm sure you can see the difference between murder and inprisonment. At least I hope so. Otherwise you should seek help.

mewantsbitcoins

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Quote from: Alex Beckenham on May 15, 2011, 10:56:10 AM

Quote

"He was really a nice guy," Brian Gore's ex-girlfriend, Sandy, told WTKR 3 News in Norfolk. "He went to church and everything."

Does going to church really make people seem more trustworthy, or only among other church-goers?

People with a common imaginary friend tend to trust each other

Alex Beckenham

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Quote

"He was really a nice guy," Brian Gore's ex-girlfriend, Sandy, told WTKR 3 News in Norfolk. "He went to church and everything."

Does going to church really make people seem more trustworthy, or only among other church-goers?

tomcollins

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Quote from: MoonShadow on May 14, 2011, 08:30:51 PM

Quote from: Anonanon on May 14, 2011, 08:12:49 PM

And I don't eat apples because penguins huddle together for warmth. What're you getting at?

My point here is that people like this exist. And it is because of this fact that the collective, and hopefully restrained, legitimate use of force exists. To identify, capture and contain sociopaths with criminal tendencies.

I cannot accept the arguement, however rational, that a society of entirely self-governed people can exist peacefully or sustainablely until there is a solution for this kind of person.

No monopoly of force does not mean no legitimate uses of force ever. Using force to help protect someone from someone else (or doing it yourself) is perfectly valid.

JohnDoe

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Quote from: MoonShadow on May 14, 2011, 08:30:51 PM

I cannot accept the arguement, however rational, that a society of entirely self-governed people can exist peacefully or sustainablely until there is a solution for this kind of person.

You just whack them and be done with it. Not sure what's the difference between that and using police to arrest them and put them in jail.

caveden

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Quote from: MoonShadow on May 14, 2011, 11:09:06 PM

I still consider private security/defense and 'phyles' to be sort of government in it's own right.

To be a government it has to do one of the following at least:

Coercively maintain a monopoly, particularly a monopoly on ultimate decision concerning conflicts (Justice).
Coercively finance themselves (taxation/theft)

If they're not initiating force or threat either to tax or to keep their geographical monopoly, they can't be considered governments.

Quote from: MoonShadow on May 14, 2011, 11:09:06 PM

At a minimum, the parents would have to be compensated for the children taken from them, because in that imaginary system children are legally and economicly the property of their parents.

Children are not slaves of their parents, who told you that?

caveden

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Quote from: MoonShadow on May 14, 2011, 08:30:51 PM

My point here is that people like this exist. And it is because of this fact that the collective, and hopefully restrained, legitimate use of force exists. To identify, capture and contain sociopaths with criminal tendencies.

Of course legitimate use of force exists. What doesn't follow is that you have to use illegitimate force (steal from innocents, from ex.) in order to keep legitimate uses of force.

A very basic video for better understanding: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHe4OQ4bY4o
Cheesy

FreeMoney

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Government claims responsibility for keeping us safe, fails, therefore we need government.

Topic: It's because of crazy people like this... (Read 3656 times)