Topic: Lost bitcoins - Transferring from android to iOS (Both wallets from same seed) - page 2. (Read 309 times)

You can prove that they were sent from your wallet, but you cannot prove that you were owning the destination wallet. I mean that for proving it's yours you need the same thing as you'd spend the coins, which I'm afraid you don't (of course, unless you manage to recover that wallet you've sent your coins to).

Hi again,

I think there is a chance they are lost, we did not take a backup of the wallet on the iPhone after transferring balance from the android.
We thought they still would be attached to the seed. And that we could recover them from the seed.

It also could be a glitch in the Mycelium wallet if they were supposed to be recoverable from the seed.

Is there a way for me to trace the transactions and prove they are mine?

Thanks.

AFAIK, Mycelium uses the same 'change address format' as the output's format, like if you're sending to a SegWit address, Mycelium will use SegWit change address.
(but that info won't help with the recovery of your funds, only to identify which output is the change).

Anyways, there shouldn't be any issue with the funds being sent to your change address, it's also recoverable from the seed phrase (or with passphrase).

But like I've mentioned:
"Seed Phrase A" will still recover the same set of (receiving) addresses and change addresses from 'Mycelium A'.
If you've restored "Seed Phrase 'A' with a Passphrase", it will recover an entirely different set of addresses and change addresses.
So, if you have set a passphrase in the deleted IOS mycelium, all you have to do is to restore the same seed but with the correct passphrase.
Wrong Passphrase will work but will create a new-different wallet.

Hi again,

The thing is that when I restored the seed on the iPhone I could not see the correct balance.

I could only see the correct balance on the android.
I then sent the coins to the iPhone. (Which was restored with the same seed, but not showing the coins)
Then sold one.
Then deleted app.

I am not an expert on transactions but I have been digging into a bit today, and that's why I suddenly came to think about the change addresses.

In the transaction history all transactions are done the same day as when we sold the one.

The remaining looks to be on a change address (As mentioned I am not expert and this could be wrong).

But maybe then they are on a change address created by the iPhone mycelium and not the android from which we sent them...

Should I have backed up the iPhone wallet after selling one coin? Since the remaining was sent to the change address?

My question now is if this is correct and I find the change address, can I regain access to it? and how?

Thanks again, priceless help, it is much appreciated.

You mean you were able to see your correct balance before after wallet restoration, but later after long time period, you want to restore the wallet, but the balance is now zero.

But you are able to see your transaction history on the wallet, check to know if the bitcoin has been sent to address(es) not known to you, check the last transaction(s), check if you were the one that sent Bitcoin to the addresses and check the date. Likely, your seed phrase was compromised if there is/are unkown transaction(s).

Thank you @Charles-Tim,

I restored the seed on both the android and the iPhone. But the coins only showed up on the android.
Same seed was restored, but the iPhone did not display the coins.

Since the android phone wasn't mine I sent them to the iPhone.

Then the coins appeared on the iPhone, I then sold one coin. It displayed six...
Later probably deleted the wallet from the iPhone.

When I tried to restore about a year later the balance is the same, both when trying to restore on the android and the iPhone, BTC lost, hopefully temporary.

Where would you suggest to try from here to recover the coins?

I have the original seed.

Thanks a lot for your answers.

Mycelium is a HD wallet, it generates change addresses. For example, if you have 1 btc on one address, you send 0.1 btc to another person's address, there will be 0.9 btc that will be sent to your wallet's change address as UTXO, and it is what you can see on your wallet balance immediately.

You sent the money from Android to iPhone, or you imported the seed phrase?

I think what I have just explained will maake this clear to you.

For wallet restoration, you need the seed phrase, private key or wallet file.

INFORMATION UPDATE.

Thanks for trying to assist me in this matter. I realised one vital thing that I forgot to include in my information.

When I had sent the money from the android phone to the iOS phone I sent one coin to kraken to sell it.

Could this have caused Mycelium to generate a change address on the iphone? And that the remaining BTCs are in this change address?

I am 99.99999% sure that the same seed was used on both wallets when we sent the BTC from android to the iOS, if that is the case is there a way to get back the money from this change address?

If we did not use the same seed, is there then a way to retrieve the money if we locate the change address?

Thanks for helping me trying to sort out this issue, highly appreciated.

Not at all, your wallet is just a collection of private keys to move your coins which are stored in the blockchain.
With a passphrase (actually "BIP39 passphrase"), it will just generate a wallet with entirely different set of private keys, the balance of the wallet without a passphrase/different passphrase wont be affected.

If you want to restore the wallet with "0.000X BTC" balance, you can just restore the seed without the passphrase.

Assuming that the device where it's restored is secured, there wouldn't be any major circumstances on trying to restore it with a passphrase.

Developers do not usually do that, most of the time, there's always cross-platform compatibility.
I'm also pretty sure Mycelium haven't changed derivation path in the earlier versions.

Thanks @nc50lc for your message and assistance.

Passphrase solution
At the point of writing this I have to assume I can not trust myself and will try all proposed solutions. Will it affect my wallet if I try to restore "another" wallet with a passphrase?

Lets say I:
1. Delete my wallet
2. Try to restore wallet as proposed with same seed + passphrase
3. Will I then after be able to restore my wallet only using the seeds? (no passphrase) after?

Regarding sending to same wallet, will the keys be different types in iOS / Android and make me have to search for other keys/account types?

Sadly not the wrong BTC mBTC :-)

Thanks a lot for assisting!

These are the possible scenarios that could have happened based from your statements.
(Refer to the OP for the quoted parts):

• Since IOS Mycelium didn't have any balance in "Status at this point", the IOS Mycelium could have been a different wallet entirely.
  So after sending the bitcoins from your Android to the zero-balance-Mycelium in "Action taken", all that's left to the Android Mycelium is the change which is the "0.000X BTC".
  When you restored the seed from Android to the IOS in "Actions taken later", It displayed the same balance as the android which is the change of that transaction.
  
  
• This is a variation of the first scenario but recoverable: You could've added a "Passphrase" to the seed when restoring it to the IOS app.
  If this is the case, try to restore the seed again but now, check "I have a passphrase" and after typing the seed, you'll have to type exactly the same passphrase that you've used before.
  This is because adding a passphrase to the seed phrase will generate a different set of keys so it will create an entirely different wallet.
  
  
• Are you 100% sure that it's the same seed even with the passphrase or it doesn't have a passphrase? Yes?
  If your previous balance isn't too high, you might have used most of it as "transaction fee" for the transaction in "Action taken".
  That transaction did nothing but to send it to the same wallet. Because sending bitcoins between wallets with the same seed is pointless since it's basically a 'send-to-the-same-wallet' transaction.
  
  
• Or it's actually displaying the correct balance and "0.000X BTC" was just previously displayed as "0.X mBTC".
  In that case, it's just the Cryptocurrenct denomination, my example above have the same value.
  
  

Thank a lot all of you for answering and trying to help, this is highly appreciated.

@dkbit98
I used the same seed on different devices since I could not restore it on my iPhone, balance showed 0 BTC, I was afraid they were lost.
Tried then the Android where I managed to restore the coins.
Then transferred the coins to my iPhone. Same seed was used on both.

I tried with importing the seed to Electrum, no luck.
When using blockchair are you recommending me to search my wallet public key? Or the transaction IDs?

@Charles-Tim
"BlueWallet, it will be a good wallet most especially for beginners that want to make use of lightning network". What do you mean by this sentence about BlueWallet? Is it good for trying to recover? Sorry, I am at the stage before beginner :-)

@NeuroticFish
I tried several times to recover the wallet on the iOS before going to the android.

I am not sure if I understand how to check the addresses, but:
- When looking at the transactions overview, red transactions, outgoing they all start with 1.

- When I enter the transaction I have a transaction ID but also inputs and output addresses, which are you referring to?

Transaction 1:
In transaction overview address showing starts with: 1
Transaction details:
Transaction ID starts with c
Inputs start with: 1
Output 1 starts with: 1
Output 2 starts with: 1

Transaction 2:
In transaction overview address showing starts with: 1
Transaction details:
Transaction ID starts with 2
Inputs start with: 1
Output 1 starts with: 1
Output 2 starts with: 1

Transaction 3:
In transaction overview address showing starts with: 1
Transaction details:
Transaction ID starts with b1
Inputs start with: 1
Output 1 starts with: 1
Output 2 starts with: 1

Transaction 4:
In transaction overview address showing starts with: 1
Transaction details:
Transaction ID starts with 2
Input 1 starts with: 1
Input 2 starts with: 1
Input 3 starts with: 1
Input 4 starts with: 1
Output 1 starts with: 1
Output 2 starts with: 1

The seed should be the same for both wallets, could it be that they are showing as different account types / address types in the iOS and that I have to restore them another way?



@hosseinimr93
"Are you sure that both wallets had the same seed?" Yes I am sure they had the same seed.

"The other possibility is that your IOS wallet wasn't synced at the first, got synced after a while and the balance was shown." What would happen in this case?



@BitMaxz
Sadly I did not find them in Electrum. Which address do you suggest I use to look in the block explorer? The wallet address or one of the transactions?
And if it is the wallet address is this the same as the wallet public key?


Thanks a lot for helping out guys, this is really highly appreciated.

Mycelium on IOS is a well-known buggy and it seems the Mycelium website doesn't have an IOS version on their wallet page you can only see the Android Mycelium app.

So I think the Mycelium on IOS is no longer maintained?

If they have a different seed and the one from IOS doesn't have balance and you tried to import it into Mycelium android but still doesn't have the balance I would suggest you copy the address from your IOS and then look for block explorer like blockchair.com and paste it and check if the address has funds.
If it still has no funds it means you don't actually have a BTC on that wallet at least we can see the transactions if there is someone transfer them to another wallet. But if it doesn't have any transaction history from block explorer it means you didn't deposit BTC to that wallet.

As suggested above I also recommend using the seed from Mycelium IOS to Electrum when importing it to Electrum you will need to enable BIP39 to get the wallet that you have from Mycelium IOS. Let's see if you can find your BTC there.

If you are looking for a better and secured wallet for IOS you can switch to ledger nano they now support IOS with IOS ledger live.

If the wallets (the one on the IOS device and the one on android device) have the same seed, they should be a same wallet. Both should include same keys and same addresses.
If you don't see the balance on one of devices, it can be a syncing issue.

This is very confusing to me.
You already said that both wallets had the same seed.
If the wallets had the same seed and you transferred bitcoin from the android wallet to IOS wallet, you haven't sent bitcoin to a different wallet. You have actually sent bitcoin from a wallet to a same wallet and nothing should change.
Are you sure that both wallets had the same seed?

The other possibility is that your IOS wallet wasn't synced at the first, got synced after a while and the balance was shown.

I don't know how the iOS mycelium looks like, but it may be that first time you did not recover properly the initial wallet; second time you did recover properly the initial wallet.
The problem is that you need now the second wallet, where you've sent the coins to.

Does by chance the initial address start with 1* and the address where you've sent the money to starts with 3* or bc1*?



Your coins, if the transaction is confirmed, are at the address you've sent them to. You will need the private key or seed of that wallet in order to spend those coins.
I am not convinced I understand what actually happened there, hence I cannot tell yet whether or how you can access/spend those coins.

I think what Ole1990 was complaning about is that he is using iOS now, he tried to recover his Bitcoin using Mycelium app on the iOS device but did not work, I do not know how that can be true but people always complain of Mycelium wallet on iOS, while the best option is to make use of Android. Electrum is not having app for iOS, correct me if wrong, Electrum would have been the best alternative to go for. Also I have checked BlueWallet, it will be a good wallet most especially for beginners that want to make use of lightning network.

Big answer, your Bitcoin was never on your phones, they are only holding keys and enable you to sign and broadcast transaction, and Bitcoin is on blockchain all the time.
I don't know why you complicated things so much and why you tried to use same seed on different devices, but make sure your wallet is synced to show correct baalnce.
You can also see full history of your transactions in any bitcoin explorer (blockchair or similar) and see what address exactly has your coins.
Try to use seed words and recover them in different wallet like Electrum of BlueWallet, that I recommend more than ads filled Mycelium.

Restored Mycelium wallet on my new iPhone, Seed X, balance showing 0 BTC.
Also recovered the same Mycelium wallet on my wife’s android, Seed X (Same seed) , balance showing correct amount of BTC.

Status at this point:

Wallet (Seed X) recovered to two different phones, one android and one iOS.
Android showing correct amount of BTC. iOS showing 0 BTC.

Action taken:
Transferred the BTC from the android to the iOS.
From my wife's telephone to mine.

Status at this point:
iOS mycelium wallet showing correct amount of BTC.

Actions taken later:
iOS mycelium app deleted. (99% certain this is what happened)
Then tried to reinstall mycelium wallet on iOS with the same seed.
Balance showing 0.000X BTC.
All transactions visible in the transaction window.

Also tried to go back to the Android phone and recover again with same seed, but also the wallet when restored on android is showing 0.000X BTC.

The big question:
Where is my BTC and how can I recover them?