Topic: ★★★ MEMs LIST of GAMBLING SITES ★★★ - page 5. (Read 135032 times)

You're right BRules.

When we had the idea to make a bitcoin lottery, we decided that the lottery should be as most transparent as possible, only this way we can have confidence from our players.

but this discussion made me realize that we should put the jackpot value in the draw details, this way will be easier to the users to follow the jackpots.

Disagree with you here, at their help page there's an explanation of the revenue distribution of their lottery:


so, as the tickets are listed before the draw, you can calculate how much a jackpot worth in a draw. So, they won't be able to put a free ticket without risking to be caught cheating.





In my opinion, when any person use their money to gamble. they are "pouring their money away", but when I decide to risk gambling, I would like to have the bigger reward possible, regards the odds.

When you play in a casino game with the odds of 50% winning, if you win you will receive less than 2x your bet. It really doesn't make me happy. But when playing a lottery having a chance of winning hundreds of thousands times your bet, if I won, it will really makes me happy. That's why I prefer playing lotteries instead gambling on casinos.

yabtcl approved, credit to the site operator for stepping me through his provably fair system.

Site Updates

userlist disabled for non admins / moderators (whoopsie).

users emails only displayed for admins / moderators (whoopsie again).

internal restrictions on what userlist can display (prevent naughty templates).

ssl cert validating disabled for admins and moderators when fetching memslist.txt (some sites force SSL when they have an invalid cert, annoying but still better than no ssl).

existing sites can be updated with a new memslist.txt, for example say I added your site manually myself but now you would like to have a user that is set as the site_owner so you can update descriptions, min & max bets and add new games, well now you can.

Id like to thank royal-casino.pl & yabtcl for the feedback, it all goes to helping make the site better to use.

Sort of related news:

Ive built a rather cool app (imho), but the problem is I was very "un sober" one night and had a rather simple idea on how to expand this app to answer an old gripe of mine.
Even better is, once I add these new extensions to my cool app is it will heavily compliment memslist.txt (I hope).
In keeping with my tradition, its a rather hacked together concept thats better demonstrated than talked about (I ramble), so long story short:
Ive got something cool coming everyone, hope you like it, it may take away a bit of my time here but not for long and when complete it will be a big benefit to the bitcoin community and especially gamblers imho.

Also Ive decide to throw up my other apps on memslist.com under a /memscrap section. For other shit Ive written and currently maintain (namefix.pl) and retired apps WiiCR and anything else I write thats actually worth releasing. Will likely throw up arby.pl as well for the traders

https://yabtcl.com/drawsSecretsHashes.txt

Ahhh there it is.

that wraps it up nicely then.

Also the timestamp is quite nifty, thanks for the explanation.
Regarding extra details, I'll sit down tomorrow and send you an example of where I personally would like a bit more a helping hand when working my way through the results.

Just one quick example is the JS that fetches the txid hash, I noted in the code you embedded the addresses.
Thats fine, not an issue at all - but Id suggest perhaps updating the js so it fetches the file and explodes it.

Its a minor minor detail, but I had to look at the code to figure out where the file was being pulled from, only to see that for each draw you post updated JS with the file contents embedded.

also I had the opportunity to try your password reset feature, extremely impressed with your innovation there.

Also I quite like the lottery itself as far as lotteries go, I used to work for an award winning lotteries agent for 3.5 years when I was much younger and you have done a nice job of implementing the payouts, the extra numbers and your tables showing payouts. Its a very traditional lotto, I hate to play them personally as after 3.5 years you get used to people pouring their money away, buut it doesnt mean I cant appreciate a good implementation when I see it, well done.

Yes, you are right, I stand corrected. In case of a lottery, additional players do not alter your chances of winning.
Of course, additional players influence your expected return, but they do so while paying into the jackpot, so it's all in order.

3rd edit: still not sure if they are provable fair.
(Have to agree with mem though: their explanation of their system is rather hard to follow.)

As they don't put the txids of the bets in the results, you can't prove that payment occurred, thereby giving the operators the possibility to play for free, which goes back to my previous point.

maybe I'm wrong, but what I got is even if the yabtcl site owner(s) decide to play some tickets, it won't alter anyone chance. this is because when the tickets are listed in the file, the lottery result will depend on a event that will happen one and a half hour later.

I agree that in the case of the dice sites, as the bets results are instants, the site owner can defraud investors and they will think that was just a luck player. But I don't see how can this be achieved in the YABTCL site.

What people don't seem to realize in the Bitcoin gambling world is that there are degrees of "provably fair", as illustrated by yabcl here.
(Some started using just "fair" or "provable results" to distinguish between different degrees of "provably fair"; always meant to write a post dedicated to this...)

Anyways, any multiplayer game cannot, by design, be provably fair. This is simply because nobody can prove that the site owner did not use shills to alter their chances. This applies of course to all multiplayer games, so every poker suffers from this for example. It's just wrong to call these games "provably fair". Something as done by yabctl is more like as "provable as a multiplayer game can get".

And @BRules: because of the same reasons, investments are never provably fair - you'll just have to trust the operator

Awesome! Thanks a lot for all the work you are putting into this!  

If we may suggest an improvement for the list: a legend of the merit badges would be awesome!

hi all,

mem, you said: "What I have realized from reviewing yabtcl is that its not enough for sites to simply describe their provably fair system they need to walk through an example."

So, I'm not clear if you're talking about my site.

In every draw, we have an explanation about the provably fair system using the values used in that draw. Do you think we need to improve it? What do you missed in the explanation?


Now, let me explain the technical details how we timestamp the SHA256 hash with a bitcoin transaction.

The SHA256 hash has a total of 64 characters, so we split the hash in 10 parts of 6 characters.

We also defined a specific address to each hashpart.

So, after getting the SHA256 hash of the file, we divide the 64 characters into 11 parts and transform each part into a decimal number. The decimal number got in each part will be the amount of satoshis needed to be sent to the address representing that part. As nowadays a bitcoin transaction output need to have at least 5430 satoshis, we add this amount to each part and then create a bitcoin transaction to timestamp the SHA256 of the file.

Hope it is clear.

Any question, just ask.

And tks again for reviewing our lottery.

I contacted the site admin informing that there's some discussion about his site in this thread and asked for his help on this matter.


you can find it on the help page, on the "Draws" section:

"Each draw have an associated secret, you can download the SHA512 hashes of the secrets clicking here."

http://yabtcl.com/drawsSecretsHashes.txt

check again wayneyoyo, they are there

Theres no JD or PD ?

Nice forumpage 

maybe find out this one www.bitbetnow.com

yeeshh, for those wondering this is a bad example of how to list your site and also how to piss me off (now I have to go clean it up).

As stated in the game form, you are not to create an entry for each coin a game supports.
There will be badges added at a later date to indicate altcoin support but for now lets not spam the list over and over with the same games.

bumpy

luckyb.it reviewed and approved, I quite like the use of binary string to determine right/ left.
Everydice approved, very nice site

yabtcl .... just 1 last query, regarding the location of the secret hash.

I think I may have reviewed and approved another today as well, but I forgot which site it was

Will try and bash out a few more tomorrow.

list being updated right now...

Maybe the 5th time Ive looked at this and I fail to make any sense of it.

so file hash: 248963103EEC8E07889EA6E843662F7F26256F2F79809189513964BA53F7650F (or is this a time stamped hash).
bitcoin tx: 374a0f85a8fb175c31fa1e06e1bc76575d18d6369526343dfe328785379801d4
and the actual file: https://yabtcl.com/drawFiles/ticketsForDraw99.txt


OK good, the file hash checks out....

so somehow this JS confirms the file hash from info in the bitcoin txid:

http://jsfiddle.net/yabtcl/PfcWQ/embedded/result%2Cjs%2Chtml/?txid=374a0f85a8fb175c31fa1e06e1bc76575d18d6369526343dfe328785379801d4

Id like to know how this is achieved, Ive had a look through the JS but i cant figure out how the file hash is extracted from the rawtx.
But props to the site operator for providing an offline/ independent verifier.


where is the hash of the draw secret ?

didn't understand why this is important to you. The time that the tickets were bought did not affect the lottery result. if two tickets hit 2 winning numbers, they will divide the 2-hits-jackpot.