I knew that there would be some statement like this. In a nutshell, merit is not moderated, right?
Not moderated, but merit abuse is frowned upon.
Topic: It's smerit(sendable merit) not kmerit(keepable merit) (Read 422 times)
Not moderated, but merit abuse is frowned upon.
He isn't the first user receiving merits for entertaining video, i remember a contest held for that purpose before. Before complaining of merit abuse, have you watched the video?
I don't complain about anything, mate. I don't need merit either. It's just something that I can observe. Merit aren't just given to constructive posts but also for post contributing positively to the forum in the form of entertaining, funny and post OP put in some effort (merited in form of appreciates).
I knew that there would be some statement like this. In a nutshell, merit is not moderated, right?Any post that isn't spam and above average is worth meriting (my opinion though).
That's right. But people have different standard of "above average". And I do appeciate for such topics like this: Giving 15 Newbie/Jr. Members a Chance to Rank Up or Merit giveaway for forum contributions! 
We already have a similar post like this done before yours.
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/smerits-hodl-5126778
Well go to know it's been discussed before but the menace is still there and it important we discus about it. Smerit should not be completely lock away in a safe. There are well deserving post that could benefit from it and get encourage to strive hard with there subsequent posts https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/smerits-hodl-5126778
legendary
Activity: 2450
Merit: 4295
eXch.cx - Automatic crypto Swap Exchange.
High ranked members are too busy establishing for themself "high-quality" standards while they usually use merit as an alternative of "Like" button on Facebook.
Merit aren't just given to constructive posts but also for post contributing positively to the forum in the form of entertaining, funny and post OP put in some effort (merited in form of appreciates). Any post that isn't spam and above average is worth meriting (my opinion though).
He isn't the first user receiving merits for entertaining video, i remember a contest held for that purpose before. Before complaining of merit abuse, have you watched the video?
Sometimes the point of not sending merit s not to keep them "keeping them mean nothing" but to wait until you get "high-quality" that deserve that sMerits.
High ranked members are too busy establishing for themself "high-quality" standards while they usually use merit as an alternative of "Like" button on Facebook.
See, do you find any "quality" on those posts? (I'm not a Quickseller's fan or alt)
Merit system made the forum better, a lot of people and I agree with that. But it also makes people less generous and become double standards.
I agree with tranthidung about cutting unnecessary part of the image that is not included what you are trying to point out or to explain and small as possible to make it cleaner and less space occupied just like this image in the quote below on how meriting works then how many smerit you will/want to send to that user.
Click here:
Here here:
Here here:
Small tips.
You should adjust your attache image by cutting unnecessary part, top and bottom parts I meant.
Adjust the image (just use the part that includes the merit button and the red arrow is enough) will make your topic cleaner, I believe.
You should adjust your attache image by cutting unnecessary part, top and bottom parts I meant.
Adjust the image (just use the part that includes the merit button and the red arrow is enough) will make your topic cleaner, I believe.
A newbie is someone that have just 1merit and that means the user have just 0.5 sMerit so how can we spend when a minimum of 1sMerit is required for the transaction to successfully go through. We can not spend what we do not have.
If you cannot comprehend "give more to receive more" then there is nothing I can do for you, sorry. In fact, this quote also applies in real life because many religions and thought leaders echoed the very same idea. 
I agree with what OP is saying. I have seen several members receive merits on a regular basis but hardly give any out themselves. This is a very selfish strategy since merits are meant to circulate. Recently I have started checking the merits of users I intend to merit. If they don't have a habit to send merits to other members I don't want to merit them either. Maybe my strategy is not the best and I should just merit the posts I like but if members are not willing to partake in the system they way it was intended to be used I am sticking with my strategy.
Well nice to understand better how the maths of smerit during the airdropped merit era was calculated.
But the point still remains many people has negative intention about merit(selling it e.t.c) so they decided to accumulate it.
I don't see the feasible explanation about saying that it hard to see a meritable post in the forum(my own thoughts though) If you scout around you sure would see.
Some try to give merit to people they are familiar with or give it to people they know they might get it back in return. But not to stress this any further I would conclude that merit awarding should be seen as a selfless act and only that way can you be able to give out merit to someone you don't know for the benefit of forum
Sometimes the point of not sending merit s not to keep them "keeping them mean nothing" but to wait until you get "high-quality" that deserve that sMerits.
In many cases, I see high-quality posts but don’t have sMerits, which makes the return to that topic/post in the future "when getting some Merits" are almost impossible.
As for low ranks, there are many reasons explained above.
In many cases, I see high-quality posts but don’t have sMerits, which makes the return to that topic/post in the future "when getting some Merits" are almost impossible.
As for low ranks, there are many reasons explained above.
<…> Correct me if am wrong I don't think smerit where attached to air dropped merit
As @HCP, sMerits were also created and assigned to accounts in the initial airdrop. The specific formula used is as follows:While specific formula is not given, theymos wrote that the initial sMerit is not solely determined by rank, but determined by rank and activity points obtained in the last year.
The exact formula was:
Code:
yearActivity = activity in the last ~year, max 378
freeMerit = the merit (not sMerit) you started with
modifier =
0.1 if member
0.2 if full member
0.25 if sr member
0.35 if hero
0.4 if legendary
return (yearActivity/378) * modifier * freeMerit
So the most you could get is if you were a Legendary who maxed out your activity points in the last year, in which case you would get 1 * 0.4 * 1000 = 400 sMerit.
The total amount of sMerit airdropped was near 600K:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=merit;stats=topsend
In less than a day we already sent more sMerits (11k+) than sources will gain in a month (~8k). Anyone knows how many sMerits have been distributed to existing members?
In less than a day we already sent more sMerits (11k+) than sources will gain in a month (~8k). Anyone knows how many sMerits have been distributed to existing members?
About 600k.
So doing a bit of maths, I make it:
If we update the figures I’ve drawn-up in the pastconcerning sMerit circulation, we get:
600.000 sMerits Initial Airdrop
-350.129 sent sMerits (Merit Sources and regular forum members)
+175.065 Min estimate generated (first halving taken to its maximum theoretical degree, and not accounting for all the other halvings which I cannot estimate)
--------------------------------------------
424.936 Total unsent sMerits (aprox. *)
(*) Not all is really sendable really, due to inactive users, banned users, and so forth.
Now Merit Source pool is currently of 20.855 sMerits per 30 days. Being conservative, and taking into account that the pool size has varies over time, lets say a bare minimum average of 12k has been sent each month since the beginning of the Merit System. That would mean that at least 180.000 of the sent sMerits were originated by Merit Sources .The remaining 170.129 (350.129 – 180.000) would come from the Initial Airdrop and halvings.
So even in the “best” case scenario (no halvings), there are around 600.000 – 170.129 = 429.871 airdropped sMerits in user accounts (*).
After 15 months of the Merit System, I don’t know how likely they are to come into the scene, but they also constitute a risk for merit trading. I would think that, after 15 months on non-usage, they should be withdrawn from the accounts on the basis of avoiding risks and not being into the Merit game anyway.
600.000 sMerits Initial Airdrop
-350.129 sent sMerits (Merit Sources and regular forum members)
+175.065 Min estimate generated (first halving taken to its maximum theoretical degree, and not accounting for all the other halvings which I cannot estimate)
--------------------------------------------
424.936 Total unsent sMerits (aprox. *)
(*) Not all is really sendable really, due to inactive users, banned users, and so forth.
Now Merit Source pool is currently of 20.855 sMerits per 30 days. Being conservative, and taking into account that the pool size has varies over time, lets say a bare minimum average of 12k has been sent each month since the beginning of the Merit System. That would mean that at least 180.000 of the sent sMerits were originated by Merit Sources .The remaining 170.129 (350.129 – 180.000) would come from the Initial Airdrop and halvings.
So even in the “best” case scenario (no halvings), there are around 600.000 – 170.129 = 429.871 airdropped sMerits in user accounts (*).
After 15 months of the Merit System, I don’t know how likely they are to come into the scene, but they also constitute a risk for merit trading. I would think that, after 15 months on non-usage, they should be withdrawn from the accounts on the basis of avoiding risks and not being into the Merit game anyway.
Most of unspent sMerits are really still tied to the initial sMerit airdrop, and although we can only get a rough estimate as I have done above, it does seem unlikely that the core pending airdropped mass will eventually come into circulation.
Sometimes hoarding sMerits happens to some extent, but you can always distribute them as I did at some point, when the sum of my personal earned sMerits was getting rather high: 250 profiles merited (by me) in 1 hour and 2 minutes – What’s got over me?
And for newbies, you will receive more when you spend more. Start spending smerits! 
A newbie is someone that have just 1merit and that means the user have just 0.5 sMerit so how can we spend when a minimum of 1sMerit is required for the transaction to successfully go through. We can not spend what we do not have.
There are thousands of higher ranked members who haven't even spent any of their airdropped sMerits, despite that more than a year passed since release of Merit system.
It was discussed before that smerit will expire, seems Theymos didn't consider this.
It is always good to give merit point, and not "hoarding" it. But for me (maybe you could count me as a senior), it also difficult to find good quality posts. Sometimes people have mistaken good quality posts with posts that comply with their opinion. I like when my sMerit goes to 0, but it took a lot of effort, and I assume merit source also had a similar difficulty.
And for newbies, you will receive more when you spend more. Start spending smerits!
And for newbies, you will receive more when you spend more. Start spending smerits!
Correct me if am wrong I don't think smerit where attached to air dropped merit
While it wasn't directly related to the amount of air dropped merit (ie. it wasn't on a 1:2 ratio like sMerit currently is for earned merit)... sMerit was handed out at the same time as merit was originally air dropped.I believe I received 500 merit (as I was a Hero member at the time)... and received 100 sMerit from memory. The maths seems to sort of back that up.
Quote from: https://bpip.org/profile.aspx?p=HCP
Has given 373 merit 270 times, to 152 profiles ( 2.5 merit/profile)
Has received 784 merit 462 times, from 136 profiles
Has at least 19 sMerit available
(note: not entirely accurate stats as BPIP isn't 100% "live" data)Has received 784 merit 462 times, from 136 profiles
Has at least 19 sMerit available
So, I should have had in total (784/2) sMerit = 392... given away 373 merit... difference of 19... but I actually have over 100 sMerit left.
Despite having 100+, I don't consider myself to be hoarding it (I have given 373 to 152 different users after all), it's just I rarely find posts that I think are "worthy"... despite actively reading through B&H etc looking for posts to merit... and I seem to accumulate at about the rate that I give it away
I can think of few reasons as why new members are hoarding their sendable merits and don't use them.
The first and most obvious is that they are not a well established members and they are here just for their own interest and thus sending merits or leaving feedbacks, whenever they spot a scammer, is not a priority for them and leave it for higher ranked members.
Second reason, they don't know how the system works, maybe they think it will be retrieved from the total of their received merits.
Another reason, they are just selfish or hoarding smerits for future uses like boosting an alt or a friend's account to rank up.
A reminder:
There is currently no decay, but if hoarding seems to become a problem, I might add it.
...
The first and most obvious is that they are not a well established members and they are here just for their own interest and thus sending merits or leaving feedbacks, whenever they spot a scammer, is not a priority for them and leave it for higher ranked members.
Second reason, they don't know how the system works, maybe they think it will be retrieved from the total of their received merits.
Another reason, they are just selfish or hoarding smerits for future uses like boosting an alt or a friend's account to rank up.
A reminder:
So I noticed it says unused Merit can be decayed at some point in the future - What's the point of this? Is it just to keep people from stagnating their Merit and not using it?
There is currently no decay, but if hoarding seems to become a problem, I might add it.
...
Also Forum users have right to keep their sMerits. There are no point to do that, but you simply can't force users to spend their sMerits.
And it's not only problem of low ranked members. There are thousands of higher ranked members who haven't even spent any of their airdropped sMerits, despite that more than a year passed since release of Merit system. And then people are complaining that's difficult to get erit, merit sources aren't giving out enough merits and etc.
As a high ranked member, I also blame myself for not giving out enough sMerits. Sometimes I just too lazy to do that, I know, it's bad. Now I have more than enough sMerits available, I should spend it more actively...
Well if you where giving it's only right to give it out. And am not forcing anyone(even if I where it would still not make some to do so) am just raising awareness some members don't do it deliberately but have not really been drawn to this attention.
Well I hope the message is passed and not twisted. Spending smerit is making the purpose to which it was created working. And the ecosystem of the forum would benefit immensely.
PS. Avoid abusing merit
legendary
Activity: 2450
Merit: 4295
eXch.cx - Automatic crypto Swap Exchange.
There's a myth that higher rank users don't need merits and that myth is mostly spread among the lower rank users, Personally I hardly receive merit from lower rank users although they are those i try to merit the most. The average lower rank users prefer hoarding their smerits instead of sending it out and some possible reasons for this act are;
But they fail to realize just like in the real world, givers never lack. If you want something learn how to give that which you have out. That's my advice to them (those that have at least 1smerit to send).
I remember getting advice on this issue few months back when I was still a member rank user.
- Since they don't get merits on regular basis they won't see the need in sending the same merit they don't get to others.
- Like you have previously guess, they see merit sending as a job for merit sources
- They think the system isn't fair to them therefore they decide not to partake in meriting others
But they fail to realize just like in the real world, givers never lack. If you want something learn how to give that which you have out. That's my advice to them (those that have at least 1smerit to send).
I remember getting advice on this issue few months back when I was still a member rank user.
(2). I should see Smerit as liabilities to myself and an Asset to others and give them away to deserving users
Forum users have right to keep their sMerits. There are no point to do that, but you simply can't force users to spend their sMerits.
And it's not only problem of low ranked members. There are thousands of higher ranked members who haven't even spent any of their airdropped sMerits, despite that more than a year passed since release of Merit system. And then people are complaining that's difficult to get erit, merit sources aren't giving out enough merits and etc.
As a high ranked member, I also blame myself for not giving out enough sMerits. Sometimes I just too lazy to do that, I know, it's bad. Now I have more than enough sMerits available, I should spend it more actively...
And it's not only problem of low ranked members. There are thousands of higher ranked members who haven't even spent any of their airdropped sMerits, despite that more than a year passed since release of Merit system. And then people are complaining that's difficult to get erit, merit sources aren't giving out enough merits and etc.
As a high ranked member, I also blame myself for not giving out enough sMerits. Sometimes I just too lazy to do that, I know, it's bad. Now I have more than enough sMerits available, I should spend it more actively...
Yes, it is true that it is SMERIT (Sendable Merit) and not KMERIT (Keepable Merit) as the title goes. It is his/her reason why keep the merit , for some reason he/she does not reward the poster he/she spotted easily if the poster does not meet the requirement where some forum users have a strict requirements before they hand out their smerit. Eg. 1 smerit = good post, 2 smerit = high quality post 3 = constructive post and 10 smerit = contributed to the forum post. The forum did mentioned already about keeping merit stated that
Quote from: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=merit
There is no point in hoarding sMerit; keeping it yourself does not benefit you
This message would go out to lower rank members. I always commend a good and hard working member of the forum and it's always easy on the eye reading a quality post or comment. Well so many user has really improved on that especially the lower ranking member no matter what you intent may be to make a good post be it merit hunting or not so far is a good post it's always healthy to the forum.
Well the bone of contention is this. The forum has made it so that everyone get a smerit for every two merit they receive this is a circle the forum created. But for some reasons lower rank members has felt giving out merit is totally the duty of merit sources or high ranking members. This perspective is wrong.
You are at the liberty to read a post and if you find it great or interesting rather than rushing to be the first few to comment(strategy to get merit) you can take out time to merit the post if it deserves it.
Always have a selfless act here on the forum every one is entitled to his/her merit but if you think your good contribution should deserve merit so why don't you do the same to other deserving merits.
It's sendable merit not keepable merit
Edited...
For newbies that are still not clear about how meriting works if you check the top far left of the post or comment you find interesting you would see a merit icon click on it then it would direct you effectively.
Well the bone of contention is this. The forum has made it so that everyone get a smerit for every two merit they receive this is a circle the forum created. But for some reasons lower rank members has felt giving out merit is totally the duty of merit sources or high ranking members. This perspective is wrong.
You are at the liberty to read a post and if you find it great or interesting rather than rushing to be the first few to comment(strategy to get merit) you can take out time to merit the post if it deserves it.
Always have a selfless act here on the forum every one is entitled to his/her merit but if you think your good contribution should deserve merit so why don't you do the same to other deserving merits.
It's sendable merit not keepable merit
Edited...
For newbies that are still not clear about how meriting works if you check the top far left of the post or comment you find interesting you would see a merit icon click on it then it would direct you effectively.
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