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Topic: [LTC-GLOBAL] EMIF.LTC-TRADING /*First Dividend Out */ - page 2. (Read 1852 times)

full member
Activity: 132
Merit: 100
Hmm ,

I think , I do understand your concern . Basically, I will trade most of the times only with cryptocurrencies (most of the time with BTC ). Maybe , I can put some percentage limitation for investing other companies or assets for at least assuring , I will not give most of fund's capital to unknown or untrustable companies.
Or , I can raise a motion , If I want to invest or trade with other assets or company shares. There should be some precauitons to prevent these.
But , If I am a bad person, I do not need too much things just playing the numbers and saying "Ive lost too much for that week " is enough. Or there is a more professional way to do that , I can hide my profit and take 50% of it , then I can say " Hey, guys I had this amount profit and no one can understand" Therefore , there are lots of ways to cheat your investors. But my purpose is not cheating people , and I want some good solutions for autocontrol so that people can check really what Im doing. So , please give me some suggestions to improve this fund.

One more thing about continuous loss, there can be again some limitation for initial capital loss for ex: 30 %. After then , there can be again motion for liquidation so that people get at least 70% of for initial investment + dividends ( this is of course valid for IPO shareholders)

Im open to suggestions , please just make some.

Again, thanks for feedback...
legendary
Activity: 2940
Merit: 1090
Surely your motivation if you somehow allow the value (NAV I think its called?) to fall should be to get it back toward growing?

If doing that seems so hopeless that the idea of getting pay again when you get there does not motivate you maybe closing down is better before it loses even more?

Its probably bad enough that you can cause it to lose value by giving good deals to some sockpuppet company or companies people don't know are also related to you with undercover deals or whatever, without also getting rewarded for leeching the value out of the investors' capital?

-MarkM-
full member
Activity: 132
Merit: 100
Thanks for the feedback.

Well, as issuer I will only take management fee , If I get net profit for that week. Just rate changes , according to capital situation. If fund's total capital is less than the initial capital collected from the shareholders , then I will get 5%, if not get 10%.
If I get net loss for that specific week , I will not get any management fee.

But from point of you, your question is why I am taking a management fee after losing too much as I understand. I can not say you are wrong , but when there is a big crash or loss , something should motivate me. Of course I should be responsible as an issuer and manager of the fund but all the weeks below the initial capital I will get ZERO fee which can really affect my motivation. Management fee maybe a little bit less but , I think it should be If I can get profit.

Hopefully , I can answer your question.
 
 
legendary
Activity: 2940
Merit: 1090
So if the value of the company goes down, you get a 5% management fee?

Yet supposedly in the event of a loss you don't get a management fee?

That is confusing. A loss of value is not a loss?

-MarkM-
full member
Activity: 132
Merit: 100
FAQ:

&Issuer:
1) Who are you?

I am EMIF(Exchanger's Micro Investment Funds). I heard about BTC about end of year 2011. However, I did not interested in until July 2012. So , Im new to the community but I love BTC , also love LTC , even DVC. I just wanted to contribute to LTC and its community by managing my funds.

2) Are you a scammer?

Theoretically , everyone can be a scammer.
Practically , No ,  I am not a scammer and I will prove it as time goes
But just for the record , If this project is going to be successful , then there can be copies of this fund and success of this fund will not prove success of others.

3) How can we trust you?

You cannot trust anyone that know personally , because you cannot trust anyone even if you know personally.
As I said above , as time goes and fund will operate well , you will trust more.

For the moment , you can trust (a little bit) at least due to following:
I think , I prepared a good contract , was(will be) clear nearly about all the things
I am not OFFERING (but expecting personally)  huge income or profit , Indeed you can lose some of your money being a shareholder of this fund
This is my first fund , but will be my  main fund . So , if i want to cheat , I do not claim that  I will release more
Well, you can ask here what you want , and you will get -hopefully- concrete answers

4) Ok, Let's say , you are a genuine but could you tell us , how do you get profit from only 25,000 LTC?

Ok , my initial expectation from this fund is not getting profit as much as I can.
I am creating and will be managing for this fund for the following reasons:
a) Just for fun and experincing fund management
b) I love the community , I love BTC and LTC , want to help LTC creating like that kind of fund

My first year goal is to increase total capital to 100,000 LTC , after increasing 100,000 LTC , I think it would be more profitable for me
Also , Im hoping LTC price will increase by time.

&Fund
5) Why trading , or, why not a mining bond or mining company?

I did not have a good GPU and tried mining a little bit , got 1 LTC after one day mining. I think it did not cover my electricity costs. But in an exchange I was able to gain 100 LTC or more from trading with having 5-6k LTC.

Also , Mining bonds are really risky investment as I can see from GLBSE securities. Assume that you are buying a mining bond from an IPO.You are paying some premium so that issuer can reduce their risks. Then , you will get some dividends. But after some time your dividend decreases first. Then your share price decrease may be much more than dividend decrease rate. So , It is really a complex equation that you will get at least your initial cost buying this mining bond.
Mining companies are a little bit softer than bonds. They reinvest some of their gains to cover the profit decreasing. But same threat still is there.

By the way I am not blaming Issuers of mining bonds or companies , because it is not their fault. It is just because of nature of mining.

6) I - normally - trade in some exchanges , why do I invest your fund while I can do the same?

Yep, at first glance , you seem right. But this is a share, you can gain profit just for selling it at some point ( assuming share price will increase) or vice versa sometimes  you can get cheap shares.
Also by investing this fund , you can make some risk management just by distributing your capital to different instruments.


7) Which exchanges will you trade at?

At the moment, I am planning to trade ;
mostly BTC-E (%80-%90)
then Vircurex (%10-%20)
Later, maybe I can trade at different exchanges. But I cannot reserve more than 1,000 LTC for a new exchanges due to risks of it

The important part for choosing an exchange or a currency pair for trading is that I need VOLUME rather than VOLATILITY. Volatiliy is good but not enough alone. I need trade VOLUME high so that I can easily trade.
This point of view is valid for all exchanges and all investment instruments.

PS. At the moment , I will not invest LTC-GOLD or LTC-SILVER until they reach a good daily trade volume. Also I will wait for some good feedbacks about the Issuers from investors.

&Dividend Policy

8 ) What do you mean when you are saying "Growth fund"?

I will use this growth fund for:
-trading new currency pairs
-reducing the indicated loss rate(if it reaches threshold)

Also , I think it will affect the share price in a good way

9 ) Will you change your management fee?

Yes , I can/will change my management fee by time.
But , It will not exceed %10 rate , so maybe later in time I can reduce to rate 8% for some reason. I think , It will fluctuate between 5% and 10%.
Also,  I reserve the right to set it  back to 10% , after reducing management fee rate to some level.

&Profit Calculation

10) I understand net profit/loss , but I cannot understand open orders , could you please explain a little bit more?

When I say open orders , I basically mean I have some money/asset other than LTC and yet I have not sell it for LTC.

For example, I had an order for buying 0.3  BTC at an exchange rate LTC/BTC  0.003. So , I paid for it 100 LTC. As I have BTC , it will be evaluated as open order.

For profit calculation , I will assume I have 100 LTC whatever the exchange rate is .

For Indicated  calculation, I will recalculate the 0.3 BTC at market price. Let's again say our new price is 0.0032. Then , I will change my LTC to 93,75 from 100. So , investors can see the actual value of the fund.

Let's keep going , If loss rate reaches to some level -for example- 6 %(for applying our situation) , then growth fund will added to this open order and profit of the growth fund will be added to open order to reduce the possible loss.

Lets say , I have 20 LTC as growth fund , then I will add this to my open order. According to my trading strategy , I can buy some BTC from current rate 0.0032

I will have 0.064 BTC more , so my total BTC will be 0.364 by paying 120 LTC. Then , when rate decreases to  0.0315 , I will convert my 0.063 ( not 0.064)  BTC to LTC to get 20 LTC( growth fund). So,  I will have 20 LTC again  as a growth fund , but I will have 0.301 BTC by adding last trade's profit. By doing that , my new indicated value , for 0.301 BTC at a currency rate (let's say , after our last trade rate is backed to 0.032) will be as 94,0625 LTC( old one was 93,75)
So , as you can see, our loss has been a little bit covered.

PS. I ignored trade fees , to explain and calculate the situaation easily

This is how the system works. I did no mention the indicated profit case intentionally , since there is nothing that would be a problem

11) What if your indicated calculation is much more less than the actual bought price?

I have just explained above

12) What is your profit estimation about your fund?

First , I cannot give any guarantee about profitability.

But my aim is about to get approximately 100% in a year.
However , this is not a PROMISE , I cannot be responsible for this estimation. This is just for answering the question.
Also , keep in mind that there maybe some weeks that fund will have net losses.
full member
Activity: 132
Merit: 100
/*IPO HAS JUST FINISHED*/

Hi everyone,

I want to introduce my first fund to you. I was considering the details of it  for a long time. Now , I have a draft version of the contract. If you have any reasonable suggestion , please do not hesitate. I plan to clarify the contract until Friday. I do not know the economical terms exactly so I can do mistakes , please correct me if you catch one.
I have already posted it to the Litecoin forum , to get more interest Im copying to here

/*Sorry for typos or ambigious statements , please tell me if you got one since text is so long I read a few times , but  I can still miss them*/

https://www.litecoinglobal.com/security?s=EMIF.LTC-TRADING

Exchanger’s Micro Investment Funds/LTC Trading:

Abstract:
This contract explains the EMIF LTC TRADING FUND. This is an investment fund which the equity capital will be mainly  invested LTC/Other cryptocurrencies.
Profits –if any-  will be paid out weekly .
If this funds closes for any reasons , the capital left in the vault will be distributed to shareholders according to holdings of the shares.

Introduction:
EMIF LTC TRADING fund is the first fund issued by EMIF.
This fund mainly trades with other cryptocurrencies and mostly with BTC. But this can be enlarged to fiat currencies and also commodities like GOLD SILVER PLATINIUM. The issuer reserves the right trading LTC-GLOBAL assets or other LTC stock exchange assets.
At the moment, issuer will not trade or buy mining bonds or mining companies’ shares.

Trading Terms:
Planned trading strategy will be like following:

20% of the capital will be left on the issuers account
80 % of the fund will be used for trading

The percentage of the trading fund will be as the following.

80 % will be reserved for BTC/ LTC trading
10 % will be reserved for USD/ LTC trading
10 % will be reserved for DVC/LTC  trading /* I know this is not a good choice , just for diversifying the fund - can be changed with alt.*/
The issuers reserve to trade with other currency or fund pairs: Like SILVER funds or gold funds or new PPC/LTC currency pairs

Dividend Policy:
Dividends will be paid out  weekly (Sunday most probably)  ( may change slightly 1-2 days at most)

If any net loss happens, then there will be no dividend for that specific week.
In this case there will be no management fee.

If any net profit happens, then;
   If total capital (current capital ) >= equity capital(capital collected from shareholders during IPOs)
80 % of the profit will be paid out as dividends.
10 % of the profit will be reserved for fund growth
10 % of the profit will be taken as management fee.

        If total capital (current capital ) < equity capital(capital collected from shareholders during IPOs)
50 % of the profit will be reserved as fund recovery
45 % of the profit will be paid out as dividends
 5 % of the profit will be taken as management fee.

Dividend Policy Example: Let 10,000 LTC be our equity capital.

At the end of  first week, we get 250 LTC net profit
=> Dividend will be paid as follows
200 LTC will be paid out as dividend
25 LTC is added to fund for growth
25 LTC will be taken as management fee.

In the beginning of the second week, Fund has 10,025 LTC 10,000 of it as equity capital and 25 LTC is growth fund
For second week, we get 425 LTC loss
Then, there is no dividend will be paid out
Also there is no management fee for that week

In the beginning of the third week, Fund has 9,600 LTC  9,600 of it as equity capital and 0  LTC is growth fund
For third week, we get 500 LTC net profit
=> Dividend will be paid as follows
250 LTC will be paid out as dividend
225 LTC is added to fund for growth
25 LTC will be taken as management fee.

In the beginning of the fourth  week , Fund has 9,825  LTC  9,825 of it as equity capital and 0  LTC is growth fund
For fourth week , we get 600  LTC net profit
=> Dividend will be paid as follows
300 LTC will be paid out as dividend
270 LTC is added to fund for growth
30 LTC will be taken as management fee.

In the beginning of the fifth  week , Fund has 10,095  LTC  10,000 of it as equity capital and 95  LTC is growth  fund
For fifth week , we get 500LTC net profit
=> Dividend will be paid as follows
400 LTC will be paid out as dividend
50 LTC is added to fund for growth
50 LTC will be taken as management fee.
And so on…


Profit Calculation:
Profit calculation as follows:
1) Only completed positions will be evaluated as profits or losses
(Completed positions: This includes two orders first buy other currency other than LTC then sell it again to convert LTC)
Ex: If fund buys 3.5 BTC at ratio LTC/BTC 0.0035 with 1000 LTC; then if it sells 3.3 BTC at ratio LTC/BTC 0.03, it will get 1100 LTC and (1100 – 1000=100) 100 LTC will be net profit for this completed position.
2) Open positions (LTC side) : If any active orders in LTC side meaning buying other cryptocurrency , then they are accounted as it is
3) Open positions (other side): Well, for profit calculation only buying price will be taken into account. Even if price is too high or too low, it does not affect the profit for that week. But accounting/indication purposes, it will be listed as actual value to see the current situation). If possible loss passes some threshold percentage, then growth fund will be used to compensate that specific possible losses.



IPO procedure & Rules:

When I first tend to publicize  this fund, my initial thought was that  IPO might be 25,000 LTC.
The IPO will continue only 2 days , after 2 days all remaining shares will be withdrawn until next week for respecting early buyers.

IPO price will be 0.5 LTC
20,000 shares(10,000 LTC) will be issued. If it finishes earlier , I will issue 2,000 shares with same price 0,5 LTC and If it finishes again , I will issue 2,000 shares more until we reach 50,000 shares or end of Sunday (which one is quicker).

Issuer reserves the right to buying priority of 10 % of issued shares.
It means Issuer right to buy at same price before IPO, If he wants more shares he will buy from the market with market price.
This is valid for all shares that will be issued from starting of the fund to the end.


My current thought about the IPO is as the following:
First issue 10,000 LTC,
If it finishes fast ,
Then;
Issue 1,000 LTC piece,
Whenever 1,000 LTC piece finishes issue , one more 1,000 piece until it reaches 25,000 LTC

Risks :

There are some risks related with issuer and nature of fund
Issuer’s Risks:

Default Risk: There is a very small risk that this fund can default since Issuer
will just only trade with other cryptocurrencies. The only risk  related big
loss is that market can go crazy , and Issuer can be caught at wrong position
and have a big loss.To reduce this risk, Issuer will use some risk management
strategies like investing different kind currencies , buying or selling
gradually or other strategies.
However, if loss reaches a certain rate for ex: %50 of equity capital , there
can be a motion for liquidation . If motion passes , then liquidation will start
immediately.

Fund’s Risks:

Default of Exchange Websites: Issuer cannot give any guarantee for that
website's operation. And Issuer cannot be responsible for that websites.
Issuer's responsibility is limited choosing proper exchange sites. Other than
that Issuer cannot be responsible for loss due to exchange websites' loss.

Profitability Risk: Issuer can not give any profit guarantee for any specific
time interval. This is not a bond. The only guarantee Issuer can give is trying
best for investors' interest.

Closing of the Operation:
Issuer reserves the right to stop the operation of the fund for the following reasons:

1) Issuer can stop the operation due to its becoming unprofitable
2) Issuer can stop the operation due to illness or other severe health or llife problems
3) Issuer can stop the operation due to issuer's not having enough time for managing the fund
4) Issuer can stop the operation for any other reason not mentioned above

For 1-3th reasons ; Issuer can stop the fund immediately .For  other reasons , Issuer will operate the fund at least 1 month after declaring closing the operation.

Liquidation of the Fund: When liquidation happens , all the LTC in the fund's vault will be paid to shareholders according to their shares
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