Sounds like a thread or wiki entry summerising and ranking the various banks is needed.
Here's the list:
ALL BANKS SUCK!
Use bitcoin instead.
Topic: Major Dutch bank blocks bitcoin purchases (Read 6000 times)
hero member
Activity: 836
Merit: 1007
"How do you eat an elephant? One bit at a time..."
Here's the list:
ALL BANKS SUCK!
Use bitcoin instead.
Sounds like a thread or wiki entry summerising and ranking the various banks is needed.
While there is a lot to cover if we can identify the least worst that will be very useful. The SEPA zone is at least a good example of competition.
UK:
Last seen Intersango with Metrobank following dumping Lloyds.
While there is a lot to cover if we can identify the least worst that will be very useful. The SEPA zone is at least a good example of competition.
UK:
Last seen Intersango with Metrobank following dumping Lloyds.
We had a bank account with Commerzbank in Germany. They froze about €1000 and closed the account. When I called them and asked questions they would say they were not required to tell me anything and just hang up the phone. I still can't believe I would be treated that way as a customer.
Then I went to the bank branch in person. All I could get was an account statement to see the latest incoming transfers, but they insisted that the €1000 would be returned to the originating phished bank account, and that it was part of our contract with them that we should suffer the loss.
Hey, I just received a handwritten christmas card from the branch leader. They have humor. Then I went to the bank branch in person. All I could get was an account statement to see the latest incoming transfers, but they insisted that the €1000 would be returned to the originating phished bank account, and that it was part of our contract with them that we should suffer the loss.
Just read about some bank called Deutsche bank and about some kind of police raid.
Source or it didn't happen.
Quite easy to spot...
http://mediacenter.dw.de/english/video/item/767549/German_police_raid_Deutsche_Bank/
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/international-business/police-raid-deutsche-bank-in-tax-fraud-probe-company/articleshow/17586699.cms
http://www.france24.com/en/20121212-police-raid-deutsche-bank-tax-fraud-probe
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/66d8a6be-4447-11e2-952a-00144feabdc0.html#axzz2ErtWW2AL
Just read about some bank called Deutsche bank and about some kind of police raid.
Source or it didn't happen.
legendary
Activity: 1862
Merit: 1011
Reverse engineer from time to time
Just read about some bank called Deutsche bank and about some kind of police raid.
You're quoting me out of context, to make your self look good. Well, good luck with your further discussion in this thread.
Ok champ, whatever, I shared my experience with the OP, he said it was helpful, so I'm happy about it. Have a good one. I've used phones several times. But there's no point in discussing with people like you who clearly have a problem with civilized adult discussions. Show no respect, and talk out of your ass, and the same thing comes back to you. Next time, what about trying to answer in a polite way, I can't know what you're thinking in your mind. And I don't see what's the big problem by answering more rationally and calmly, like an adult.
I've stated facts, shown you where to check them, yet I take your statement as a load of bull.
so maybe you want to check your own tone before complaining that you can't have a "civilized adult conversation".
You're quoting me out of context, to make your self look good. Well, good luck with your further discussion in this thread.
This thread cracks me up. Wasn't bitcoin created as an alternative to banks? I think Satoshi is beating his head against a wall right about now. Instead of trying to figure out how to use bitcoin with banks, figure out how to use bitcoin without banks.
My two bit-cents.
Very good point. The issue is liquidity. Most people consider something exchanged with fiat currency as liquid, but other assets are fairly liquid as well. It will take time for Bitcoin to become recognized as a currency unto itself. Hopefully folks will find other means of exchanging Bitcoin for assets they want. With the ability of 2-party escrow, now is the time for creative finance ideas to form. For instance, I imagine private lenders like pawn shops can form networks to provide competitive lending for higher risk customers.My two bit-cents.
On the other hand, Bitcoin is an opportunity for banks to be competitive. Eventually the bailout money will run dry and banks will be forced to work for their paychecks. Bitcoin will look better to them by cutting administration costs.
I've used phones several times. But there's no point in discussing with people like you who clearly have a problem with civilized adult discussions. Show no respect, and talk out of your ass, and the same thing comes back to you. Next time, what about trying to answer in a polite way, I can't know what you're thinking in your mind. And I don't see what's the big problem by answering more rationally and calmly, like an adult.
I've stated facts, shown you where to check them, yet I take your statement as a load of bull.
so maybe you want to check your own tone before complaining that you can't have a "civilized adult conversation".
With lots of business practise in said field, I can assure you that banks are a pain in the ass to deal with.
No shit sherlock.Most of the time a small bitcoin company doesn't have the resources to hire expensive lawyers.
Who said you had to hire expensive lawyers to solve problems? A telephone is a very powerful tool when used correctly.Until proven otherwise, I take your statement as a load of bull.
See the thread I linked in the first page. That's actual experience. It's in French but hey, it's 2012, so Google translate buddy.I've used phones several times. But there's no point in discussing with people like you who clearly have a problem with civilized adult discussions. Show no respect, and talk out of your ass, and the same thing comes back to you. Next time, what about trying to answer in a polite way, I can't know what you're thinking in your mind. And I don't see what's the big problem by answering more rationally and calmly, like an adult.
With lots of business practise in said field, I can assure you that banks are a pain in the ass to deal with.
No shit sherlock.Most of the time a small bitcoin company doesn't have the resources to hire expensive lawyers.
Who said you had to hire expensive lawyers to solve problems? A telephone is a very powerful tool when used correctly.Until proven otherwise, I take your statement as a load of bull.
See the thread I linked in the first page. That's actual experience. It's in French but hey, it's 2012, so Google translate buddy. OK, please fill me in with what the opposite consists of.
Well, read the thread Such is done.
With lots of business practise in said field, I can assure you that banks are a pain in the ass to deal with. Most of the time a small bitcoin company doesn't have the resources to hire expensive lawyers.
Until proven otherwise, I take your statement as a load of bull.
OK, please fill me in with what the opposite consists of.
Well, read the thread Someone conducting business through a bank, say a bitcoin business selling bitcoins, trusts that the incoming money is legit, and thus dispatch the bitcoins. Later, when the bitcoin business gets told by the bank that it's a fraudulent purchase, and that the funds needs to be reversed, the bitcoin business has no recourse.
Quite the opposite in fact.OK, please fill me in with what the opposite consists of.
Unfortunately this isn't strictly true.
The recipient bank is legally obligated to honor a recall request if it believes the funds are the proceeds of crime (at least in every jurisdiction I'm familiar with).
The amount of evidence the recipient bank requires to convince them that the funds are the proceeds of crime varies wildly.
Some banks will return any transfer for months afterwards if the sender claims to have been hacked others will require substantial evidence.
Edit: I should note that Intersango's account with BZWBK is effectively blacklisted at all major .NL banks. However customers who call the bank and insist that the transfer be made have been successful despite the blacklist.
They are required to *report* transactions if they believe the funds are of criminal origin, not return them. The recipient bank is legally obligated to honor a recall request if it believes the funds are the proceeds of crime (at least in every jurisdiction I'm familiar with).
The amount of evidence the recipient bank requires to convince them that the funds are the proceeds of crime varies wildly.
Some banks will return any transfer for months afterwards if the sender claims to have been hacked others will require substantial evidence.
Edit: I should note that Intersango's account with BZWBK is effectively blacklisted at all major .NL banks. However customers who call the bank and insist that the transfer be made have been successful despite the blacklist.
but fraudulent transactions are treated differently under some banking systems...
...that aren't wires.
Banks go about substituting actual service with bullshit replacements that are "just as good" all the time, just as any other corporation.
The reason people are questioning this statement is because their own banking systems will reverse a wire transfer in the case of fraud. It's true that you can't generally reverse a legitimate wire transfer without the consent of the receiver (if you wired funds to the wrong person, for instance), but fraudulent transactions are treated differently under some banking systems.
I dealt with banks in both France and Latvia, and always had the same experience, they'll ask you if you're ok to reverse a transfer but they won't do it without your consent. We accepted most reversals because we correctly smellt something fishy going on and locked the funds, but in one case where there was fraud we had to refuse the reversal because that would have resulted in a net loss for us (and no we didn't feel really good about that, but after all, phishing fraud is the bank's problem for having insecure systems in the first place)Unfortunately this isn't strictly true.
The recipient bank is legally obligated to honor a recall request if it believes the funds are the proceeds of crime (at least in every jurisdiction I'm familiar with).
The amount of evidence the recipient bank requires to convince them that the funds are the proceeds of crime varies wildly.
Some banks will return any transfer for months afterwards if the sender claims to have been hacked others will require substantial evidence.
Edit: I should note that Intersango's account with BZWBK is effectively blacklisted at all major .NL banks. However customers who call the bank and insist that the transfer be made have been successful despite the blacklist.
hero member
Activity: 836
Merit: 1007
"How do you eat an elephant? One bit at a time..."
This thread cracks me up. Wasn't bitcoin created as an alternative to banks? I think Satoshi is beating his head against a wall right about now. Instead of trying to figure out how to use bitcoin with banks, figure out how to use bitcoin without banks.
My two bit-cents.
My two bit-cents.
Someone conducting business through a bank, say a bitcoin business selling bitcoins, trusts that the incoming money is legit, and thus dispatch the bitcoins. Later, when the bitcoin business gets told by the bank that it's a fraudulent purchase, and that the funds needs to be reversed, the bitcoin business has no recourse.
Quite the opposite in fact. Jump to: