Author

Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion - page 31745. (Read 26710696 times)

legendary
Activity: 1008
Merit: 1003
WePower.red
422 coin buy on stamp.. wooo that guy is feeling bullish

1k+. There will be ATH at stamp in a seconds.
hero member
Activity: 574
Merit: 500
422 coin buy on stamp.. wooo that guy is feeling bullish
newbie
Activity: 33
Merit: 0
To get a loan - or not to get a loan.  That is the question.

I've only got 20% of my savings in BTC at the moment, but that was all the free cash I had and everything is else tied up in tax efficient savings/funds.  So if I want to bring more fiat in quickly to catch this rocket I either need to liquidate something or take out a loan.  I can get £7.5K @4.9% on a one year loan, with a 2 month payment holiday at the start and no early redemption penalty, which would take BTC up to 50% of my portfolio (poncey word, but you know what I mean).  Is this a risk too far - or a no-brainer?


If you do that you're seriously an idiot. Regardless whether you have a hunch there will be a bitcoin rally, that's something only the biggest idiot would do. You'd beat yourself to death if your plan fails...Maybe people just like to live life on the edge. I like a little risk because traditional investments are too slow for me, so i chose bitcoin. But I'd never take out a loan to invest in something (unless I had insider info or something lol)

Like I said, it's a choice of liquidating existing savings which I can afford to lose - or getting a loan which offers a chance of achieving the same level of holding, in an instrument that "may" appreciate at such a rate that I can repay within the holiday period.  If not, I cash out my savings.  It's just time shifting, not increasing any risk.  Anyway, what's with this idea that people don't borrow to invest isn't that what leverage is all about?

If you've got the choice, then get the money out of your savings. Take money out of savings which is earning you probably no more than 2% interest, or get a loan out on which you must pay 5% interest? Dude, this is a no brainer.
full member
Activity: 202
Merit: 100
To get a loan - or not to get a loan.  That is the question.

I've only got 20% of my savings in BTC at the moment, but that was all the free cash I had and everything is else tied up in tax efficient savings/funds.  So if I want to bring more fiat in quickly to catch this rocket I either need to liquidate something or take out a loan.  I can get £7.5K @4.9% on a one year loan, with a 2 month payment holiday at the start and no early redemption penalty, which would take BTC up to 50% of my portfolio (poncey word, but you know what I mean).  Is this a risk too far - or a no-brainer?


If you do that you're seriously an idiot. Regardless whether you have a hunch there will be a bitcoin rally, that's something only the biggest idiot would do. You'd beat yourself to death if your plan fails...Maybe people just like to live life on the edge. I like a little risk because traditional investments are too slow for me, so i chose bitcoin. But I'd never take out a loan to invest in something (unless I had insider info or something lol)

If you have a mortgage and put some fiat into Bitcoin, You are essentially not paying off your debt by choice and using that money for high risk bitcoin speculation.
I should think many people fall into this category. Each month you are paying extra interest charges to invest in bitcoin.
It doesn't sound as bad as when you say 'borrowing money to speculate on bitcoin', but essentially it is the same thing.



Well put, and exactly my situation.  I've got an interest only mortgage - I'm already "gambling" on property (which in London is a pretty safe bet)
full member
Activity: 202
Merit: 100
To get a loan - or not to get a loan.  That is the question.

I've only got 20% of my savings in BTC at the moment, but that was all the free cash I had and everything is else tied up in tax efficient savings/funds.  So if I want to bring more fiat in quickly to catch this rocket I either need to liquidate something or take out a loan.  I can get £7.5K @4.9% on a one year loan, with a 2 month payment holiday at the start and no early redemption penalty, which would take BTC up to 50% of my portfolio (poncey word, but you know what I mean).  Is this a risk too far - or a no-brainer?


If you do that you're seriously an idiot. Regardless whether you have a hunch there will be a bitcoin rally, that's something only the biggest idiot would do. You'd beat yourself to death if your plan fails...Maybe people just like to live life on the edge. I like a little risk because traditional investments are too slow for me, so i chose bitcoin. But I'd never take out a loan to invest in something (unless I had insider info or something lol)

Like I said, it's a choice of liquidating existing savings which I can afford to lose - or getting a loan which offers a chance of achieving the same level of holding, in an instrument that "may" appreciate at such a rate that I can repay within the holiday period.  If not, I cash out my savings.  It's just time shifting, not increasing any risk.  Anyway, what's with this idea that people don't borrow to invest isn't that what leverage is all about?
legendary
Activity: 2380
Merit: 1823
1CBuddyxy4FerT3hzMmi1Jz48ESzRw1ZzZ
sr. member
Activity: 365
Merit: 250

In March 23 the H price was ~11% above the trendline and today it is ~127%. Bitcoin is a tiger, though.

You are right, is more vertical this time, but the risk of being outside far exceeds the risk of a stop loss on the worst case scenario.
full member
Activity: 238
Merit: 100
This loan thing is depending what is the situation. It's dumb to say that investing loaned money is absolutely wrong or that it's right. Many people spend rest of their lives in debt hell and investing some of that to bitcoin might be the way to get rid of that debt. There's risk but you have to calculate those risks based on your situation.
hero member
Activity: 770
Merit: 501
Monday I executed a wire at Bitstamp and I still don't have anything credited on my Stamp account yet. Am i the only one in this case?
No.
Thanks for the answer.
It's weird because I have executed a wire Wednesday too and that one was credited yesterday.
perhaps it was because of their recent banking software issues that a lot of transfers are still on the line
some newbie on bitstamp wall observer thread (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=182568.960)
mentioned same problem, would be the best if you report the problem here: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/bitstamp-sepa-account-no-transfer-countriesbanks-list-upd-2014-10-14-270716
(just noticed another user with same issue)
full member
Activity: 202
Merit: 100
To get a loan - or not to get a loan.  That is the question.

I've only got 20% of my savings in BTC at the moment, but that was all the free cash I had and everything is else tied up in tax efficient savings/funds.  So if I want to bring more fiat in quickly to catch this rocket I either need to liquidate something or take out a loan.  I can get £7.5K @4.9% on a one year loan, with a 2 month payment holiday at the start and no early redemption penalty, which would take BTC up to 50% of my portfolio (poncey word, but you know what I mean).  Is this a risk too far - or a no-brainer?


I have done something similar, I save a few hundred pounds a month and decided instead of saving and buying coins as I go, I would stop saving and take out a loan and put the loan into bitcoin, I just missed the <$150 boat by 3 days otherwise I would have paid off that £10k loan easily. It's cool though, If bitcoin crashes and burns, 10k is something I can handle to repay and learn as a life lesson, especially when the opposite (bitcoin going to da moon) could allow me to retire wealthy within the next 5 years. Risk assessed, accepted, coins purchased.

Yeh, that's the way I'm seeing it.  If I'm lucky/time my entry well it could pay off fast, if not, I cash out my savings, pay off the loan, hold and pray.
legendary
Activity: 861
Merit: 1010
Monday I executed a wire at Bitstamp and I still don't have anything credited on my Stamp account yet. Am i the only one in this case?
No.
Thanks for the answer.

It's weird because I have executed a wire Wednesday too and that one was credited yesterday.
full member
Activity: 202
Merit: 100
To get a loan - or not to get a loan.  That is the question.

I've only got 20% of my savings in BTC at the moment, but that was all the free cash I had and everything is else tied up in tax efficient savings/funds.  So if I want to bring more fiat in quickly to catch this rocket I either need to liquidate something or take out a loan.  I can get £7.5K @4.9% on a one year loan, with a 2 month payment holiday at the start and no early redemption penalty, which would take BTC up to 50% of my portfolio (poncey word, but you know what I mean).  Is this a risk too far - or a no-brainer?


This is very risky, yet the odds seem to be good. For me, going into any sort of debt, or obligation to get BTC (or anything else, which I don't need for immediate survival) is unacceptable, so I wouldn't do it.

I would, however, throw all the free resources, which I can afford to lose without the loss causing financial or emotional damage, at BTC Smiley

Alternatively, just treat BTC like an experimental savings account. Keep saving a part of your income in it and ride the choo-choo train!

Funny, cos that was how I was brought up, but I've never had a problem taking out a loan (for a boat or whatever) as long as I'm debt free at the time, which I am at the moment.  It would just be a way of speeding things up, with at least the chance that I could return the principal in 2 months at almost no cost.
hero member
Activity: 750
Merit: 601
To get a loan - or not to get a loan.  That is the question.

I've only got 20% of my savings in BTC at the moment, but that was all the free cash I had and everything is else tied up in tax efficient savings/funds.  So if I want to bring more fiat in quickly to catch this rocket I either need to liquidate something or take out a loan.  I can get £7.5K @4.9% on a one year loan, with a 2 month payment holiday at the start and no early redemption penalty, which would take BTC up to 50% of my portfolio (poncey word, but you know what I mean).  Is this a risk too far - or a no-brainer?


If you do that you're seriously an idiot. Regardless whether you have a hunch there will be a bitcoin rally, that's something only the biggest idiot would do. You'd beat yourself to death if your plan fails...Maybe people just like to live life on the edge. I like a little risk because traditional investments are too slow for me, so i chose bitcoin. But I'd never take out a loan to invest in something (unless I had insider info or something lol)

If you have a mortgage and put some fiat into Bitcoin, You are essentially not paying off your debt by choice and using that money for high risk bitcoin speculation.
I should think many people fall into this category. Each month you are paying extra interest charges to invest in bitcoin.
It doesn't sound as bad as when you say 'borrowing money to speculate on bitcoin', but essentially it is the same thing.

sr. member
Activity: 406
Merit: 286
Neptune, Scalable Privacy
Monday I executed a wire at Bitstamp and I still don't have anything credited on my Stamp account yet. Am i the only one in this case?
No.
legendary
Activity: 861
Merit: 1010
Monday I executed a wire to Bitstamp and I still don't have anything credited on my Stamp account yet. Am I the only one in this case?
member
Activity: 69
Merit: 10
To get a loan - or not to get a loan.  That is the question.

I've only got 20% of my savings in BTC at the moment, but that was all the free cash I had and everything is else tied up in tax efficient savings/funds.  So if I want to bring more fiat in quickly to catch this rocket I either need to liquidate something or take out a loan.  I can get £7.5K @4.9% on a one year loan, with a 2 month payment holiday at the start and no early redemption penalty, which would take BTC up to 50% of my portfolio (poncey word, but you know what I mean).  Is this a risk too far - or a no-brainer?


If you have other assets of equivalent value you could liquidate you are not making yourself a debt slave forever, even if bitcoin suffers catastrophic failure.

The potential reward remains huge while my gut says the risk of failure is much smaller by comparison, even if I cannot say what that risk is.

If you feel underweight in bitcoin, buy some more. To most of us it seems a rare opportunity.

hero member
Activity: 504
Merit: 500
To get a loan - or not to get a loan.  That is the question.

I've only got 20% of my savings in BTC at the moment, but that was all the free cash I had and everything is else tied up in tax efficient savings/funds.  So if I want to bring more fiat in quickly to catch this rocket I either need to liquidate something or take out a loan.  I can get £7.5K @4.9% on a one year loan, with a 2 month payment holiday at the start and no early redemption penalty, which would take BTC up to 50% of my portfolio (poncey word, but you know what I mean).  Is this a risk too far - or a no-brainer?


If you do that you're seriously an idiot. Regardless whether you have a hunch there will be a bitcoin rally, that's something only the biggest idiot would do. You'd beat yourself to death if your plan fails...Maybe people just like to live life on the edge. I like a little risk because traditional investments are too slow for me, so i chose bitcoin. But I'd never take out a loan to invest in something (unless I had insider info or something lol)
hero member
Activity: 496
Merit: 500
Spanish Bitcoin trader
The crash-talkers worked on the assumption that Bitcoin gains stability with size, therefore -50% would be the new crash, whereas it used to be -80%.

What bears fail to realize is that Bitcoin is more unstable as it gains value.

Therefore, -50% is the new correction.
newbie
Activity: 39
Merit: 0

In March 23 the H price was ~11% above the trendline and today it is ~127%. Bitcoin is a tiger, though.
hero member
Activity: 841
Merit: 1000
Nice P-formations forming on Bitstamp Cool
Jump to: