OK, thanks suchmoon & Jet, should I keep this topic open or lock it?
No harm in keeping it open. Maybe someone will pitch in with a brilliant idea.
Topic: [Merit] Proposition : Merit transfer option. (Read 465 times)
No harm in keeping it open. Maybe someone will pitch in with a brilliant idea.
OK, thanks suchmoon & Jet, should I keep this topic open or lock it?
Edit :
Edit :
No harm in keeping it open. Maybe someone will pitch in with a brilliant idea.
Ok thanks for your feedbacks 
I think I'll write a guide about posting and getting your post read.
It's quite a struggle to find decent posts, and many of the threads don't get opened by me because of the title. Even the posters name matters - a name like suchmoon is identifiable, gq67zx593 makes the poster look like a bot or a spammer, and that could affect the opening of a thread.
It's quite a struggle to find decent posts, and many of the threads don't get opened by me because of the title. Even the posters name matters - a name like suchmoon is identifiable, gq67zx593 makes the poster look like a bot or a spammer, and that could affect the opening of a thread.
I don't think Theymos would need to monitor merit sources at all. There are so many competent members running merit analysis programs, that nay abuse would be highlighted fairly quickly.
Sorry, "abuse" was the wrong word for what I had in mind. "Apathy" perhaps. If a merit source is not sending merits out fast enough they won't get a replenishment, so that's sort of a penalty for them, but also the forum as a whole loses out. We have 17800 source merits and only ~28k sent out in the last 30 days, so someone is slacking - should be closer to 35k if the system worked perfectly, and that's not even including the leftovers from the "airdrop". Without knowing who the sources are we don't know if the sources are doing their job. Only theymos knows that ATM.
As for actual abuse - sure, there is quite a bit of sleuthing going on. Not sure how effective it is but it's still early days.
I don't think Theymos would need to monitor merit sources at all. There are so many competent members running merit analysis programs, that nay abuse would be highlighted fairly quickly.
InvoKing, you might be on to something but you seem to be drawing conclusions from some wrong assumptions. Merit sources don't need to review every single post because (1) a lot of it is pure garbage - take a look at patrol; and (2) the depth-2-merit already exists to some extent - users can re-distribute 50% of their received merits.
Having said that, some tweaks might be needed to address the issue of sMerits not being sent. theymos seemed to suggest that decaying unused sMerits would be the way to do it. I kinda doubt it would be a good incentive though. If a user doesn't care about sending them, they won't care about decay either.
Perhaps the decayed sMerits can be redistributed to most active senders, and IIRC that idea had been brought up already but dismissed for a number of reasons, mainly because theymos could just increase the number of sources. However more sources means more policing needed by theymos to track abuses, since the sources can't really police each other. Maybe some sort of multi-level system would be better, IDK.
Having said that, some tweaks might be needed to address the issue of sMerits not being sent. theymos seemed to suggest that decaying unused sMerits would be the way to do it. I kinda doubt it would be a good incentive though. If a user doesn't care about sending them, they won't care about decay either.
Perhaps the decayed sMerits can be redistributed to most active senders, and IIRC that idea had been brought up already but dismissed for a number of reasons, mainly because theymos could just increase the number of sources. However more sources means more policing needed by theymos to track abuses, since the sources can't really police each other. Maybe some sort of multi-level system would be better, IDK.
do the sources - whoever they are - really have an impact on the distribution?
i dont see a lot of merited post. maybe its because i am active in the spamy-part of the forum - the altcoin section.
sources may have a lot of merits to sent. but if the receivers dont send them to somebody else the distribution stops at this point.
i dont see a lot of merited post. maybe its because i am active in the spamy-part of the forum - the altcoin section.
sources may have a lot of merits to sent. but if the receivers dont send them to somebody else the distribution stops at this point.
Once the initial air drop has been used, half of all the merits awarded will come from merit sources. It's even higher if the awardees don't spend their sMerits.
I've got all the alt section, and the local boards on ignore, so I never visit them. The local boards are on ignore for obvious reasons not related to post quality.
do the sources - whoever they are - really have an impact on the distribution?
Yes and increasing. i dont see a lot of merited post. maybe its because i am active in the spamy-part of the forum - the altcoin section.
Definitely. Check merit stats to get more informations. and because I am sure that a lot of users are here to make money. a lot of them sont send their merits. why? because they hope that sometimes in the future the can sell them.
My impression right now : 
Epic fail.
do the sources - whoever they are - really have an impact on the distribution?
i dont see a lot of merited post. maybe its because i am active in the spamy-part of the forum - the altcoin section.
sources may have a lot of merits to sent. but if the receivers dont send them to somebody else the distribution stops at this point.
and because I am sure that a lot of users are here to make money. a lot of them sont send their merits. why? because they hope that sometimes in the future the can sell them.
i dont see a lot of merited post. maybe its because i am active in the spamy-part of the forum - the altcoin section.
sources may have a lot of merits to sent. but if the receivers dont send them to somebody else the distribution stops at this point.
and because I am sure that a lot of users are here to make money. a lot of them sont send their merits. why? because they hope that sometimes in the future the can sell them.
-snip-
Oh boy, i just want to make the system great again 
-snip-
It is hard to find this but not impossible 
And depth2 are users like you that will not give the transferred smerit to fraudsters, scammers and thieves
I really don't understand the problem. I've got merits to award, and I've been looking through the boards. I've found more posters to ignore, than I've found posts to merit. I've tried to rectify this with various help threads, and I've even set up a help site, but all many posters want to do is to spam their rubbish to scratch a few coins that they probably won't receive anyway. That's probably a jaundiced view, but I'm getting fed up with finding rubbish everywhere. It's on the streets as well as the Internet. Lets make Bitcoin Talk a haven for sensible discussions, and not another venue for frauds, scammers, thieves and advertising hoardings.
Let's say for example that in August some sources will take a vacation for several weeks, could you tell me what will be the consequence?
As a legendary, i don't care since I will not feel anything, as a lower rank member it will have a huge impact.
I prefer prevent issues rather than waiting it to happens then spending months to fix it.
It is my point of view and I respect your points also.
As a legendary, i don't care since I will not feel anything, as a lower rank member it will have a huge impact.
I prefer prevent issues rather than waiting it to happens then spending months to fix it.
It is my point of view and I respect your points also.
Lols this reminds me of a discussion about hypermarkets schedule.
They should be closed on the weekends so the employees can take a rest and only small stores should still be opened cause..... they have no workers
If some merit sources take vacations, isn't possible that the same percentage of users also take vacations?
And what would this "huge impact" you're talking about?
Furthermore, you realize that I'm lower in rank than you and I'm really not scared about this catastrophe that is going to happen in the summer? And nobody should! Cause there is none!
-snip-
So you think it is easy to figure out good posts from thousands of posts daily? Sources aren't paid afaik to screen all boards/topics/posts, they are volunteers.
Local boards may have also good replies same for altcoins discussion, 0.01% isn't 0%.
If Depth1 goes offline then you should ask theymos this question before asking me tho
, my answer is simply replacing the dormant one with the best depth2 and so on. Complicated? What is complicated in transferring some of your smerit to another user? It is 1 click to send +/- 1 click to approve.
Let's say for example that in August some sources will take a vacation for several weeks, could you tell me what will be the consequence?
As a legendary, i don't care since I will not feel anything, as a lower rank member it will have a huge impact.
I prefer prevent issues rather than waiting it to happens then spending months to fix it.
It is my point of view and I respect your points also.
=> 1 merit source has to look to an average of 106 new posts/day or 3,255 new posts/month in order to make the system works as intended.
This assumption is wrong. At least half the posts isn't worth reading at all (check recent unread posts and see how often the word "bounty" is in the title).That leaves less than 53 posts per day to read by your math. That's not much at all for an active member.
Update: I forgot the overlap in sources reading the same posts as other sources. Let me rephrase it: I think 90% of all new posts isn't worth reading, and I'll
1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10
I totally agree with LoyceV here, your arguments started with a bunch of numbers that are clearly not real.
You went and grabbed that average 8538.39 but you neglected this:
Please could you qualify that. Do you mean merit sources with unallocated source merits, or do you mean their earned sMerits that they haven't spent.
I do never talk about someone wealth. Sources are free to keep it or spend it the way they like.
I do care only about source smerits received every 30 days and how to distribute it properly.
What are we going to do when the D-1 goes offline? We're going to have D-2? Then D-3?
Why over complicating a system that is not even 6 months old?
I do care only about source smerits received every 30 days and how to distribute it properly.
I didn't think that merit sources were know publicly. Obviously if source merit lists are available, then the names of merit sources would be public knowledge.
Please could you qualify that. Do you mean merit sources with unallocated source merits, or do you mean their earned sMerits that they haven't spent.
I do never talk about someone wealth. Sources are free to keep it or spend it the way they like.
I do care only about source smerits received every 30 days and how to distribute it properly.
Edit :
I didn't think that merit sources were know publicly. Obviously if source merit lists are available, then the names of merit sources would be public knowledge.
They aren't but it isn't that hard to figure some of them. I am trying to avoid two possibilities : sources having more unspent smerit or sources doubling rewards to avoid the first case, which i think both aren't good choices. Sources could confirm or "deny" these facts.
Please could you qualify that. Do you mean merit sources with unallocated source merits, or do you mean their earned sMerits that they haven't spent.
As I have said previously, it isn't possible for them to spend sMerits until they have used up all their source merits. Source merits are replaced 30 days after they are awarded, so the system is self-moderating.
Why not just add that depth 2 sources ( if your system happened) as merit sources? why do we need to differ them? in my opinion it is better if there are more merit sources rather than making this system more complex.
Exactly! Theymos said this:By no means is the set of merit sources or their sMerit/month static. I will be adjusting it a lot as needed, especially in the beginning. I wouldn't be surprised if there are 100-200 sources in a year from now.
Well, i hope i can be one of merit sources
I agree with LoyceV. It is easier to add more sources rather than making a system like that, we just need to find a great and established member who is unbiased in to some kind of matters and willing to help the forum to become better, and i guess this is not a hard task.
It seems to be that all these posts about changing the merit barrier are designed to allow signature spammers to increase their pollution of the boards. The merit system was designed to stop this, and it seems to be working imho.
Do you think? 
I am trying to avoid two possibilities : sources having more unspent smerit or sources doubling rewards to avoid the first case, which i think both aren't good choices. Sources could confirm or "deny" these facts.
The merit system is very early doors at the moment, and merit sources will be in the hundreds. I don't think it's been limited to 200 as far as I know. Adding a depth 2 would just complicate a relatively simple system. Plus, I don't think it brings any major advantages. If a person is deemed good then he'll likely be added as a merit source. If someone has run out of their initial sMerit and doesn't generate enough on a regular basis to show they have the capabilities of picking out quality content but, has a eye for good posts then they can fill in an application and send it off to theymos. I don't think we need to over complicate by adding a depth 2.
I respect your point of view, I am just giving a proposition after reviewing some sources attitude.Personally, I am almost out of smerit, I don't want to get more/I think it is enough now and I prefer to have a useless like button to support relevant posts
It seems to be that all these posts about changing the merit barrier are designed to allow signature spammers to increase their pollution of the boards. The merit system was designed to stop this, and it seems to be working imho.
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