Topic: Knowledge vs hodlings - page 7. (Read 2594 times)

Surprisingly,  people that tend to hold Bitcoin more are those who understand it from the angle of business with little to no technical knowledge... just the basic knowledge of how to buy and store safely. If you ask them question about the technical aspect of Bitcoin, they will rarely give you a satisfactory answer. Theirs is to buy and secure their fortune because they understand how well Bitcoin will change their lives over certain period of time.


I'm tempted to disagree with you a little because the motivation for the creation of Bitcoin was digital money that will not be controlled by a singe entity. So, if people joined Bitcoin because they feel they can make money from it, then they are very much welcomed and it is good for the Bitcoin ecosystem.

Have you imagined what will become of Bitcoin if fresh money stop flowing into it? We need both the technical guys and investors to make the Bitcoin market liquid and better. We don't have to be emotional about it, without monetary gains, more than half of the people in Bitcoin will disappear. 

The first rule of using a machine is to know how to run it. If you have no idea on how to operate the machine, then you can do nothing. The same thing applies to everything around us, including Bitcoin learning. You need to know the concept of Bitcoin, how it works, what it was made for, what are the pros and cons of Bitcoin. You need to learn every good and bad things about Bitcoin in order to really understand what bitcoin really is.

People these days only join Bitcoin for making money. They invest in Bitcoin without knowing nothing about it. They may have heard that they can make money by investing in Bitcoin and that's why they are here. Not all of them, but most of them are. And this is very bad for the Bitcoin ecosystem. These people are the ones who will make a loss in Bitcoin investment for not knowing enough and then go on and say that Bitcoin is a scam. So yeah, having knowledge about what you are dealing with is always the best way to approach anything.

I am not going to deny that part of the dilemma is likely trying to figure out how much does any of us need to know prior to taking some kind of action in regards towards taking some kind of a stake, even if it is a somewhat relatively whimpy stake.

So yeah, if you had already had $25k that you could have invested into bitcoin in 2016, then it probably would not have had been a whole lot of skin off of your back to just somewhat blindly put $5k to $8.5k into bitcoin without a whole hell of a lot of studying and then just studied it along the way in order to figure out if you were going to take any kind of further stake, rather than taking no stake.. but sure, hindsight is 20/20.. and I am trying NOT to slip into that kind of a fallacy in terms of knowing what to do based on what had happened after 2016... so in that regard, DCA'ing might have been better, even if you had a $25k reserve that was then available to you... but in order to know how aggressive that you would have had been able to be, you have to take into account a lot more about your own situation, including at minimum your cashflow, your other investments, your risk tolerance, your time line and a few other factors.

I was actually in a similar situation in late 2013 when I had gotten into bitcoin.  I had some extra cash that I had already started to invest starting in about September/October 2013, and so by the time that I got into studying bitcoin in November 2013, I was already ready to put some of my extra money to work.. but there still was a bit of a problem in regards to how I was going to enter.. and so surely I was a bit worried at the time that I had first seen coin because it was approaching a 100x price increase for the whole year, so almost anyone can end up coming into an investment like that with hesitation at least in terms of the lump sum investing angle.. so therefore, I just decided to start out with DCA'ing and buying on dips rather than lump-summing .. but by the time we got towards the end of 2014, I was also trying to consider ways of lump-summing too... because I had ended up holding some of my cash coming in on reserves and even some of my investments from late 2013 were coming to their 1 year time frame by the end of 2014, so in that regard, I considered that I could use some of that money at the end of 2014 to lump sum into bitcoin.

But still it is a matter of proportion and when anyone gets started, there likely needs to continue to be learning along the way, especially if you might have done a quickie study in the beginning rather than an in-depth study when first starting out.


I don't disagree with anything that you are saying, but for sure, the vast majority of people have difficulties investing for long periods of time, especially 100 years, and sure I understand that you are mostly just making a point that bitcoin is likely good for 100 years or more, but normies are likely going to be thinking in much shorter time periods, and it is difficult enough to suggest that they invest into something like bitcoin for 4-10 years or longer, and surely depending on how someone invests, whether DCAing, lump sum or buying on dips, there are likely going to be some preferences to stay into bitcoin for at least a couple of cycles to really start to be able to feel some of the likely ongoing compounding growth effects.. while at the same time,  some of the devils in the details in regards to some personal details in regards to how much value they are able to invest into bitcoin, and many times, people do not really have lump sum funds available to them and they might also not have their shit together very well in terms of making sure that they have their cashflow covered (their income versus their expenses.. and also having an emergency fund in place)... ..so even if we might consider that bitcoin is a kind of asset that will likely continue to grow, then a somewhat prudent (even though aggressive) investment style into it might still end up accelerating options for retirement and even early retirement... but it still could take many years to play out, and surely if someone is already at retirement age  then they have less abilities to enjoy the possible and potential compounding effects of bitcoin that are not guaranteed, but are part of the factors to consider when determining how aggressive to attempt to be in terms of both bitcoin accumulation methods and position size target considerations.


Fuck shitcoins.

You need a whole other level of analysis if you are going to talk about shitcoins in this thread or figuring out if you should invest into that crap.

You did not use the word bitcoin once in your post, so if you are talking about bitcoin then your analysis and need for studying into particulars is going to be from a different perspective versus if you have hardly any clue regarding what is bitcoin, so you are using dumbass and vague terms such as "crypto" in order to talk about bitcoin, which likely demonstrates that you have hardly any clue about what you are talking about.


For sure 1% would be way too whimpy of an allocation into bitcoin if someone is saying that he had $25k in cash that he could have invested into bitcoin in 2016...

When someone is suggesting to invest 1% to 25% into bitcoin from your investment portfolio, usually your investment portfolio is not going to be 99% cash.. and even if you choose 20% to 40% in cash (or cash equivalents), there are likely going to be other quasi-liquid assets in your investment portfolio.. sure a personal residence is not very liquid, but there could be some level of quasi-liquid value that is represented by it.. especially in terms of equity that might be available through it.


Anyone who might have concluded that s/he has some kind of an investment target to start into bitcoin right now will still have to make the various calculations regarding how much to invest and the methods and timeline to accumulate BTC in order to reach his/her BTC accumulation targets, whether s/he wants to reach 1%-25% allocation or some other allocation, and over what period of time does s/he want to engage in such an accumulation process. 

The answers are going to vary, and even if many of us consider the current BTC price to be relatively low (for a variety of reasons), it could take a bit of time for a newbie to come to similar conclusions in terms of weighing the values of lump suming versus various forms of DCA'ing and/or buying on dips (if any).

I personally would attempt to make plans that involve each of the types of BTC accumulation of DCA, lump summing and buying on dips, and surely someone with $25k today might be able to divide it into 3 and put 1/3 in each of the categories, or maybe s/he might attempt to error on the side of being more aggressive and lump summing a higher portion of it, which surely would depend on his/her current cashflow situation and the status of other investments and even having an emergency fund.

I still feel that knowledge and skills and experience should be balanced in this regard.
Indeed, we will be reckless when doing something without knowledge but on the other hand, when we only struggle with knowledge and only stick to theory but without action carried out as a form of skill, it will also only be bland because it has a shell but the contents are empty considering that we only understand the theory but do not understand when applying the theory we have.

Do not forget that there are some conditions that will definitely occur when we start practicing and it will not be the same as the theory (knowledge) that we rely on as our material to try. In the end, when we only dabble in theory, our talk may lead to academic matters but we will not have anything if we do not dare to try and experience firsthand which makes knowledge with all kinds of theories useless.

rachael19385, you got and misunderstood my point here. I am not saying anything about short term investment. If you like you can hold your bitcoin for 100 years, someday you must sell to make profit because profit is the real reason why everyone is investing in bitcoin and believes that bitcoin will give good profit at the long run, maybe after 10yrs. This was why I stated 'sell' as part of the basic knowledge one need and also, one must buy your bitcoin through p2p from an exchange either centralized or decentralized. Bitcoin does not fall from heaven neither most investors are miners. So, the major most common way that people who are not being paid with bitcoin can get bitcoin is by purchase.

Come to talk about patience, most anyone learn how to be patience or does knowledge brings patience NO. Patience is a practice in which you put in when you have a big goal to achieve especially when you know that it will take a very long time before you can achieve it. For example, it is just like you want to buy a house of $20,000, and all you can save for the month is $100. If you know how important shelter is, then you can choose to start saving $100 in for 20 months for you to be able to buy the house, and with this your goal and target, you know that you must wait till 20 months with steady saving of $100, meaning because you know the benefit of owning a house you must be patient till the money is complete.

This is how bitcoin too is, and that was where you got me wrong, i said that you must have a target and work towards accumulating you bitcoin target disregard of whether you have the major knowledge of bitcoin or not, what matters is that you have started and you have a goal to achieve, because one of the basic knowledge of bitcoin is that it is a long term investment, and long term investment goes with patience.

You are wrong on this mate, as long as I have plans to save my money, and every month I assign my savings to buy bitcoin, I don't need any knowledge to discipline me on doing this regular, rather what I need is discipline on making sure that I buy whenever I get my pay cheque, because I am not even concerned about the price of bitcoin either if it is dumping or pumping because as soon as i get my pay cheque, I also have a fraction that I assign to save in bitcoin. Do anyone needs a vast knowledge on how to save fiat currency in banks..NO

DCAing don't need any big knowledge than your own plan of how much you will use on DCAing based on your income and how you can make sure that you don't get distracted with your accumulating strategy, which is a personal decision.

It is better to have the basic knowledge and then go into investment to that this will make you have a concrete knowledge through experience of the market movement as long as you are not planning to make quick money from your investment but to hodli for long, which becomes the best way to learn faster because you are learning at ease and will learn a lot. I know of someone that just bought bitcoin and decided to go and study on cybersecurity to enable him to keep his coins safe, because he understands that learning can be done anytime but investment should be done earlier.

Having the opportunity to have $25,000 in 2016 when the bitcoin price was still around $500-$700 is a rare opportunity.
I only got into crypto at the beginning of 2016 and only became active and focused in 2017.

If you buy with 1% of the funds you have at that time, of course, you will get a profit.
But can you hold it until now?

Even though at that time Bitcoin was quite hyped and Bitcoin was the undoubted king of coins.
But indeed bitcoin still doesn't have as much power as it does today.

There will be no loss if you go into Bitcoin investment, as long as you don't go into shitcoin investment which will definitely be a lot of losses.

Fix the past by starting to buy Bitcoin at a good opportunity right now.
Chances are you won't see cheap prices like now.

    Doing Dyor is because you have the knowledge that, through it, you can determine if a coin or crypto you want to buy has potential or not. That's why we research, we know, and because of this, while we are doing it, we are also able to get a new idea about it, to be honest.

   So it is really important that in all the aspects that we will do here in the crypto space, we have enough knowledge so that all the assets that we want to hold, whether short- or long-term, are not wasted. Because this is where the future savings we hope for in the crypto space depend.

Knowledge is the only path to success in every field, not just investing in bitcoin. But I think we only need to have basic knowledge, then to make everything more perfect we should combine knowledge and practice at the same time. I mean, we don't need to spend too much time learning everything until we understand it all before investing. If we do so, we can easily miss good investment opportunities.
For example, if currently we only focus on accumulating knowledge and not investing while this is the perfect time to buy bitcoin because the price is quite cheap. If you are too rigid and keep learning without investing, when the price increase season comes, you will miss your opportunity. If you have knowledge but don't know how to seize opportunities, it will be difficult to succeed.

We only need basic knowledge, and then invest in bitcoin and during that holding period, take advantage of it to understand more about bitcoin. Theory will only be effective when you apply it in parallel with practice.

I was scared to invest and HODL Bitcoin since 2016 simply because I didn't have a deep knowledge about it but I paid dearly for it. If I say I have not regretted it till now, I will be telling lies. This is because I have at least $25,000 I can easily afford to invest in Bitcoin then but failed to do so since I was waiting for the right time to first learn and fully understand what I wanted to commit my money to, just like what @DubemIfedigbo001 tried to debunk, but he was wrong due to the increasing popularity of Bitcoin and neglected the fact that the more your affinity to taking risks, the better you might make it.

For instance, those who didn't have any deep knowledge about Bitcoin in the past years but risked based on its popularity and the good projects are now multimillions today. Some are even billionaires since they rather see the good in the project than find the best/deepest knowledge possible about it. To make matters worse, I was busy from the 2016 cycle till 2020 and missed out at the same time on the investment despite using Bitcoin for many financial transactions since 2014 for various inflow and outflow payments. That was so lame, and I saw myself as the fool in the Bitcoin investment but I ain't no more. This is why I advise anyone that if it's the context of "Bitcoin" that is the subject matter, they should invest even before they think when they hear others sharing testimonies and see a good prospect in it, or not think too much before they invest, you don't have to know everything. This is not a shitcoin that you can be afraid of, it's a well-planned and created asset that has been inculcated into the main financial stream of the world market, it can't be a bad idea to own your coin and continue to acquire more as it's never going to be a bad business for anymore in the long run. Bitcoin is such an asset that in the next 100 years or thereabout, it can be at over $1,000,000 per BTC, so why the fear?

You probably are wrong because you are taking such an adamant position.  There is all kind of knowledge with which newbie no coiners will come into the bitcoin space, and so it should be difficult to be attempting to describe exactly what kind of knowledge that they would need to have in order to begin their BTC investment journey.

Yeah, the one year old baby does not know shit about shit, but even if we start to get to the age of 12 year olds, there can be quite a bit of variation in terms of maturity and/or even worldliness.

So yeah, if we might be presuming that our intended audience of newbie bitcoin buyers are adults, we cannot even necessarily do that, but it becomes more likely that older people are going to have more varied experiences in their lives in regards, to investing and just life experiences, but some older people might have learned some bad habits too.. and it could be more difficult for an older person to get out  of a bad habit than to get a younger person to avoid getting into that bad habit even though they might make some similar kinds of mistakes as the older person, but at the same time, they might be in a position in which they are more ready, willing and able to  learn how to change some of their habits that had led to the mistake in order that they are able to build some of their investment with a more informed approach.

And, I am not even trying to get caught into any kind of expectation that young people are more adaptable than older people, because sometimes the stubborness of old people might create barriers in which they won't even end up going as deeply into shitcoins as a younger person might end up doing.

So there is going to be all kinds of variations regarding the kinds of knowledge that people come into bitcoin with and which parts they might need to know before getting started rather then just getting started based on what they already know.. and working from there with an actively investing into bitcoin rather than putting learning barriers in front of themselves that might not even be necessary as long as they moderate their position size and their beginning approach in such a way that it is already anticipating that they have to be learning as they go.


Surely anyone who starts investing into bitcoin earlier is going to be in a better position to deal with any spike to $100k that might come, even though surely sometimes people do get into bitcoin, and it takes them a while (maybe even 1-2 years) just to build up their BTC position, so some of the high volatility in their first couple of years investing can be challenging to their own thinking and approach in regards to whether whatever they are doing is the right them, and perhaps some of the strong volatility will throw them off too, but I still think that anyone who is in bitcoin is going to be able to be in a better position to attempt to learn from the craziness rather than someone sitting on the sidelines without much if any stake in bitcoin.


On the surface, that sounds correct.


That does not make very much sense.  You could have no idea about sex, but you could go around and have as much sex with as many people as you can, without any kind of knowledge, and that will result in kids.. so I doubt that having kids is pointless... even if they might have had resulted from doing things without much if any knowledge...


ditto.. same point.


Well if you invest without knowledge, your having had invested might inspire you to learn more, and after a day, you might become motivated to learn more or to take some kinds of actions based on your previous action to invest (or buy some).

You believe that you know exactly what is going to happen when someone buys bitcoin merely because their level of knowledge might be different from someone else's?


What is that supposed to mean?  It might not be positive to be fucking around and waiting rather than  acting... acting has the ability to inspire learning.


People are motivated by all kinds of things, and some people purposefully do the opposite of others because they "want to be their own person."  Some people rely on various kinds of role models.. and sometimes they might not realize if the role model that they chose is actually going to be good for them, but I would imagine that everyone tries to make decision based on the knowledge that they have, and sometimes they later figure out that they made a lot of mistakes... and some of those mistakes might not be reversible, including decisions not to act (such as decisions not to buy bitcoin and to wait the fuck around, and then 5 years or more passes, and they failed/refused to act).

Yes, everyone is responsible for his/her own decisions including his/her decisions to follow someone else and also his her decision whether to act or not, and how to act.


You seem to have things backwards JoyMarsha.  It is probably best to learn about bitcoin first, and yeah maybe there might be some needs to be able to see that shitcoins also exist... but whatever, you might not need to get too bogged down into various details about bitcoin versus shitcoins in order to get started investing into bitcoin.  

You could get started investing into bitcoin, and then maybe learn some things about shitcoins as you go or at a later date.  why would there be any need or rush to learn about shitcoins beyond merely just recognizing that shitcoins exist, they are out there and they are engaging in various affinity scams in reference to bitcoin.  Sure maybe you could learn more about them later, but seems optional rather than anything that any bitcoin newbie investor needs to really get into figuring out.


That sounds alright in theory, but I am not really sure if you are saying much of anything.


hopefully no one is investing in crypto.  I don't even know what that is. It is some amorphous and misleading idea that doesn't really mean anything right?  Hopefully people are not investing into crypto (or shitcoins) and instead they are at least starting out by focusing in bitcoin first and not getting caught up in gobble-dee-gook language and meaningless terms like crypto.   Who the fuck knows what crypto is?  But if you talk about investing into bitcoin, then at least you are talking about something.. now if you want to get involved in various shitcoins, that's a whole other rabbit hole.. and hopefully people are careful about getting involved in the shitcoin kinds of nonsense... especially newbies.


Fuck shitcoins.


Focus on bitcoin first might be the better way to lessen any likelihood of getting distracted by scammers, especially folks who use dumbass and vague terms (such as crypto) to describe whatever it is that they are investing into rather than being specific about what it is that they are talking about and/or investing into.


Yes we can "overstretch" and overly state the idea of needing to know before getting started in bitcoin.  

Almost all the forum members in this thread are making the same dumb and vague statements about needing to know in advance... blah blah blah.


Act first and figure it out as you go.