Topic: Liberty Dollars ban goes into effect at eBay - page 2. (Read 5985 times)
NORFED/Liberty Dollar has been in operation since 1998, why all of a sudden did the federal government decide this form of silver bullion is illegal? The clear signs of political motive are painted very clearly on the pages of this case from the very beginning. Just examine the rhetoric the prosecutor used invoking accusations of "terrorism". This is all about keeping the people of the United States from being able to protect themselves from being robbed blind by the failing federal reserve system.
Oh my bad.
I do remember reading an article about the feds raiding these people on Rense.com.
I do remember reading an article about the feds raiding these people on Rense.com.
Not only did they ban liberty dollars, but they also banned the silver certificates. I don't see how those could be considered counterfeit coins because they aren't even coins.
BTW, I have one original 1998 $1 certificate left -- BTC2, free shipping.
BTW, I have one original 1998 $1 certificate left -- BTC2, free shipping.
You mean those dollars with the blue seal instead of green?
He means a paper Liberty Dollar aka NORFED warehouse receipt formerly redeemable for silver until the federal government confiscated it. You are thinking of a silver certificate issued by the US Treasury.
Not only did they ban liberty dollars, but they also banned the silver certificates. I don't see how those could be considered counterfeit coins because they aren't even coins.
BTW, I have one original 1998 $1 certificate left -- BTC2, free shipping.
BTW, I have one original 1998 $1 certificate left -- BTC2, free shipping.
You mean those dollars with the blue seal instead of green?
WTF does "intended for use as current money" mean?
It means if you don't use their funny green papers, they will find a way to put you in a cage.
For some reason a mod moved this thread off topic, but the same news commented by Jon Matonis, even not mentioning directly Bitcoin goes straight to Press. Go figure 
2012-12-15 Forbes.com - U.S. Secret Service Bans Certain Gold and Silver Coins
2012-12-15 Forbes.com - U.S. Secret Service Bans Certain Gold and Silver Coins
Quote
Nothing is real. Everything is far away. Everything is a copy of a copy of a copy
-Fight Club 
He was also convicted of violating 18 USC § 486 - Uttering coins of gold, silver or other metal:
This could definitely be applied to Casascius coins. The prosecutor just has to convince the jury that they are intended to be used as currency.
Quote from: http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/486
Whoever ... makes ... any coins of gold or silver or other metal, ... intended for use as current money, whether in the resemblance of coins of the United States or of foreign countries, or of original design, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years, or both.
This could definitely be applied to Casascius coins. The prosecutor just has to convince the jury that they are intended to be used as currency.
I am somehow confused here. WTF does "intended for use as current money" mean? If me and my neighbor decide tomorrow to use between us round pieces of metal as money, are we facing jail?
Want some NORFED Liberty Dollars of your own?
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/wtsgoldsilver-999-cash-out-fast-rare-norfeds-live-price-big-order-discount-58518
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/wtsgoldsilver-999-cash-out-fast-rare-norfeds-live-price-big-order-discount-58518
So the takeaway is that anyone producing physical bitcoins should be very careful to ensure there is no likeness (intentional or otherwise) with US currency. The use of $, "dollars", "US", "In God we trust", and other currency emblems and icons should be avoided. Things like "lady liberty", the "bald eagle", "stars & stripes", depictions of US landmarks (capital building, lincoln memorial) or persons used in current or out of circulation US currency are likely a foolish risk.
Making a bitcoin which looks like this for example would probably not be a good idea. Attempting to pass it off as US currency to unsuspecting customers would be an even worse idea. Nothaus did both.
Making a bitcoin which looks like this for example would probably not be a good idea. Attempting to pass it off as US currency to unsuspecting customers would be an even worse idea. Nothaus did both.
He was also convicted of violating 18 USC § 486 - Uttering coins of gold, silver or other metal:
Quote from: http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/486
Whoever ... makes ... any coins of gold or silver or other metal, ... intended for use as current money, whether in the resemblance of coins of the United States or of foreign countries, or of original design, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years, or both.
This could definitely be applied to Casascius coins. The prosecutor just has to convince the jury that they are intended to be used as currency.
Not only did they ban liberty dollars, but they also banned the silver certificates. I don't see how those could be considered counterfeit coins because they aren't even coins.
BTW, I have one original 1998 $1 certificate left -- BTC2, free shipping.
BTW, I have one original 1998 $1 certificate left -- BTC2, free shipping.
as the value of silver rose the coins became more and more debased.
[/quote]
This goes against the will of the based gods! Heresy!
[/quote]
This goes against the will of the based gods! Heresy!
If NotHaus is your anti-FED hero well you need to pick better heroes. Did you know the "Liberty Dollars" were inflationary. They contained less than face value of silver and as the value of silver rose the coins became more and more debased. Greed pure and simple.
Just to make sure that isn't misunderstood, you don't mean traditional coin debasement methods where alloys are introduced like how a 1964 U.S. quarter had 90% silver content, but a 1965 quarter of the same shape, size and appearance had been debased with a copper and nickel coin with no silver content whatsoever.
Instead what the Liberty Dollar did was change the denomination stamped on the coin. The earlier 1 ounce silver coin was stamped $10. The later 1 ounce silver coin was stamped $20.
The price charged for an item in terms of Liberty Dollars though would fluctuate depending on the exchange rate for silver.
So a 2005 (1 ounce silver) $10 Liberty Dollar pictured above would (presumably) buy the same amount of goods and services that the 2006 (1 ounce silver) $20 Liberty Dollar would.
Even more importantly, no free market money can have a face value that is equal to or less than its underlying commodity's "spot price". This was true of the Liberty Dollar, it is currently true of Shire Silver, and it is also true of bitcoin. (The underlying commodity for bitcoin is the electricity and processing power required to mine it.)
Money is a product, and as such it won't be produced unless it makes a profit for the producer. In a free market, that profit is visible and in the form of a margin on top of the cost of production. Governments profit by using money to control. I'd much rather have my money generated by a simple motive of economic profit as opposed to power profit.
Those do look better than U.S minted ones :p
Ssh. you might be conspiring to domestic terrorism!
Those do look better than U.S minted ones :p
Hah. I think they looked pretty nice. I wouldn't mind have one of those!
If NotHaus is your anti-FED hero well you need to pick better heroes. Did you know the "Liberty Dollars" were inflationary. They contained less than face value of silver and as the value of silver rose the coins became more and more debased. Greed pure and simple.
Just to make sure that isn't misunderstood, you don't mean traditional coin debasement methods where alloys are introduced like how a 1964 U.S. quarter had 90% silver content, but a 1965 quarter of the same shape, size and appearance had been debased with a copper and nickel coin with no silver content whatsoever.
Instead what the Liberty Dollar did was change the denomination stamped on the coin. The earlier 1 ounce silver coin was stamped $10. The later 1 ounce silver coin was stamped $20.
The price charged for an item in terms of Liberty Dollars though would fluctuate depending on the exchange rate for silver.
So a 2005 (1 ounce silver) $10 Liberty Dollar pictured above would (presumably) buy the same amount of goods and services that the 2006 (1 ounce silver) $20 Liberty Dollar would.
Liberty dollars were a scam. Move along nothing to see here..
Have these things started showing up for sale on Silk Road or Bitmit yet?
Wow that is actually quite sad.
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