Topic: Maximum role of Government? - page 27. (Read 28705 times)

Quote from: Hawker on July 09, 2011, 04:35:49 AM

Ever hear of a federated system?

Those multiple competing agencies will all communicate.

We are not talking about agencies. We are talking about the land registry - the place where property ownership is recorded, where banks register mortgages, where rights of way and liens are listed.

Do you visualise multiple competing land registries?

As I said, yes, and they will all ~~communicate~~ talk.

Again you are describing agencies that communicate about the contents of a single registry. Competing registries means that I go to registry 1, register my claim and get a deed that I own the land. You go to registry 2, register your claim to the same area and get a deed that you own the same land.

Would you agree thats a bad idea? And that a single registry of ownership is better?

If I am suggesting multiple agencies that communicate about a single registry. Why are you hung up on disproving a concept I am not suggesting?

Are you that focused on being right?

Fine. Yes, multiple registries is a bad idea. But that does not preclude multiple registrars.

So we are agreed you need have 1 land ownership registry. To arbitrate disputes about ownership, you will need a court system and it will need police to enforce decisions like re-possessions.

Sounds like you are rebuilding the state one basic right at a time

myrkul

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Quote from: myrkul on July 09, 2011, 04:05:16 AM

Quote from: myrkul on July 09, 2011, 04:05:16 AM

Ever hear of a federated system?

Those multiple competing agencies will all communicate.

We are not talking about agencies. We are talking about the land registry - the place where property ownership is recorded, where banks register mortgages, where rights of way and liens are listed.

Do you visualise multiple competing land registries?

As I said, yes, and they will all ~~communicate~~ talk.

Again you are describing agencies that communicate about the contents of a single registry. Competing registries means that I go to registry 1, register my claim and get a deed that I own the land. You go to registry 2, register your claim to the same area and get a deed that you own the same land.

Would you agree thats a bad idea? And that a single registry of ownership is better?

If I am suggesting multiple agencies that communicate about a single registry. Why are you hung up on disproving a concept I am not suggesting?

Are you that focused on being right?

Fine. Yes, multiple registries is a bad idea. But that does not preclude multiple registrars.

Hawker

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Ever hear of a federated system?

Those multiple competing agencies will all communicate.

We are not talking about agencies. We are talking about the land registry - the place where property ownership is recorded, where banks register mortgages, where rights of way and liens are listed.

Do you visualise multiple competing land registries?

As I said, yes, and they will all ~~communicate~~ talk.

Again you are describing agencies that communicate about the contents of a single registry. Competing registries means that I go to registry 1, register my claim and get a deed that I own the land. You go to registry 2, register your claim to the same area and get a deed that you own the same land.

Would you agree thats a bad idea? And that a single registry of ownership is better?

myrkul

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Ever hear of a federated system?

Those multiple competing agencies will all communicate.

We are not talking about agencies. We are talking about the land registry - the place where property ownership is recorded, where banks register mortgages, where rights of way and liens are listed.

Do you visualise multiple competing land registries?

As I said, yes, and they will all ~~communicate~~ talk.

Hawker

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Quote from: MoonShadow on July 08, 2011, 07:26:39 PM

Ever hear of a federated system?

Those multiple competing agencies will all communicate.

We are not talking about agencies. We are talking about the land registry - the place where property ownership is recorded, where banks register mortgages, where rights of way and liens are listed.

Do you visualise multiple competing land registries?

myrkul

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Ever hear of a federated system?

Those multiple competing agencies will all communicate.

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That's the theory, but the practice doesn't seem to really hold water. It's based entirely upon the business model that new drugs are priced at the cost of production plus a portion of the costs of research, which is how it actually works today. However, there could be, and likely are, better ways to mitigate the financial risks of research. For example, you never pay for UL testing, producers pay for that. Why would they do this? Because their insurance is cheaper. They either pay UL to test their products for public safety and function, or they pay much more in insurance premiums. It's a kind of subscription service. Likewise, insurance companies, or health care foundations, could fund the research using a subscription model.

No, the drugs are priced based on what the market will pay for them. Nothing else.
Are there better ways of doing things? Yes, I believe there is. Does that mean that the current system doesn't work, like someone stated? Absolutely not.
Is your way? Uncertain. You'll have to come up with a system that works in every country, kind of how patents do today.

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Quote from: NghtRppr on July 09, 2011, 03:37:46 AM

Quote from: Hawker on July 09, 2011, 03:35:00 AM

Do tell how a land registry, court system and police to enforce judgements can exist without a state?

The same way you start any other business. What exactly are you having a problem with understanding? It helps if you're a little bit more specific so I don't have to write an entire legal system in response to a single question.

Do you visualise multiple competing land registries, each of which claims to be legitimate and any of which can define whether or not you are the legitimate owner of a property?

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Quote from: Hawker on July 09, 2011, 03:35:00 AM

Do tell how a land registry, court system and police to enforce judgements can exist without a state?

The same way you start any other business. What exactly are you having a problem with understanding? It helps if you're a little bit more specific so I don't have to detail an entire private legal system in response to a single question.

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Quote from: NghtRppr on July 09, 2011, 03:32:18 AM

Quote from: Hawker on July 09, 2011, 02:58:39 AM

To say you own land but don't believe in government is contradictory. Ownership of land means that there are title deeds and a property registry where boundaries are recorded and inheritances / sales are recorded and courts where rights can be upheld.

All of that can exist without a state.

Do tell how a land registry, court system and police to enforce judgements can exist without a state?

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Quote from: Hawker on July 09, 2011, 02:58:39 AM

To say you own land but don't believe in government is contradictory. Ownership of land means that there are title deeds and a property registry where boundaries are recorded and inheritances / sales are recorded and courts where rights can be upheld.

All of that can exist without a state.

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Quote from: Hawker on July 09, 2011, 02:58:39 AM

Quote from: NghtRppr on July 09, 2011, 02:41:54 AM

Quote from: NghtRppr on July 09, 2011, 02:41:54 AM

You own property if there is a government. Otherwise, its not yours - its simply a place no-one with a bigger militia has taken off you yet.

Until another government with a bigger army does the same thing. Governments aren't magical. They have the same weaknesses that any private system has plus the added handicap of not being subject to market forces.

To say you own land but don't believe in government is contradictory. Ownership of land means that there are title deeds and a property registry where boundaries are recorded and inheritances / sales are recorded and courts where rights can be upheld.

Uhm... no. Those are the means that government uses to record ownership. And land documentation can be provided for privately, as well.

Hawker

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You own property if there is a government. Otherwise, its not yours - its simply a place no-one with a bigger militia has taken off you yet.

Until another government with a bigger army does the same thing. Governments aren't magical. They have the same weaknesses that any private system has plus the added handicap of not being subject to market forces.

To say you own land but don't believe in government is contradictory. Ownership of land means that there are title deeds and a property registry where boundaries are recorded and inheritances / sales are recorded and courts where rights can be upheld.

myrkul

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Quote from: NghtRppr on July 08, 2011, 11:34:09 PM

Quote from: ascent on July 08, 2011, 11:18:40 PM

I apparently can't tell my landlord "No, thank you" to renting the extra 50 square feet in my bedroom that I do not use. Yet I don't accuse them of anything. I can move if I want.

The landlord owns his property. The government doesn't own my property.

My house, my rules. vs. Your house, my rules.

You own property if there is a government. Otherwise, its not yours - its simply a place no-one with a bigger militia has taken off you yet.

https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Eminent_domain

You were saying?

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