Topic: Lost seed recovered BTC stolen (Read 683 times)

Yes this is only possibility any the theft is not from outside but inside , As i follow crypto cases i have found a person that can hack people hardware wallet and therefore we cant says that hardware wallet is 100% safe but if you lose then there is a little chance that anyone in the future can stole your crypto ,
Friends in the field of crypto we are our banks our owner and its our responsibility to protect our self from scam .

FYI, OP already stated his words/seed phrase doesn't even work.


Aside from what @nc50lc said, technically most devices are susceptible to hacking.

Electrum isn't a company, it an open-source client which is being developed by volunteer developers.
For reference, here's their license: github.com/spesmilo/electrum/blob/master/LICENCE
In other words, they aren't liable to any lost funds caused by either a bug or a vulnerability in the client.

Electrum isn't a custodial wallet either so there's no way to verify the cause of lost of funds but the user himself.
The users' seed phrase, password, passphrase, etc. aren't stored in any server; the public "servers" are just there to provide Electrum clients data from the blockchain.
Those servers aren't owned by Electrum either, those are by users who have a public Electrum Server.

10.78134 is huge, I hope you are being sincere here. Many factors might be responsible for that and electrum is in the best position to furnish you with accurate answers. First, you might be careless with the seed phrases and someone close to you might have discovered them unnoticed to steal from you.

But in case electrum confirms to you that your wallet was indeed hacked, then there is nothing you can do as Bitcoin wallets are also susceptible to hacking. You might only want to try compensation from electrum if indeed is not your fault. They might also try on their path to trace the transaction, unfortunately, hackers are smarter these days.

You probably misspelled your 12 word phrase or something like that, which is why it your seed-phrase doesn't work in wallets. In any case, some mistake was made, otherwise you would have already gained access to your funds.

It seems to me that there is nothing strange in this, because 12 words doesn't contain errors, which means that it works for Electrum or Mycelium.

Good decision. Perhaps a break will do you good and you will notice those details that you might have missed.

I think i've reached the end of the road with this search. My main 12 word phrase does not seem  to work in either mycelium, electrum, bitaddress.org. Not tried Multibit; but I'm sure it won't work there either. I'm gutted; and also annoyed because I know it should work.

The thing I found strange was that my other 12 word phrase that worked for Electrum and revealed historical transactions also worked in  Mycelium.
 
I'm going to park this problem for a while till i get fresh ideas; but thank you to everyone that helped esp. nc50lc and ETFbitcoin.
Thank you.

This doesn't add up. You either used a poem, and something like a brain wallet, or you used a random seed represented in the form of 12 words to reduce mistakes writing it down. Wallets don't generate poems.

That's the part I don't get: "weave circle round thrice close your eyes holy dread honey hath jan" is indeed accepted, which means all words are on the 2048 word list. It could be a coincidence all words in the poem are on the list, but that still doesn't explain how you ended up with the words from a poem. I don't believe a random seed ends up this close to a poem.

If you know the exact amount and approximate date, you might be able to find your transaction on-chain. Blockchair has data dumps for this.

Have you looked at old topics on Bitcointalk? To get you started, here's a list of the first 10,000 topics: loyce.club/other/titles.html.

@ETFbitcoin, MultiBit Classic has been around since April 2011, but it's a non-HD version - the MultiBit HD version was created sometime in 2014. For all we know from history, the OP didn't use Electrum or MultiBit - unless there were some unofficial versions of which all written traces have been lost.

It's pretty much everything we said in the first page: the dates in your memory are off.

Another issue is you're still trying 0.3 while the version that doesn't have a word list is the initial release up to a couple of commits.
Version 0.3 is way past the version when a fixed word list is introduced so your unique seed phrase wont work there.

A fixed word list was only introduced in this commit: https://github.com/spesmilo/electrum/commit/93c27a62d47d9aab6b5502999df2ff184482e1e0 [2]
Prior to that, Electrum will ask for a 20-character-minimum "seed", or "passphrase" in the earlier commits (check my screenshot above testing the first commit)
So, you should only be trying the versions before that commit, only the last page of the commit history [1] (excluding "use random seed; do not trust the user for entropy" and earlier).

References:

• [1] First commits: github.com/spesmilo/electrum/commits/master?after=bdbd59300fbd35b01605e66145458e5f396108e8+14035 (November 5, 2011)
• [2] Mnemonic was added: github.com/spesmilo/electrum/commits/master?before=bdbd59300fbd35b01605e66145458e5f396108e8+14036 (November 8, 2011)

---

Well, memory isn't all reliable IMO.
It could add or remove details based from what you've read, heard or saw.

For other wallets before 2011, I second the "Brainwallet" idea.

Even if it could be a lot of work the best would be to use all different wallets that were available in that time and try to put in the seed words that you have. You say that the only time you touched your bitcoin was in 2016, so there is a chance that you send them away at this time so if you check your wallets and they display the amount 0 you should also check if you see transactions in 2016 (or any other time if your wallet was compromised).

Did you have several addresses or just one?
Could you have generated an address / private key with a brainwallet? https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/brainwallet-defcon-attack-discussion-advice-qa-brainflayer-info-etc-1148611
I am not sure when they came into use so I don't know if it was even possible.

The only other wallet I can think of from back then that used words is multibit. They have been gone for years to the point even the discussion here has been put into the archive. But you can still read it here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=99.0

-Dave

Thanks again nc50lc. I raised an issue https://github.com/spesmilo/electrum/issues/7893. The responses have been very interesting although somewhat disheartening. They're saying that prior to version 2.0 Electrum used a fixed word list; and if my word list is not in that list it could not have been generated by Electrum; so basically I must have used a different wallet to Electrum.

Well, I know the date of purchase 100% during 2011 or before 2011.
I know 100% I used a wallet that generated the 12 word seed which I wrote down and found in my note books.
I know 100% when I plug those seeds into Electrum they're accepted by Electrum without issue; but wallets display zero balance.
I know 100% I successfully transferred coins between the wallets over a very short period of a week or 2 max and then never touched the wallet or Bitcoin again until 2016 or so. By then my PC were long broken and got rid off.

I'm now trying to understand whether my 12 word seed was generated by a post 2.0 version of Electrum or some other wallet type.
Does anyone have an idea what wallet type that had the same look and feel as Electrum existed in or before 2011?
There has to be an answer to this mystery. Let's solve it.

That seems to be the previous version that you launched (v0.30) and not the alpha version.
It should ask for a passphrase before the password, plus the first version has "electrum" not "electrum.py".

I'm afraid I can't help you with the alpha version since it's not continuing nor creating the wallet in my tests either.

You can find the developers in Electrum's GitHub repository, here: github.com/spesmilo/electrum
Contributors are in "Insights->Contributors".

Thanks for your suggestion nc50lc. I tried your suggestion but electrum crashes whether restoring wallet or creating new wallet the following error:
 python electrum.py create
Password (hit return if you do not wish to encrypt your wallet):
in order to use wallet encryption, please install pycrypto  (sudo easy_install pycrypto)
server (default:ecdsa.org):
port (default:50000):
fee (default 0.005):
if you are restoring an existing wallet, enter the seed. otherwise just press enter:
Your seed is 12f2458bab0372ecc4d2097f0df39167
Please store it safely
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "electrum.py", line 715, in
    wallet.create_new_address(False, None)
  File "electrum.py", line 295, in create_new_address
    secexp = ecdsa.util.randrange_from_seed__trytryagain( seed, order )
  File "/usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/ecdsa/util.py", line 193, in randrange_from_seed__trytryagain
    extrabyte = int2byte(ord(generate(1)) & lsb_of_ones(extrabits))
  File "/usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/ecdsa/util.py", line 98, in __call__
    a = [next(self.generator) for i in range(numbytes)]
  File "/usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/ecdsa/util.py", line 109, in block_generator
    ("prng-%d-%s" % (counter, seed)).encode()
UnicodeDecodeError: 'ascii' codec can't decode byte 0xb6 in position 7: ordinal not in range(128)

I tried to reach out to thomasv; however it said he does not accept messages from newbies. So I'm wondering if one of you guys can point him out to this post.
I feel like we're getting close to solving this mystery.

The alpha release used "passphrase" instead of a mnemonic.
Perhaps your invalid menmonics are actually passphrases used to generate old Electrum wallets.


See if you can run it: https://github.com/spesmilo/electrum/tree/368fa7980f74db07e22eb32edf292abeb98b8d82
(I can't create a wallet though)

Great comments from ETFbitcoin, and yes it's a line from Kubla Khan, and as I said; I was using it for practice purposes only; sending and receiving small amounts of bitcoin. I don't remember the exact steps for purchasing the coins; but roughly, back then; when you purchased the coins from bitcoin.org I think, you then had to transfer them from your purchase account to a wallet. I'm 99% sure that the wallet was electrum. When setting up the wallet it generated the seed automatically; but it offered you the option to enter your own 12 word seed and that I remember very clearly.
I used my favourite poem at the time and words from a favourite song (not shared that yet). For my main account I used default seed generated by Electrum.
It also said that you must never write the words anywhere in case someone discovered them and used them to still your coins. I wrote them down anyway and forgot about them for years until my interest was aroused by the sudden increase of Bitcoin value; then began the long search for the seed. I turned the house and garage over and under looking for them and eventually after  years  of searching I spotted them, scribbled so nonchalantly it's a wonder I ever found them. The excitement was electric. I could barely breathe when I typed them into electrum; but my heart sank as the BTC balance came up as zero.
Then began the search for proof of purchase. You see; if I could get the date of purchase and amount I paid I could at the very list go to blockchain explorer and locate my address and my coins because they would still be on the blockchain; with very few transactions clustered around the date of purchase. Needless to say, I was not able to find any proof; banks only keep records for 6 years so they could not help either. So I was back to square one. The only thing I have is a bunch of stupid meaningless words; but potentially worth a fortune. So I'm not ready to give up yet.
The latest breakthrough was finding those 12 words with the 10.7mBTC. That proved to me that the seed works under the correct circumstances.

1. Yes it's possible I downloaded a dodgy Electrum copy and someone stole all my coins. Then let's find the trail on the blockchain. I don't think this happened because nobody cared about Bitcoin to want to steal it back then.

2. Electrum wasn't available before 2011, nobody but  spesmilo knows that for sure; his first commit on github is bumping up the version number.
from distutils.core import setup
version = "0.29"
version = "0.30"
So question, might be when did github to allow developers to push their code first come out. He might have been using SVN before that.
3. If not electrum then what other wallets were there, in shall we say 2011. Just bitcoin core and electrum right, I don't think there was anything else. I suspect I might have used a beta version; but honestly I don't really remember.
I know 100% that I bought the coins before or at the latest 2011; because I was working for this one company and I left that company in 2011 and I had already bought the coins by then.

I have now managed to check all my seeds against version 0.3 and most of the words are rejected. So  now back to square one.
Maybe it was a different version of Electrum, maybe it was some other random wallet type whose name I can't remember. What a nightmare.

As explained: that's not possible.

That's not wallet from 2010: the transaction happened in 2021.

If you're sure about that: forget about Electrum, and try to remember what you actually used. Electrum didn't exist, so it must have been something else. Have you ever used brainwallets?

That's not a seed phrase, it's not even random. It comes from a poem by Kubla Khan:
Only "jan" is missing from the poem.

What I explained is a possibility for all Electrum wallets created pre-v0.31 or 0.34 versions in general.
However, your situation is a bit unclear because one of your "old wallets" can't be from 2011 since it has a native SegWit address which is only became available in v3.0 (Nov 2017).

And just like all of us said, Electrum wasn't even released yet on the alleged creation date of your seed phrases.

• Here's the announcement thread: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.607510 (dated November 5, 2011)
• Here's the initial release (source code): github.com/spesmilo/electrum/commits/master?after=bdbd5...+14035 (dated November 5, 2011)

How to lose your Bitcoins with CTRL-C CTRL-V

Download, verify the wallet and if the signature is correct, install the wallet.
[Guide] How to Safely Download and Verify Electrum

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Electrum


There is a VERY small chance you have one from LATE 2011 0% chance you have one from pre-2011

You can get older versions from here: https://download.electrum.org/
And even older versions can be found scattered around the internet if you search.

If you are not sure of the dates / wallet that is fine. But there is no way it's an electrum from that early.

-Dave