Topic: More apps for LN - page 2. (Read 220 times)

You say this because you most likely live in the first industrialized world where everyone relies on their bank to keep their assets and obviously have a MasterCard in their pockets.  Now expand your mind and turn the world map, catapulted into Africa where 90% of the population is Unbanked but will most likely have a smartphone in hand, give it the opportunity to buy something without transition costs without any bank account and in the blink of an eye take a look and tell me if it can work.


lol you probably don't know what you're talking about, in El Salvador it's not LN that doesn't work but just the adoption of how it was dealt with.  So I avoid commenting more because you're basing your speech on a concept that doesn't hold up.  Instead try checking out Bitcoin Lake or Bitcoin Jungle to see if that works.

axctually you do need to improve it

el salvador tried it and seen how broke it wasn. and yep within 3 months they stopped using LN as the behind the scenes system of chivo..

also just having an app on millions of phones is like a fake sibyl node count. pretending its popular but not used much.
and when idiots do use it and its still broke those idiots wise up quick and see its buggy and flawed and has bottlenecks and not 100% payment successes. and they too drop it and start slinging insults about it on many review sites. and there is no recovering from that

yep many people who are LN advocates tried returning to el salvador saying they fixed a few things so can el salvador give it another try.. el salvador said no thanks

and now the guy at strike ran off with the tail between his legs distincing himself from el salvador pretending he had no involvement in their LN trials..

learn from your mistakes. stop repeating them by saying "we dont need to fix mistakes, lets just get more people to try the broke system and hope devs come along to make it better after"

if something is broke fix it. if you cant fix it admit it and try something else

LB is not the solution to bitcoin congestion because LN will never be able to handle the value amounts bitcoin moves per transaction

for instance.. lets use the latest bitcoin block whilst im typing this(790620)
total BTC
11,565~
total Value
$313,615,468

Average Value
3.9497887817 BTC

then look at the average channel capacity of routing.. it cant cope with payments of ~4btc each
do the math. the liquidity of routing is not there to handle bitcoins load

edit
but didnt you just say

you do know what a custodian is right?.. a bank.. a financial service

That would be very effective if the only option of payment is LN.  It would be not as effective as you think if there is some other option of payment which is more user-friendly and more convenient to use. Besides if we develop an application for payment, isn't it easier to just have an internal transaction than using LN network?  The app's feature itself then possibly kills the purpose of LN transfers since more probably than not, users will use the convenience of internal transfer.  This is not different from an application that has an internal transfer and an integrated bank transfer.  Most users avail of the internal transfer because it is cheaper(no fee in most applications)  and faster.

I didn't say there will be a discount but I did say to put apps that use LN inside our smartphones.  Take Uber why pay only with cards and not LN or again airbnb, eBay, amazon all these are apps that could potentially use LN (obviously they won't for now) but if someone is developing an app that uses a payment then put LN in the your app.  You don't necessarily have to open channels or self-host a node but also use custodial wallets and send almost instantly or onchain or exchange in your own currency but in this way you will still have fed the network and incentivized the developers through fees.  Don't always be hostile to change, don't think it's always wasted energy.

I guess you are supporting what DaveF stated.  Acceptance 1st, without acceptance the LN won't be used even if it is the best solution for the ever-congested Bitcoin network.  Second, there should be the need or demand of people. Simply making applications while there is really no demand would be only a waste of time and effort.


The world isn't magic.  If there is a catch or let us say a 50% discount in using LN for  Samsung phone payments, I am sure even those who do not know it will try to understand what LN is just to avail of that 50% discount.  There should be a driving factor for people to use LN without it, they will just use fiat payment since it is more convenient to just swipe a card than create/join a channel for LN payment.

I've seen some forum members as well kicking against the use of the lightning network but i want to believe that they are yet to fully understand the role of lightning network in bitcoin ecosystem, if you consider the reason why the lightning network was initially introduced was to make transactions complications go easy with the use of layer 2 protocols, now how do we encourage for more use of this, there must be an increased adoption first, more corperate organizations, industries and companies including government need to join hands in this massive adoption, by then, we would have gotten enough numbers of those that will implement the massive use of bitcoin lightning network in their own system all over the world.

You probably didn't understand the concept and I'll try to explain it again.  Iphone didn't have a 12 mpx camera but only a 2mpx one and people didn't use the camera until 2007 even to photograph what they shit in the toilet (excuse the phrase but it explains the concept a lot) yet when they had it at hand it was that's right, photos and videos everywhere, social media based on your digital life made up of photos, services developed to enhance your photos to make them look professional and why didn't it arrive before 2007 when 2 mpx had long since been surpassed?  Simply because it wasn't always there in your hands.  Try making LN payments on a new Samsung Galaxy and you'll see how people start using it...the cloud is the same concept they don't even know what it is yet they use it because it's already inside their phone.  We don't have to improve LN but make it accessible to everyone.

Acceptance 1st, other things later.
As more people / businesses accept LN more people will want to design things around it. Otherwise people will find other things to integrate with.
If I know that there are tons more places to spend LN then I would be more inclined to have it as an option. As of now there are a lot, but more is better. You need to get to that tipping point where it's everywhere. Then programmers will just start to integrate it into apps by default.

-Dave

I found this interesting post that I recommend reading and I wanted to share it with you here. I don't want to spoil the whole article but it basically argues that we need more apps that leverage LN and not new wallets to pay with LN.  As clearly, the Fiat currency is widely supported in our devices where everything can be paid in our apps, so we must also try to implement payments with LN so that this can reach mass adoption.

https://medium.com/breez-technology/we-need-more-apps-with-lightning-not-more-lightning-apps-b5f37f9ac8bd

Clearly the article is quite detailed but it goes on to explain how we got to a thoughtless use of the camera despite the fact that in 2007 there was a camera on the market with a resolution of 12mpx the latter did not contribute at all to the use but it was a machine with only 2mpx and obviously I'm talking about the iPhone one.  So it's not the quality that leads people to use something but the simplicity with which it comes to them and obviously a camera in a device capable of satisfying multiple use cases has contributed to what the world is today.  So I think this is really how LN must evolve, more apps that integrate it because basically it already works like this.