Ledger Live Nano missing btc - page 2.

jeje10036

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Quote from: HCP on March 30, 2020, 06:14:42 PM

Things that spring to mind:

1. "Gap Limit" issue... if the original accounts were setup using the Chrome App and NOT Ledger Live, it's possible the coins were sent to an address past the gap limit or even a change address (if selected from the drop down menu instead of using "receive" tab)

2. Valid but incorrect seed... there have been instances in the past where users have managed to get seeds confused and use a wallet for a while but have a seed written down that doesn't match that particular wallet. Not likely given OPs claim that this is their only wallet.

3. Multiple "Accounts" within Ledger... 1st account is currently empty, so Ledger Live might not see if coins were sent to "2nd" accounts. Could test using Electrum and specifying 2nd or subsequent accounts in derivation path (ie. m/49'/0'/1')

4. "Forked" accounts? I know that there were all sorts of crazy things happening when the BCH fork first happened with the "split" accounts in Ledger Chrome App... I'm not sure if Ledger Live still looks for these? Was the device originally configured/setup within Chrome App or Ledger Live? Huh

3. That's an interesting one. I did have 2 accounts, although each did have coins in them. I'll try to edit the derivation path to your specs and see how that goes.

As for 1 and 4 they the accounts were set up using a Ledger Live app and not a chrome one.

2. Has been suggested a lot although I am 99% certain that I have the right seeds, I'll keep that in mind as a possibility. If all else fails I'll have to do a btrecovery or something.

I appreciate the suggestions.

HCP

legendary

Activity: 2086

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Things that spring to mind:

1. "Gap Limit" issue... if the original accounts were setup using the Chrome App and NOT Ledger Live, it's possible the coins were sent to an address past the gap limit or even a change address (if selected from the drop down menu instead of using "receive" tab)

2. Valid but incorrect seed... there have been instances in the past where users have managed to get seeds confused and use a wallet for a while but have a seed written down that doesn't match that particular wallet. Not likely given OPs claim that this is their only wallet.

3. Multiple "Accounts" within Ledger... 1st account is currently empty, so Ledger Live might not see if coins were sent to "2nd" accounts. Could test using Electrum and specifying 2nd or subsequent accounts in derivation path (ie. m/49'/0'/1')

4. "Forked" accounts? I know that there were all sorts of crazy things happening when the BCH fork first happened with the "split" accounts in Ledger Chrome App... I'm not sure if Ledger Live still looks for these? Was the device originally configured/setup within Chrome App or Ledger Live? Huh

DireWolfM14

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Quote from: jeje10036 on March 29, 2020, 12:08:34 PM

The current accounts showing have no transactions. I've tried importing the csv to check logs and they're empty. No portfolio activity. When I initially transferred coins to my wallet I made 2 accounts on the nano. Each with its own separate transaction from the exchange.

Ledger would have imported those accounts if you had the correct seed.

Quote from: jeje10036 on March 29, 2020, 12:08:34 PM

So that means that even though the address being shown when I hit the "receive" tab is different from the initial coin transfer address from a year ago, they should all be a part of the same account? If that's so shouldn't the balance be correctly populated?

Correct. When you click "receive" in Ledger Live it will display the next unused address. Most wallets behave similarly.

In your case, whether you sent bitcoin to two separate addresses in the same account, or whether you created two accounts and sent bitcoin to one address in each, Ledger Live would display your entire balance if you had the right seed phrase.

jeje10036

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Activity: 14

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Quote from: DireWolfM14 on March 29, 2020, 11:36:35 AM

Quote from: jeje10036 on March 29, 2020, 11:12:51 AM

When I try to add bitcoin accounts through LL I get an error in the process saying "Can't add a new account before you've received on your Bitcoin 1 (native segwit) account".

If you use Electrum you can open the other accounts, but that may not be necessary. Does the account you have access to right now show any transactions from the past? Was this your account, and do remember creating multiple accounts in Ledger Live? If not then your accounts and derivation path are not likely to help.

If you want to check anyway, download Electrum from here, and here only: https://electrum.org/#download
Here's a tutorial on how to verify the download, a very important step when using Electrum: https://bitcoinelectrum.com/how-to-verify-your-electrum-download/
Here's Ledger's tutorial on how to use your Nano with Electrum: https://support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/115005161925-Set-up-and-use-Electrum

Quote from: jeje10036 on March 29, 2020, 11:19:59 AM

It could seem like a possibility there's not much else to explain this situation. But to the best of my knowledge I'm sure I have the correct seed words. This is my first and only crypto account and I was careful to check a few times while writing them down.

There's still much hope. Compare the words you wrote down to the words in the Bip39 word list. Look for any words similar to yours that you may have mistaken when writing down the seed phrase.

Bip39 word list: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0039/bip-0039-wordlists.md

Quote from: Csmiami on March 29, 2020, 11:07:39 AM

I'm not sure as to how Ledger works, but is it possible that when he restored, the address with funds was "archived" or something similar, and that's why when clicking on "Receive" he is seeing a different one?

Similar to electrum using new addresses every time you click "receive"

Quote from: jeje10036 on March 29, 2020, 11:19:59 AM

I think you read the situation correctly. I initially sent the coins from exchange to wallet early last year. I've had no problems accessing and checking the balance. But yesterday when I plugged my nano to ledger it prompted a firmware update and reset my device. So I "restored" my wallet and now the balance is 0.

So I did hear somewhere that addresses are reset similar to what you said about electrum. But the correct balance seems to exist on the "old" address when I check blockchain explorer.

That's not how hierarchical deterministic wallets work. Each HD wallet can generate large numbers of wallet addresses, but they are all part of a single account. You can generate multiple accounts by modifying the derivation paths. All accounts will have different addresses.

The situation you describe would put all the funds into one single account, and Ledger Live would show a balance if there were funds in any of it's addresses.

The current accounts showing have no transactions. I've tried importing the csv to check logs and they're empty. No portfolio activity. When I initially transferred coins to my wallet I made 2 accounts on the nano. Each with its own separate transaction from the exchange.

So that means that even though the address being shown when I hit the "receive" tab is different from the initial coin transfer address from a year ago, they should all be a part of the same account? If that's so shouldn't the balance be correctly populated?

I will look into electrum as my option after checking with the bips and resetting my wallet one more time.

Thanks for the clarification.

jeje10036

newbie

Activity: 14

Merit: 8

Quote from: o_e_l_e_o on March 29, 2020, 11:32:16 AM

Quote from: jeje10036 on March 29, 2020, 11:12:51 AM

When I try to add bitcoin accounts through LL I get an error in the process saying "Can't add a new account before you've received on your Bitcoin 1 (native segwit) account".

So your addresses are of the non-native segwit type if they begin with a 3. Will it allow you to add a second non-native segwit account? Note you are not trying to add a brand new account, but to import an account which already exists.

Quote from: jeje10036 on March 29, 2020, 11:19:59 AM

Could the keys shine some light in this situation?

No, they won't provide any additional information.

The next step is likely importing your seed to Electrum to find your coins.

Thank you. The only way I know how to add any new account brand new or preexisting is through "add account" under "accounts" tab in LL. And that yields the same result.

DireWolfM14

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Quote from: jeje10036 on March 29, 2020, 11:12:51 AM

When I try to add bitcoin accounts through LL I get an error in the process saying "Can't add a new account before you've received on your Bitcoin 1 (native segwit) account".

If you use Electrum you can open the other accounts, but that may not be necessary. Does the account you have access to right now show any transactions from the past? Was this your account, and do remember creating multiple accounts in Ledger Live? If not then your accounts and derivation path are not likely to help.

If you want to check anyway, download Electrum from here, and here only: https://electrum.org/#download
Here's a tutorial on how to verify the download, a very important step when using Electrum: https://bitcoinelectrum.com/how-to-verify-your-electrum-download/
Here's Ledger's tutorial on how to use your Nano with Electrum: https://support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/115005161925-Set-up-and-use-Electrum

Quote from: jeje10036 on March 29, 2020, 11:19:59 AM

It could seem like a possibility there's not much else to explain this situation. But to the best of my knowledge I'm sure I have the correct seed words. This is my first and only crypto account and I was careful to check a few times while writing them down.

There's still much hope. Compare the words you wrote down to the words in the Bip39 word list. Look for any words similar to yours that you may have mistaken when writing down the seed phrase.

Bip39 word list: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0039/bip-0039-wordlists.md

Quote from: Csmiami on March 29, 2020, 11:07:39 AM

I'm not sure as to how Ledger works, but is it possible that when he restored, the address with funds was "archived" or something similar, and that's why when clicking on "Receive" he is seeing a different one?

Similar to electrum using new addresses every time you click "receive"

Quote from: jeje10036 on March 29, 2020, 11:19:59 AM

I think you read the situation correctly. I initially sent the coins from exchange to wallet early last year. I've had no problems accessing and checking the balance. But yesterday when I plugged my nano to ledger it prompted a firmware update and reset my device. So I "restored" my wallet and now the balance is 0.

So I did hear somewhere that addresses are reset similar to what you said about electrum. But the correct balance seems to exist on the "old" address when I check blockchain explorer.

That's not how hierarchical deterministic wallets work. Each HD wallet can generate large numbers of wallet addresses, but they are all part of a single account. You can generate multiple accounts by modifying the derivation paths. All accounts will have different addresses.

The situation you describe would put all the funds into one single account, and Ledger Live would show a balance if there were funds in any of it's addresses.

o_e_l_e_o

legendary

Activity: 2268

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Quote from: jeje10036 on March 29, 2020, 11:12:51 AM

When I try to add bitcoin accounts through LL I get an error in the process saying "Can't add a new account before you've received on your Bitcoin 1 (native segwit) account".

So your addresses are of the non-native segwit type if they begin with a 3. Will it allow you to add a second non-native segwit account? Note you are not trying to add a brand new account, but to import an account which already exists.

Quote from: jeje10036 on March 29, 2020, 11:19:59 AM

Could the keys shine some light in this situation?

No, they won't provide any additional information.

The next step is likely importing your seed to Electrum to find your coins.

jeje10036

newbie

Activity: 14

Merit: 8

Quote from: Csmiami on March 29, 2020, 11:07:39 AM

Quote from: DireWolfM14 on March 29, 2020, 10:57:48 AM

I think Csmiami is asking whether you confirmed if you had written down the seed phrase correctly when you first initialized your Ledger

Not at all, I had misread the situation... I thought that he had sent the coins from exchange to wallet, then restored the wallet and then the coins were missing. "addresses don't match" kinda confused me; sorry for creating some confusion and I guess a most likely panic attack on the OP.

I'm not sure as to how Ledger works, but is it possible that when he restored, the address with funds was "archived" or something similar, and that's why when clicking on "Receive" he is seeing a different one?

Similar to electrum using new addresses every time you click "receive"

I think you read the situation correctly. I initially sent the coins from exchange to wallet early last year. I've had no problems accessing and checking the balance. But yesterday when I plugged my nano to ledger it prompted a firmware update and reset my device. So I "restored" my wallet and now the balance is 0.

So I did hear somewhere that addresses are reset similar to what you said about electrum. But the correct balance seems to exist on the "old" address when I check blockchain explorer.

jeje10036

newbie

Activity: 14

Merit: 8

Quote from: DireWolfM14 on March 29, 2020, 10:57:48 AM

Quote from: jeje10036 on March 29, 2020, 10:50:14 AM

That's alarming. When I made the initial transfer I checked the balance on my ledger live and had no issues. I can check the transaction details on my exchange and those addresses matched up just fine before with the nano. I initially hit the receive tab on ledger live to get my address and verified with the hardware, then used the native copy to clipboard button on the ledger live to input on the exchange.

I think Csmiami is asking whether you confirmed if you had written down the seed phrase correctly when you first initialized your Ledger. It's a good habit to get into to verify your seed phrase right after you create it. There are many ways to verify the phrase, I do so by recording a couple of the public keys, then resetting the wallet and restoring it using the seed I just created. The addresses I recorded and the addresses in the wallet should match after restoration.

Your current situation could be caused by one of the words in your seed phrase being incorrect. You may have written the wrong word on your paper backup, or your backup might be correct, but you're typing one of the words wrong. For example, I've had trouble with library and liberty in the past. Luckily had written the right word on my paper backup, but I kept reading it wrong when I entered it into the wallet.

It could seem like a possibility there's not much else to explain this situation. But to the best of my knowledge I'm sure I have the correct seed words. This is my first and only crypto account and I was careful to check a few times while writing them down. Although I've never recorded the public keys. I didn't know that I had access to them... Could the keys shine some light in this situation?

jeje10036

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Activity: 14

Merit: 8

Quote from: o_e_l_e_o on March 29, 2020, 11:04:52 AM

There is a 1 in 256 chance you could be entering one of the words incorrectly and still passing the checksum, so this is highly unlikely. Therefore, if your seed phrase was accepted by the Ledger, then chances are that it is correct.

Can you confirm that you previously viewed your original address (which has bitcoins on it) in Ledger Live, and it all looked correct (and you didn't just view it on a block explorer)?

There are two possibilities which occur to me as potential explanations for what is happening here:

Firstly, did you previously use a passphrase on the Ledger Nano (this is different to the password you can use to unlock Ledger Live, and the PIN you use to unlock the Nano)? If you did, you must use the exact same passphrase again to access the same accounts and addresses.

Secondly, your original bitcoin address was in a different account or derivation path to the default one. This may be solvable by trying to add additional bitcoin accounts in Ledger Live, or it may need you to import your seed to another wallet where you can manually try different derivation paths. Try adding additional accounts first.

Yes I did verify on my ledger live. It was the only app I used to check my portfolio throughout 2019 and I had no issues with my balance.

I don't recall setting a passphrase. And it doesn't prompt me to unlock either nano or ledger live using a passphrase. Just the PIN for the device and password for LL.

When I try to add bitcoin accounts through LL I get an error in the process saying "Can't add a new account before you've received on your Bitcoin 1 (native segwit) account".

Csmiami

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Quote from: DireWolfM14 on March 29, 2020, 10:57:48 AM

I think Csmiami is asking whether you confirmed if you had written down the seed phrase correctly when you first initialized your Ledger

Not at all, I had misread the situation... I thought that he had sent the coins from exchange to wallet, then restored the wallet and then the coins were missing. "addresses don't match" kinda confused me; sorry for creating some confusion and I guess a most likely panic attack on the OP.

I'm not sure as to how Ledger works, but is it possible that when he restored, the address with funds was "archived" or something similar, and that's why when clicking on "Receive" he is seeing a different one?

Similar to electrum using new addresses every time you click "receive"

o_e_l_e_o

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 18711

There is a 1 in 256 chance you could be entering one of the words incorrectly and still passing the checksum, so this is highly unlikely. Therefore, if your seed phrase was accepted by the Ledger, then chances are that it is correct.

Can you confirm that you previously viewed your original address (which has bitcoins on it) in Ledger Live, and it all looked correct (and you didn't just view it on a block explorer)?

There are two possibilities which occur to me as potential explanations for what is happening here:

Firstly, did you previously use a passphrase on the Ledger Nano (this is different to the password you can use to unlock Ledger Live, and the PIN you use to unlock the Nano)? If you did, you must use the exact same passphrase again to access the same accounts and addresses.

Secondly, your original bitcoin address was in a different account or derivation path to the default one. This may be solvable by trying to add additional bitcoin accounts in Ledger Live, or it may need you to import your seed to another wallet where you can manually try different derivation paths. Try adding additional accounts first.

DireWolfM14

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Quote from: jeje10036 on March 29, 2020, 10:50:14 AM

That's alarming. When I made the initial transfer I checked the balance on my ledger live and had no issues. I can check the transaction details on my exchange and those addresses matched up just fine before with the nano. I initially hit the receive tab on ledger live to get my address and verified with the hardware, then used the native copy to clipboard button on the ledger live to input on the exchange.

I think Csmiami is asking whether you confirmed if you had written down the seed phrase correctly when you first initialized your Ledger. It's a good habit to get into to verify your seed phrase right after you create it. There are many ways to verify the phrase, I do so by recording a couple of the bitcoin addresses, then resetting the wallet and restoring it using the seed I just created. The addresses I recorded and the addresses in the wallet should match after restoration.

Your current situation could be caused by one of the words in your seed phrase being incorrect. You may have written the wrong word on your paper backup, or your backup might be correct, but you're typing one of the words wrong. For example, I've had trouble with library and liberty in the past. Luckily had written the right word on my paper backup, but I kept reading it wrong when I entered it into the wallet.

jeje10036

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Activity: 14

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Quote from: Csmiami on March 29, 2020, 10:29:58 AM

Quote from: jeje10036 on March 28, 2020, 11:55:33 PM

I've checked the receive address and compared to the address I initially sent the bitcoin to from my exchange and they are different.

How did you check the addresses at the moment of sending the funds to the wallet? And how did you input it on the exchange? For what I've read so far on the topic, you may had had some malware on your browser that changed the receiving address to one that's not yours.

That's alarming. When I made the initial transfer I checked the balance on my ledger live and had no issues. I can check the transaction details on my exchange and those addresses matched up just fine before with the nano. I initially hit the receive tab on ledger live to get my address and verified with the hardware, then used the native copy to clipboard button on the ledger live to input on the exchange.

Csmiami

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Quote from: jeje10036 on March 28, 2020, 11:55:33 PM

I've checked the receive address and compared to the address I initially sent the bitcoin to from my exchange and they are different.

How did you check the addresses at the moment of sending the funds to the wallet? And how did you input it on the exchange? For what I've read so far on the topic, you may had had some malware on your browser that changed the receiving address to one that's not yours.

jeje10036

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Quote from: Pmalek on March 29, 2020, 04:13:13 AM

If you checked your address/addresses on an explorer and the balance is correct, that is a good thing. You could have made a mistake and entered a wrong word while restoring your wallet. Are you 100% sure you used the correct words and sequence? Go back and check the words again and make sure they are correct. If you enter a different word or sequence, you will see a completely different set of addresses with 0 balance.

That's a big relief to hear. I did manually reset my nano for a second time and reentered the words just in case and I had no issues. The result was the same though. And it still shows a 0 balance on my bitcoin account.

Interestingly though every time I reset the nano and reinstall the bitcoin app its coming up with the same address with a 0 btc balance. It doesn't seem random but I can't understand why it changed from the initial address that had was on the nano pre update.

jeje10036

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Quote from: o_e_l_e_o on March 29, 2020, 02:43:07 AM

We'll need a bit more information to help you out first.

At any point during the upgrade process did you have to re-enter your 24 word seed phrase? If you did, are you sure you entered it correctly?

On Ledger Live, try adding a new bitcoin account and ensure there are no previously used accounts there that you have simply forgotten to add.

What is the first character of your old receiving address (the one with the BTC present)? What is the first character of your new receiving address?

Yes. So I did re-enter the seed when ledger live prompted me to manually reset the nano. I entered the 24 words and set a new password. Everything went smoothly. Yet same result with 0 balance.

The first character is 3 for my initial receiving address was 3. Since the update after installing the bitcoin apps I have both a segwit and native segwit account. Of course both 0 balances. The native segwit beings with a 'b' and the segwit begins with a '3' as well.

Pmalek

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If you checked your address/addresses on an explorer and the balance is correct, that is a good thing. You could have made a mistake and entered a wrong word while restoring your wallet. Are you 100% sure you used the correct words and sequence? Go back and check the words again and make sure they are correct. If you enter a different word or sequence, you will see a completely different set of addresses with 0 balance.

o_e_l_e_o

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 18711

We'll need a bit more information to help you out first.

At any point during the upgrade process did you have to re-enter your 24 word seed phrase? If you did, are you sure you entered it correctly?

On Ledger Live, try adding a new bitcoin account and ensure there are no previously used accounts there that you have simply forgotten to add.

What is the first character of your old receiving address (the one with the BTC present)? What is the first character of your new receiving address?

jeje10036

newbie

Activity: 14

Merit: 8

I hadn't checked my nano in a while so upon firing up my ledger live it prompted me to update my nano firmware. I followed the instructions. Since it wasn't a brand new device and had bitcoin on it I chose the option "restore my device".

After installing bitcoin apps, under my portfolio the account has a 0 balance!

I've checked the receive address and compared to the address I initially sent the bitcoin to from my exchange and they are different. If I go to blockchain.com and the blockchain explorer the initial address has the exact amount of btc that should be in my wallet right now. And of course if I check the current "receive" address in my nano it has a 0 balance.

Any suggestions on how to fix this?

Topic: Ledger Live Nano missing btc - page 2. (Read 450 times)