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Topic: Lets Kill this Paypal Reversible Scam! Look here! - page 2. (Read 7338 times)

hero member
Activity: 882
Merit: 1006
Everytime you're dealing with Paypal on a regular basis you're going to get hit with these kinds of scams. It always happens, there's no way around it.


Here are the steps you follow to win every dispute. This is when you're dealing with virtual currencies.


1) Get an email from the person who is buying the item from there VERIFIED Paypal email address. What you want them to include is a filled out order form, you will send this from your REGISTERED paypal email.

Include all the item specifics. So say if you are going to be selling someone a Bitcoin, the order form would look something like this. You can also give them a random order # which will just add onto the evidence.

Product:
Bitcoin Address:
Amount of Purchase:
Is this purchase for Bitcoins (y/n):

2) If you can you need to get some other form of proof such as ID or there phone # attached to the Paypal account. You call the number and ask if they're okay with the payment and you're just making sure etc.

3) Screenshot all the chat logs and your transaction being sent to the BTC address

4) If they reverse the payment upload all the screenshots and information to Paypal Resolution center


I've had disputes filed against me three or four times and using these methods I have won all of them.

If they dispute the charge with the credit card company, you will loose. If the account is hacked/stolen, you will loose.
sr. member
Activity: 294
Merit: 250
Everytime you're dealing with Paypal on a regular basis you're going to get hit with these kinds of scams. It always happens, there's no way around it.


Here are the steps you follow to win every dispute. This is when you're dealing with virtual currencies.


1) Get an email from the person who is buying the item from there VERIFIED Paypal email address. What you want them to include is a filled out order form, you will send this from your REGISTERED paypal email.

Include all the item specifics. So say if you are going to be selling someone a Bitcoin, the order form would look something like this. You can also give them a random order # which will just add onto the evidence.

Product:
Bitcoin Address:
Amount of Purchase:
Is this purchase for Bitcoins (y/n):

2) If you can you need to get some other form of proof such as ID or there phone # attached to the Paypal account. You call the number and ask if they're okay with the payment and you're just making sure etc.

3) Screenshot all the chat logs and your transaction being sent to the BTC address

4) If they reverse the payment upload all the screenshots and information to Paypal Resolution center


I've had disputes filed against me three or four times and using these methods I have won all of them.

I hope you are getting a nice premium on those coins, cause I probably wouldnt do that.
Sell coins, PayPal > Bank - 3 days. Bank > Dwolla - 3 days. Buy coins. A lot can happen with BTC in 6 days.
Then you are still at risk, even if you won every other time. Plus, that is a lot of work just to hopefully be able to prove a legit purchase.
legendary
Activity: 1022
Merit: 1000
Everytime you're dealing with Paypal on a regular basis you're going to get hit with these kinds of scams. It always happens, there's no way around it.


Here are the steps you follow to win every dispute. This is when you're dealing with virtual currencies.


1) Get an email from the person who is buying the item from there VERIFIED Paypal email address. What you want them to include is a filled out order form, you will send this from your REGISTERED paypal email.

Include all the item specifics. So say if you are going to be selling someone a Bitcoin, the order form would look something like this. You can also give them a random order # which will just add onto the evidence.

Product:
Bitcoin Address:
Amount of Purchase:
Is this purchase for Bitcoins (y/n):

2) If you can you need to get some other form of proof such as ID or there phone # attached to the Paypal account. You call the number and ask if they're okay with the payment and you're just making sure etc.

3) Screenshot all the chat logs and your transaction being sent to the BTC address

4) If they reverse the payment upload all the screenshots and information to Paypal Resolution center


I've had disputes filed against me three or four times and using these methods I have won all of them.
sr. member
Activity: 280
Merit: 250
any input Blazr? CIYAM Open? KWH? DeathAndTaxes?

To learn all about the concept of risk...
Why don't you just mail cash to your new friends...
And they will promise to send you BTC.
full member
Activity: 224
Merit: 100
One bitcoin to rule them all!
Just do some searching and you'll see paypal will reverse *anything* for *anyone* (it is their basic principle to protect the buyer and not care about the seller - and especially if the seller is some nobody to them).

As suggested *forget about paypal* and enjoy Bitcoin.


When I bought what I thought was a legitimate WIN7 ultimate, which turned out to be a fake, it was not an easy task to get a refound.

Might have been that I flat out refused to return the counterfeit item (still got it).

-I had to provide proof in the form of pictures and referals from Microsoft before I finally got a refound. And then I think it really was the seller who caved in(MS did not care too much either.). To bad I'm not a rich man, cause then I would have turned up at his home adress with some goons. Wink
newbie
Activity: 33
Merit: 0
Hi,

Today I buy just 2BTCs for test the localbitcoins.com network and I used Paypal; the only thing asked by the seller was my Paypal account were verified and pay the fee for international purchase (8%). Fast and easy I got my first 2BTCs.

Just search a seller who accept PayPal.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 0
OP - is that a US paypal?
hero member
Activity: 882
Merit: 1006
Yep. Freelancers get hit with chargebacks as well, its still considered an intangible good, if there is no tracking number then the chances are a chargeback will be successful.
legendary
Activity: 1890
Merit: 1086
Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer
I'm in SEA now, and I do pay for those stuff too. What's wrong with the region?  Huh

I didn't say anything was *wrong* - just that copyright and patents are not so important in much of it (not a bad thing IMO).
sr. member
Activity: 294
Merit: 250
thanks for the fast respond guys, i really appreciate it.

However, we still left option #2 open.
what happen if i use paypal to pay someone for their service (freelance designer, outsource dev house) ?? their work isnt consider as virtual item right? it fall into "service" category, does paypal protect the seller in this category??

any input Blazr? CIYAM Open? KWH? DeathAndTaxes?

I honestly cant see this working much better... Granted, I really have not used PayPal in a few years.
Maybe the risk is still there, maybe not. The bigger challenge will be getting someone to go along with it. It really does not matter how PayPal views the transaction if no one trusts the most worthless payment processor to ever exist.
legendary
Activity: 1890
Merit: 1086
Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer
I just don't think it will work no matter how you want to try and frame it (reminds me of Sunday trading fights back in Australia when you could buy a *book* for a thousand dollars and *get a free pool table*).
legendary
Activity: 1288
Merit: 1227
Away on an extended break
A long story cut short - it's trivial to reverse anything on PayPal if you ask your CC company to reverse it for you. QED.

You're living in SE Asia and are paying for any of those things?

Well one can only admire your willingness to pay for things that you don't need to. Smiley

(hint - use Android and get your money out of paypal)


I'm in SEA now, and I do pay for those stuff too. What's wrong with the region?  Huh
sr. member
Activity: 282
Merit: 250
thanks for the fast respond guys, i really appreciate it.

However, we still left option #2 open.
what happen if i use paypal to pay someone for their service (freelance designer, outsource dev house) ?? their work isnt consider as virtual item right? it fall into "service" category, does paypal protect the seller in this category??

any input Blazr? CIYAM Open? KWH? DeathAndTaxes?
legendary
Activity: 1890
Merit: 1086
Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer
You're living in SE Asia and are paying for any of those things?

Well one can only admire your willingness to pay for things that you don't need to. Smiley

(hint - use Android and get your money out of paypal)
sr. member
Activity: 294
Merit: 250
Long ago I managed to convince PayPal that a buyer who made multiple purchases of digital goods and reversed them was doing it on purpose and gaming the system. I forwarded emails, screenshots of conversations (including from within eBay), and a ton of other proof. It took a lot of work and like a month for them to agree with me. Two weeks later, the buyer created credit card disputes since the PayPal were closed. PayPal immediately refunded all of her money, closed my account because I was a fraudulent seller, and held all of my funds for 6 months.
sr. member
Activity: 282
Merit: 250
So assuming you are legit (and I'm not assuming anything else) then *please* just *let paypal go* (even better - delete your account as I did).

Smiley

if i know paypal was this broken, i wouldnt use it back then.
but then again, i have a few thousand usd there.
i live in South East Asia now, so i need a convenient way to buy itunes songs, app store, mmo virtual items. Apple,Inc seamlessly withdraw the fund from my paypal.
legendary
Activity: 1890
Merit: 1086
Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer
So assuming you are legit (and I'm not assuming anything else) then *please* just *let paypal go* (even better - delete your account as I did).

Smiley
KWH
legendary
Activity: 1904
Merit: 1045
In Collateral I Trust.
If you want to buy bitcoins then *forget about paypal* and then move on (if you keep at it then it will be assumed by most here that you are not trying to anything but *use* the paypal system to get free bitcoins as has happened many times before).
i understand the risk that the seller will have. but what eating me alive is the fact that im a legit buyer that want to use my paypal, but so frustrated because some people before me use paypal as their scamming disposal and now im left with the consequences.

Welcome to reality.
sr. member
Activity: 282
Merit: 250
Nope read the PayPal TOS.  There is no seller protection for virtual items.  If disputed as "not authorized" PayPal will refund it.  Period.  They won't even ask for screenshots and won't care what "proof" you supply.
well, in that case... how about option #2 ??
sr. member
Activity: 282
Merit: 250
If you want to buy bitcoins then *forget about paypal* and then move on (if you keep at it then it will be assumed by most here that you are not trying to anything but *use* the paypal system to get free bitcoins as has happened many times before).
i understand the risk that the seller will have. but what eating me alive is the fact that im a legit buyer that want to use my paypal, but so frustrated because some people before me use paypal as their scamming disposal and now im left with the consequences.
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