Merged mining now live - page 2. | Bitcointalksearch.org

Fiyasko

legendary

Activity: 1428

Merit: 1001

Okey Dokey Lokey

Quote from: Iyeman on October 10, 2011, 08:33:44 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: Litt on October 10, 2011, 05:00:05 AM

All merged mining has done so far for me is create a sense of distrust towards any pool operator that isn't running merged mining pool.

The pool operators have a direct incentive to not implement merged mining openly which makes this a terrible situation for maintaining trust between miners and operators.

I wish the pool operators actually participated more actively in the merger and voted before allowing it to go live.
But then I suppose that would also ruin the same opportunity to steal... for the bad ones.

Why do you care if the pool operator is making more money if your payout is not being affected negatively?

Because if a pool operator is using your hashing power, that you are paying the electricity for, to mine NMC and not give you your cut...That is theft.

BAM, And thats why i dont want to see Merged Mining on DeepBit
Im not going to Merge Mine someother "coin", Screw that, I want bitcoins.
I dont want to be in a 4.5th/sec pool thats seceretly using 2th/sec to mine Namecoins or someother Shit that i Do Not Want, But that im now mining for

DeathAndTaxes

donator

Activity: 1218

Merit: 1079

Gerald Davis

Quote from: ?? on ??

Why do you care if the pool operator is making more money if your payout is not being affected negatively?

The payout has been negatively affected if pool operator is keeping the proceeds of miner's hashing power.

Put it another way if/when difficulty drops if the pool operator continues to reward miners based on the older higher difficulty would you say "why do you care if operator is making more money, your payout is not being affected negatively".

Ultimately economic theory tells us the if 1 BTC + 1NMC can be produced for the same equipment and energy that previously could only produce 1 BTC + 0 NMC then the price of 1 BTC + 1 NMC will eventually reach parity w/ pre merged mining price of 1 BTC.

So while in nominal terms your reward in BTC hasn't decreased the value of those BTC will decrease to compensate for the inflation effect of "free" NMC (which can be converted into BTC).

Iyeman

sr. member

Activity: 1183

Merit: 251

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: Litt on October 10, 2011, 05:00:05 AM

All merged mining has done so far for me is create a sense of distrust towards any pool operator that isn't running merged mining pool.

The pool operators have a direct incentive to not implement merged mining openly which makes this a terrible situation for maintaining trust between miners and operators.

I wish the pool operators actually participated more actively in the merger and voted before allowing it to go live.
But then I suppose that would also ruin the same opportunity to steal... for the bad ones.

Why do you care if the pool operator is making more money if your payout is not being affected negatively?

Because if a pool operator is using your hashing power, that you are paying the electricity for, to mine NMC and not give you your cut...That is theft.

Gabi

legendary

Activity: 1148

Merit: 1008

If you want to walk on water, get out of the boat

Started merged mining today, nice.

Litt

sr. member

Activity: 350

Merit: 250

All merged mining has done so far for me is create a sense of distrust towards any pool operator that isn't running merged mining pool.

The pool operators have a direct incentive to not implement merged mining openly which makes this a terrible situation for maintaining trust between miners and operators.

I wish the pool operators actually participated more actively in the merger and voted before allowing it to go live.
But then I suppose that would also ruin the same opportunity to steal... for the bad ones.

bulanula

hero member

Activity: 518

Merit: 500

Quote from: Fiyasko on October 09, 2011, 09:31:24 AM

All i see here is a soon to be BackDoor for pool hoppers.

Yes merged mining seems to work. But i think this is just a trial run to walk upto the big pools and go "hey this is good and works"
Then the fuck with someshit and start poolhopping once a bigpool goes "yeah you can merged mine here, Lemme follow your instructions to get that setup"

Pool hopping AND merged mining. Now that is the way to get some $$$

Fiyasko

legendary

Activity: 1428

Merit: 1001

Okey Dokey Lokey

All i see here is a soon to be BackDoor for pool hoppers.

Yes merged mining seems to work. But i think this is just a trial run to walk upto the big pools and go "hey this is good and works"
Then the fuck with someshit and start poolhopping once a bigpool goes "yeah you can merged mine here, Lemme follow your instructions to get that setup"

shads

sr. member

Activity: 266

Merit: 254

Quote from: eldentyrell on October 09, 2011, 03:04:50 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Why would deepbit risk the mass exodus if found out?

Because the odds of "finding out" are zero?

Because most miners wouldn't care or even know why they should care?

If you have corresponding bitcoin and aux chain blocks you can prove they are connected. All you'd need to do is wait for a pool to find a bitcoin block then see if an alt chain had one about the same time. Do a bit of cryptoacrobatics and you've got yr proof.

The way it could be hidden is if when you win a block on high diff chain don't submit the work to lower diff chain. You lose the alt chain's block but then there's no link. Just keep all the alt chain blocks that solve for the alt chain but not the main chain.

eldentyrell

donator

Activity: 980

Merit: 1004

felonious vagrancy, personified

Quote from: shads on October 09, 2011, 12:41:49 AM

you can't figure it out because there is no documented spec and interpreting the source code leaves many ambiguities.

This is true of bitcoin itself.

eldentyrell

donator

Activity: 980

Merit: 1004

felonious vagrancy, personified

Quote from: ?? on ??

Why would deepbit risk the mass exodus if found out?

Because the odds of "finding out" are zero?

Because most miners wouldn't care or even know why they should care?

eldentyrell

donator

Activity: 980

Merit: 1004

felonious vagrancy, personified

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on October 08, 2011, 10:03:36 PM

I wonder if it is possible that another large pool IS doing merged mining behind the scene and simply keeping the NMC rewards.

This is the big problem with merged mining.

I think it will work for NameCoin, because namecoins are used for something bitcoin can't do (registering names, SSL certs, and PGP keys). For all the chains that do the same thing as bitcoin ("I am a currency, yay!") you'll just see the pool operators go hog-wild with their free hashpower.

shads

sr. member

Activity: 266

Merit: 254

Quote from: Iyeman on October 09, 2011, 12:06:13 AM

but a few pool operators are complaining its to complicated to configure, nevermind the fact there has been 2-3 months to ask questions and try and get ready for it.

You can't get answers to your questions. And you can't figure it out because there is no documented spec and interpreting the source code leaves many ambiguities.

Iyeman

sr. member

Activity: 1183

Merit: 251

Quote from: ?? on ??

Why would deepbit risk the mass exodus if found out? They are already making a fortune with high fees.

Since they would be getting additional revenue from Namecoin they could lower their fee and then miners wouldn't care if they found out.

more than 28 blocks would have been found with 4000+ mhs

The first pool with a substantial amount of of hashing power will power through some NMC blocks and make a lot of nmc quickly before the difficulty lvls out to around the same as btc.

but a few pool operators are complaining its to complicated to configure, nevermind the fact there has been 2-3 months to ask questions and try and get ready for it.

shads

sr. member

Activity: 266

Merit: 254

It's quite possible (I'd say even likely) there's something wrong with the way solutions are being submitted to the NMC daemon. It's hideously complex process to submit and there's plenty of place where it could go wrong.

bulanula

hero member

Activity: 518

Merit: 500

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on October 08, 2011, 10:03:36 PM

I wonder if it is possible that another large pool IS doing merged mining behind the scenses and simply keeping the NMC rewards.

I mean it is transparent to the miners right. They still get paid for BTC and pool keeps the NMC.

I suspect deepbit.net is already doing this. Damn scammers !!!

DeathAndTaxes

donator

Activity: 1218

Merit: 1079

Gerald Davis

I wonder if it is possible that another large pool IS doing merged mining behind the scene and simply keeping the NMC rewards.

I mean it is transparent to the miners right? They still get paid for BTC and pool keeps the NMC. Miners don't see anything missing and once pool starts seeing the NMC come in why would they start sharing it w/ miners.

bulanula

hero member

Activity: 518

Merit: 500

Quote from: JohnDoe on October 08, 2011, 08:14:43 PM

You can now mine Bitcoin and Namecoin simultaneously without needing to split your hashing power between the two.

Pools with MM enabled:

- MasterPool
- Simplecoin
- Nmcbit

Thank you for this information. Now I can dump twice the coins YAY !

JohnDoe

sr. member

Activity: 392

Merit: 251

You can now mine Bitcoin and Namecoin simultaneously without needing to split your hashing power between the two.

Pools with MM enabled:

- MasterPool
- Simplecoin
- Nmcbit

Topic: Merged mining now live - page 2. (Read 5696 times)