Topic: My criticism of BitCoin - page 2. (Read 2903 times)

My rebuttal:

1.  No, it's not ridiculous.  Day traders have been doing it from home for decades.  People that earn money through their computers or technology really are earning it.  It's not a waste of electricity and if anything it will only become more efficient than it is today.

2.  I actually agree with you on this point.  This is the point of technology: solve problems.  I don't doubt that there are already coins with this in mind.

3.  Yes, bitcoin is unstable.  That's really good for traders.  Enjoy it while it lasts.  If people don't understand the instability and risk then they should not get involved with bitcoin.  That's more of a personal decision but not really a detractor of bitcoin.  It's only a detractor if you want a low risk portfolio at this time.  But then again, bitcoin has been going strong for years so it's actually continuing to prove itself as viable and getting more integrated with various ecommerce channels like newegg, tigerdirect and overstock.com

Bitcoin mining is EXTREMELY competitive.

If you think it involves just "turning your computer on and making money",
you're wildly mistaken.

Anyway, I think it is much more valid than the government turning
on a printing press and making money.  

If you don't believe in a tokenized method of value exchange
then lets all just go back to the barter system.

As far as thefts go, thievery began long before Bitcoin
and will continue long after.  There is even institutionalized
theft of money (Cypress).  Bitcoin is not the solution to
all of mandkind's problems.  That being said, you can
properly secure your bitcoins so they won't get stolen.
There are also insured bitcoin services available like Bitgo.

All of these flaws you stated are there to enhance decentralisation.
Bitcoin is designed in such a way to be independent.
If you wan't to be monitored and enslaved by your government you can very well
use fiat.

It's highly probably that OP is one of these Scandinavians habiting the boreal woods (and internet forums ), but this indeed is a problem of Bitcoin.

A farmer - even if he uses automatized technology - is providing an useful service to society. Mining can be seen as a service to the bitcoin user community as it's securing the blockchain. But there are "miningless" alternatives like Proof of Stake and Proof of Burn that do the same job and are far more energy-efficient.

So basically miners can be compared to workers doing terribly inefficient work. To keep with the farmer example, it would be the case of a farmer who uses lots of electricity for his automated system and has the same productivity than another farmer that doesn't waste any electricity.

It is possible (and even probable) that our current banking system is even less efficient than Bitcoin and other PoW coins. But the efficiency problems of BTC are real.

Credit cards gets 3% of everything you spend, and Paypal takes 6%.

They charge you to spend the money, and they charge again for the other party to receive your money.

If you like that, then keep doing it.  You'll eventually use Bitcoin anyway, and the rest of us will have a lot more money than you.

Lots of companies already have lots of computers earning money.  Visa, Mastercard, Western Union, they use computers to send money.  They provide a valuable service with computers, and that's how they earn their money.  Bitcoin also uses computers to run a transaction network which provides the same valuable service as Western Union or Visa.




People get money in exchange for something of value, whether or not they have to work for it.  If I do 500 pushups a day, and I lose 50 pounds, will you pay me for that?  I worked hard, but I didn't give you anything of value that you want to spend money for.

But you're confused about the difference between earning money and creating money.

Bitcoin requires a lot more work to create money, compared to fiat money which comes out of thin air, doesn't even exist, and is essentially worthless.




You left out the part where they had to spend thousands of hard-earned dollars to get the computers in the first place.

After they get the computer, they can't just turn it on and leave it running.  They have to apply knowledge and education, and even then they have to provide something valuable to other people.  What if they leave their computer running to mine another coin that never becomes as valuable as Bitcoin?  Then they didn't make the most profitable decision.




If it was a waste, people wouldn't spend millions of dollars on it every day.  If you think computers hurt the earth, then turn off your computer.






Here's your chance!  Give us a currency that can't be stolen.  If you can't, then don't expect other people to do the impossible.




Not as often as fiat money.




U.S. Dollars have serial numbers.  Why does theft still exist?

Who do you think should decide which Bitcoins are stolen?  If I lie and say your money belongs to me, do you want some government employee to be able to push a button and take all your money away just based on my word?



If you think it should be designed, then design it.  




The U.S. Dollar is unstable.  It continues to lose value every year for over 100 years.  



People lose more money with fiat investments.




Yes they did.  They paid too much and sold for too little.  

They could have waited 2 more years and maybe Bitcoin will be worth a lot more than they paid.  So obviously they did something wrong, if they lost money when other people became millionaires with Bitcoin.




Please name the currency you're talking about.  Which currency doesn't lose value?  Which currency can't be stolen?

And now tell us which currency gained 1000% in 3 years, while every other currency in the world lost value.





You just said that computers and software don't do anything valuable and they can't do work.  

But now you think computers can solve all the world's problems?




If they're not valid statements, then WHY ARE YOU SAYING THEM?

All you are saying is, "Why don't you make a better currency system?"

If you think it's a good question to ask us, then it's a good question to ask you.  Why don't you make a better currency?

We don't make our own currency because we don't think Bitcoin has these "problems" you're talking about.

Since you're the one who sees these things as problems, you're the one who should "fix" the problems.  Everybody else will continue to use Bitcoin.  

I get your points. But you need to understand that bitcoin was invented to fill up some of the gaps of the modern currency, it was never intended to be as a "SO CALLED" currency.

^^ This!

Everything is designed in a current system so the end user pays the most. That's why this Bitcoin revolution is so important. We need to end or at least fix this nonsense.

You spelt bitcoin wrong.

I find your criticisms wholly uncompelling, OP.

said to Robert Fulton, upon hearing of his plans for a steam-powered engine.

Arthur Clarke's Three Laws:

1. When a distinguished but elderly scientist states that something is possible, he is almost certainly right. When he states that something is impossible, he is very probably wrong.

2. The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible.

3. Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

Well yes, and it is also harder to control. Those known issues are intended and perpetuated by the banks to hook the citizens. It would be harder to do on Bitcoin.

This is a great video that simplify the issue for most people to understand this concept; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mII9NZ8MMVM

Using a credit card on a "buy now pay later" scam or getting another card to cover debt from the first are known issues... Just as with bitcoin you need to know what you are doing.

...there are still many cost related to using a credit card!

Proper use aside, it is also a tool that let you easily overspend and "lose" even more money on interests and again on all those fees.

The average use of mastercard comes with interest, since in marketing, the temptation of getting something "now" even though you will have to eventually pay more is rampart.

I wouldn't lending BTC is any better however, especially with how easy it is to run away with BTC.

No idea how to get around that with a card. I have set up my Paypal to use dollars since that is what i normaly need when my own currency is no good. Then i get away from the fee when i send to someone. If i recive money trough Paypal it is also in dollar and i can send it to my bank who convert it much cheaper but not free. Yet....

You few last posters; Mastercard AND Paypal keep an additional 2.5-3% to the user when converting from a currency to an other. That is not negligible and i was able to avoid, with bitcoin, very hefty conversion rate while trading with odd currency and a fair % on CAD/USD conversion.

For example while i used my CC i had a conversion rate of 0.74~ CAD/USD instead of the real conversion rate which is 0.77! You want to transfer 600$ and they keep almost 20$.

There are tons of small semi-hidden fees like that...

Are you stupid or something? I guess so. I dont get a discount for paying cash. I get a discount for using my card.

You are conveniently leaving out the 3-5% fee the credit card companies charge the merchants for accepting that piece of plastic. Why do you think some gas stations offer 3-4% discounts for cash, or cash equivalent users? You may not see the fee directly, but it sure as heck is passed on to you when the merchant if setting his prices. Even if they do not charge a noticeable fee or offer a cash discount, the CC fees are just spread out amongst all users, but in no way are they free or even cheap.

My credit card cost less then $10 a year. No fee when i use it. That $10 include an incurance from theft. Reduced prices in a lot of stores and chargeback in case of a seller not delivering. The bitcoin is the currency with extra payment.

Obvious troll is obvious, but here goes...

Agreed, computers should never be used for making money for no reason whatsoever. In fact, computers as a whole are just a waste of electricity. Things were was better back before we used computers for everything. I mean no electronic banking, it was nice when we had to wait in line to cash our paychecks on Friday. Then sit down and mail out checks for all our bills. Oh, if I wanted to take a trip during the weekend and forgot to get enough cash out on the weekend, I better hope the bank was open, cause of course no ATM's without computers wasting all that electricity. I mean those ATMs churning away all day for the handful of people that use them, what a waste.

Don't forget about Wall Street or any financial services for that matter wasting all that electricity on their computers making money.


I know right. Why don't they disable those pesky serial numbers on my FRNs if I get mugged, or a bank gets robbed, or any money used for illicit activities. Why does my bank account get drained because Target or Home Depot had a breach. I mean these superior systems designed by the elite bankers should be fool proof, right?


OMG, right I mean bitcoins is the only way people can lose money. Well there was the Madoff thing, oh and Enron, something about Charles Ponzi a long time ago, I am sure there were millions who lost and they did nothing wrong.


Yes, computers and software are indeed powerful, but the people who use them are still very much fallible and most, if not all, of the problems you indicated are due to that weakness more so than the technology.

There was Economical Crysis in 2001 in Turkey (of course it was somehow worldwide) But We were affected a lot.
My parents lost their shops, we have paid a lot of debt, etc. We lost tons of money.

It's happening in Greece now, People lost lots of money. It's not only bitcoin's problem but also general financial ecosystem's problem.