MC2: A cryptocurrency based on a hybrid PoW/PoS system - page 37.

xwebnetwork

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Veni. Vidi. Vici.

Quote from: mercSuey on May 16, 2013, 07:01:25 AM

Quote from: digicoin on May 16, 2013, 06:49:03 AM

Quote from: xwebnetwork on May 16, 2013, 06:31:44 AM

Netcoin's source will not be immediately released. It will be delayed in order to initially prevent such duplication.

An open source coin is attractive because it has nothing to hide. Everything is transparent. If you release its binary version only, you have a problem. If you are a government, I trust in you. If you are a person whom I don't meet each other once in my life, why do I need to believe in you.

Belief is a big issue in releasing a cryptocoin.

This forum is becoming messy and noisy because it is unmoderated. Anyone can create a coin and post an announcement.

If I am a moderator of this forum, I will divide it into 2 forums.

+ Certified altcoin which discusses about the first truly innovative coins: PPCoin, NetCoin, LiteCoin ... Innovators are appreciated
+ Experimental altcoin which discusses about the others: copy-cats will be discussed here and they will never become a mainstream ones. Copiers are un-appreciated

Just because it's open source doesn't mean it isn't proprietary. The virtue of open source is a double edged sword since anyone is free to modify and mimic the product for themselves, so that uniqueness and originality are valuable commodities for developers. This is their idea. It will be released as their own. And the source will be released when the time is right, I'm sure. Thus, transparency will follow accordingly, once they get the notoriety they deserve from said launch. Delaying the release of the source is the right move and I would do the same for my own launch.

Don't forget, this is Taco's brainchild, not mine and if his reputation doesn't speak for itself, I don't know what will. However, as I have mentioned, the source will only be delayed until everything possible bug/issue is worked out. Once the crypto has established itself as a viable option, the data will be released accordingly.

mercSuey

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Quote from: digicoin on May 16, 2013, 06:49:03 AM

Quote from: xwebnetwork on May 16, 2013, 06:31:44 AM

Netcoin's source will not be immediately released. It will be delayed in order to initially prevent such duplication.

An open source coin is attractive because it has nothing to hide. Everything is transparent. If you release its binary version only, you have a problem. If you are a government, I trust in you. If you are a person whom I don't meet each other once in my life, why do I need to believe in you.

Belief is a big issue in releasing a cryptocoin.

This forum is becoming messy and noisy because it is unmoderated. Anyone can create a coin and post an announcement.

If I am a moderator of this forum, I will divide it into 2 forums.

+ Certified altcoin which discusses about the first truly innovative coins: PPCoin, NetCoin, LiteCoin ... Innovators are appreciated
+ Experimental altcoin which discusses about the others: copy-cats will be discussed here and they will never become a mainstream ones. Copiers are un-appreciated

Just because it's open source doesn't mean it isn't proprietary. The virtue of open source is a double edged sword since anyone is free to modify and mimic the product for themselves, so that uniqueness and originality are valuable commodities for developers. This is their idea. It will be released as their own. And the source will be released when the time is right, I'm sure. Thus, transparency will follow accordingly, once they get the notoriety they deserve from said launch. Delaying the release of the source is the right move and I would do the same for my own launch.

digicoin

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Quote from: xwebnetwork on May 16, 2013, 06:31:44 AM

Netcoin's source will not be immediately released. It will be delayed in order to initially prevent such duplication.

An open source coin is attractive because it has nothing to hide. Everything is transparent. If you release its binary version only, you have a problem. If you are a government, I trust in you. If you are a person whom I don't meet each other once in my life, why do I need to believe in you.

Belief is a big issue in releasing a cryptocoin.

This forum is becoming messy and noisy because it is unmoderated. Anyone can create a coin and post an announcement.

If I am a moderator of this forum, I will divide it into 2 forums.

+ Certified altcoin which discusses about the first truly innovative coins: PPCoin, NetCoin, LiteCoin ... Innovators are appreciated
+ Experimental altcoin which discusses about the others: copy-cats will be discussed here and they will never become a mainstream ones. Copiers are un-appreciated

xwebnetwork

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Veni. Vidi. Vici.

Netcoin's source will not be immediately released. It will be delayed in order to initially prevent such duplication.

digicoin

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Every altcoin is deflationary currency at the moment because they are copies of Bitcoin (except PPCoin).

If Netcoin is a deflationary one, somebody will copy it. And a new currency is born.
If Netcoin is a inflationary one, somebody will ....

Money and too much counterfeit money are big problems because counterfeit money can make people untrust on what they hold

I believe that current altcoins are dead. Not sure about Netcoin

cunicula

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Quote from: thesnoo23 on May 15, 2013, 11:02:21 AM

Quote from: cunicula on May 15, 2013, 03:24:27 AM

Quote from: thesnoo23 on May 14, 2013, 10:53:01 AM

Quote from: cunicula on May 14, 2013, 08:25:16 AM

Quote from: thesnoo23 on May 13, 2013, 04:54:54 PM

A new coin has come out that addresses the inflation vs dollar valuation issue. Ela coin is going to launch in like, ~8-9 hours from now, and it increases the block reward based on the network hashrate, as more people mine, each block becomes more valuable. It's not a straight 1:1 increase, but I still think it's a bit over the top. But it's nice to see that people are actually trying

This is a nice idea, but it is a) an extremely resource intensive b) unlikely to have major effects on price volatility. c) undermines the PoW security model

Obviously a) is true, but could you explain your reasoning behind b) and c)?

Not interested in a prolonged discussion because you could learn this by searching old threads. However, quickly.

(b) You cannot adequately support price against a fall in demand.

(c) Bitcoin's block subsidy is large in the currency's infancy and small once the currency is widely used. This is the exact opposite. Price drops make PoW attacks easier.

You're not supposed to 'support' the price of something. It's supposed to rise and fall on its own merits.

and again, with c) you've just repeated yourself. HOW do price drops make PoW attacks easier? By WHAT MECHANISM do price drops enable PoW attacks easier?

I'm not interested in this discussion. Once someone brings "supposed to" into a logic-based analysis, I cut off all further communication. Find some old threads on this or remain ignorant. It is up to you.

thesnoo23

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Quote from: cunicula on May 15, 2013, 03:24:27 AM

Quote from: thesnoo23 on May 14, 2013, 10:53:01 AM

Quote from: cunicula on May 14, 2013, 08:25:16 AM

Quote from: thesnoo23 on May 13, 2013, 04:54:54 PM

A new coin has come out that addresses the inflation vs dollar valuation issue. Ela coin is going to launch in like, ~8-9 hours from now, and it increases the block reward based on the network hashrate, as more people mine, each block becomes more valuable. It's not a straight 1:1 increase, but I still think it's a bit over the top. But it's nice to see that people are actually trying

This is a nice idea, but it is a) an extremely resource intensive b) unlikely to have major effects on price volatility. c) undermines the PoW security model

Obviously a) is true, but could you explain your reasoning behind b) and c)?

Not interested in a prolonged discussion because you could learn this by searching old threads. However, quickly.

(b) You cannot adequately support price against a fall in demand.

(c) Bitcoin's block subsidy is large in the currency's infancy and small once the currency is widely used. This is the exact opposite. Price drops make PoW attacks easier.

You're not supposed to 'support' the price of something. It's supposed to rise and fall on its own merits.

and again, with c) you've just repeated yourself. HOW do price drops make PoW attacks easier? By WHAT MECHANISM do price drops enable PoW attacks easier?

cunicula

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Quote from: thesnoo23 on May 14, 2013, 10:53:01 AM

Quote from: cunicula on May 14, 2013, 08:25:16 AM

Quote from: thesnoo23 on May 13, 2013, 04:54:54 PM

A new coin has come out that addresses the inflation vs dollar valuation issue. Ela coin is going to launch in like, ~8-9 hours from now, and it increases the block reward based on the network hashrate, as more people mine, each block becomes more valuable. It's not a straight 1:1 increase, but I still think it's a bit over the top. But it's nice to see that people are actually trying

This is a nice idea, but it is a) an extremely resource intensive b) unlikely to have major effects on price volatility. c) undermines the PoW security model

Obviously a) is true, but could you explain your reasoning behind b) and c)?

Not interested in a prolonged discussion because you could learn this by searching old threads. However, quickly.

(b) You cannot adequately support price against a fall in demand.

(c) Bitcoin's block subsidy is large in the currency's infancy and small once the currency is widely used. This is the exact opposite. Price drops make PoW attacks easier.

thesnoo23

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Quote from: cunicula on May 14, 2013, 08:25:16 AM

Quote from: thesnoo23 on May 13, 2013, 04:54:54 PM

A new coin has come out that addresses the inflation vs dollar valuation issue. Ela coin is going to launch in like, ~8-9 hours from now, and it increases the block reward based on the network hashrate, as more people mine, each block becomes more valuable. It's not a straight 1:1 increase, but I still think it's a bit over the top. But it's nice to see that people are actually trying

This is a nice idea, but it is a) an extremely resource intensive b) unlikely to have major effects on price volatility. c) undermines the PoW security model

Obviously a) is true, but could you explain your reasoning behind b) and c)?

cunicula

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Quote from: thesnoo23 on May 13, 2013, 04:54:54 PM

A new coin has come out that addresses the inflation vs dollar valuation issue. Ela coin is going to launch in like, ~8-9 hours from now, and it increases the block reward based on the network hashrate, as more people mine, each block becomes more valuable. It's not a straight 1:1 increase, but I still think it's a bit over the top. But it's nice to see that people are actually trying

This is a nice idea, but it is a) an extremely resource intensive b) unlikely to have major effects on price volatility. c) undermines the PoW security model

PPCoin employs the reverse algorithm, increasing generation when difficulty is low and decreasing generation when difficulty is high. Nonetheless, PPC prices do not seem to be more volatile than other coins. (I think but someone with spare time should do a statistical analysis.)

To credibly address price volatility, you need to introduce derivatives and multiple units of account (coin types) into a single blockchain. One coin can maintain a stable value, while another hypervolatile coin absorbs changes in market capitalization, a third coin may be necessary to allocate the ability to intervene in the monetary system. Holders of the third coin would be paid base on txn fees generated through the use of the stable coin. At the same time, they would be required to make markets for speculators trading in and out of the stable and volatile instruments.

Obviously it is going to be complicated. Stability is likely too ambitious an aim for netcoin.

3Dfilament

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There is an IPO mining release of elacoin, (elastic coin), which just launched past the genesis block as I'm writing this. The start did not include windows binaries, and the start in general was very rough ... so the start is rather flawed ... but ... it is a scrypt fork that incorporates a very low block reward to kick it off, tied to an increase in reward based on total network hashing power, this might be one of the tweaks that can be looked at to incorporate into Netcoin. Also, there is no QT wallet for elacoin, so it's really a bash from the start, but it has some attempts to incorporate some metrics which forestall huge ownership of a large amount of coin early on, which is good for an exchange debut/IPO.

wmikrut

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I like all alt coins... but I am specifically waiting for MC2 to launch Grin

thesnoo23

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A new coin has come out that addresses the inflation vs dollar valuation issue. Ela coin is going to launch in like, ~8-9 hours from now, and it increases the block reward based on the network hashrate, as more people mine, each block becomes more valuable. It's not a straight 1:1 increase, but I still think it's a bit over the top. But it's nice to see that people are actually trying

conv3rsion

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Quote from: BubbleBoy on May 13, 2013, 02:54:11 AM

Quote from: 3Dfilament on May 12, 2013, 11:11:49 PM

Overall psychology in the currency markets is a vile hatred for inflationary fiat currency. So the bitcoin, deflationary, tightly reigned in finite model is well received. Any attempt to "better" bitcoin with more units by some great degree is bad as the current psychology is a true hatred for any model that even speaks to inflationary.

Clearly, an inflationary coin cannot have the same success pathway of Bitcoin, with people simply hoarding it. Maybe just for the first leg, when it starts from zero. After it has reached a decent value, you need to spend it or face the inflation tax.

On the other hand, if the inflation tax is small, it's earned by charities and the result is a decent coin that is stable and drives trade, than it could kill bitcoin for mere practical reasons. Most people are not that dogmatic about inflation and understand full well they shouldn't keep cash as is. "Store of value" is antithetical to "money".

Right. We need a digital gold and a digital currency, and its become somewhat clear they cannot be the same thing. The problem is that even if the coin has permanent inflation (unlike Bitcoin's "still inflating for the rest of our lifetimes" model), a rapid appreciation in value (relative to fiat) will cause the coin to not function as a currency. And, a rapid appreciation in value will happen for any coin that is useful, making it suck, at least temporarily, as a currency. So its difficult problem to solve, regardless of the coin's economics. Having some method for adjusting creation rate in the future, may prove to be quite useful.

Having said all that, Bitcoin has now been around for over 4 years and its time for a legitimate alt coin to be created that actually offers some possible actual improvements. If mining consolidation is really a strong concern (or the strongest concern), the solution is not scrypt (or anything that at best temporarily retards that consolidation), the solution is PoS or a PoS / PoW hybrid. It looks like one with a good implementation may soon be born.

Joerii

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Quote from: tacotime on May 13, 2013, 06:43:06 AM

I have some family related issues going on right now, I will give an update on this when time allows it.

Take your time taco, ( hey, that's your name anyway )

Family and loved ones are infinitly more important than NetCoin

Wepp

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Quote from: tacotime on May 13, 2013, 06:43:06 AM

I have some family related issues going on right now, I will give an update on this when time allows it.

I wish you and yours the best...

tacotime

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I have some family related issues going on right now, I will give an update on this when time allows it.

Impaler

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BubbleBoy: That's the Freicoin model, but even if NetCoin dose not go that route I still see some good experimental potential in this coin concept. Any time an innovative coin is created we have more 'DNA' to cross-pollinate with and try to develop a better protocol.

BubbleBoy

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Quote from: 3Dfilament on May 12, 2013, 11:11:49 PM

Overall psychology in the currency markets is a vile hatred for inflationary fiat currency. So the bitcoin, deflationary, tightly reigned in finite model is well received. Any attempt to "better" bitcoin with more units by some great degree is bad as the current psychology is a true hatred for any model that even speaks to inflationary.

Clearly, an inflationary coin cannot have the same success pathway of Bitcoin, with people simply hoarding it. Maybe just for the first leg, when it starts from zero. After it has reached a decent value, you need to spend it or face the inflation tax.

On the other hand, if the inflation tax is small, it's earned by charities and the result is a decent coin that is stable and drives trade, than it could kill bitcoin for mere practical reasons. Most people are not that dogmatic about inflation and understand full well they shouldn't keep cash as is. "Store of value" is antithetical to "money".

3Dfilament

member

Activity: 92

Merit: 10

Overall psychology in the currency markets is a vile hatred for inflationary fiat currency. So the bitcoin, deflationary, tightly reigned in finite model is well received. Any attempt to "better" bitcoin with more units by some great degree is bad as the current psychology is a true hatred for any model that even speaks to inflationary.

The only way to compete with and compliment bitcoin is to adhere to the basic tenants of the pure bitcoin model and improve on transaction speed, security and provide for a more level playing field for miners as adoption to mine the coin is essential.

And to provide some type of sure fire method, (or really sincere attempt), to "launch" the mining of the coin so as to avoid any stench of "pre-mining" is absolutely and completely required.

Topic: MC2: A cryptocurrency based on a hybrid PoW/PoS system - page 37. (Read 195188 times)