You can't justify IPOs due to what I said here, you're just recreating the Federal Reserve:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.15337113
Topic: My rebuttal to the fairness of proof-of-work launch (Monero's holier than thou) - page 2. (Read 2276 times)
June 26, 2016, 05:17:49 PM
June 26, 2016, 05:10:48 PM
As far as I am concerned, your proprietary secret sauce has zero value until people can use it. That means you will have to reveal it and run the risk that someone will copy it and not pay you for your intellectual property, As far as what is already there in the market when it comes to fairness Monero's POW is among the best.
Thanks for promoting theft. Thanks for promoting the force of viral communist Copyleft licenses. Thanks for all the dogma you've been destroying the altcoin ecosystem with.
Now please go away!
June 26, 2016, 05:06:40 PM
As far as what is already there in the market when it comes to fairness Monero's POW is among the best.
You can't prove that. How many people weren't using stolen cloud mining accounts as I already explained upthread.
You can't just make up bullshit without proof, math, and a white paper.
Are you sure you are actually an academic
I do not need to.
You can't make any claim about proof-of-work launch distribution being more fair, unless you can prove that you know how much hashrate was produced using stolen cloud mining accounts (and other ways of cheating the fairness).
It is you that is making the claim that it is not, and proving a negative is even harder.
I am not required to prove there was no stolen cloud mining accounts involved in mining. You have to prove the negative. You got that part backwards.
What I have already done is disprove your assertion that POW mining is equivalent to paying the utility companies for electricity. That is why the weather is so critical.
You have presented no proof of anything. When the white paper is ready, please reply.
June 26, 2016, 04:59:09 PM
As far as what is already there in the market when it comes to fairness Monero's POW is among the best.
You can't prove that. How many people weren't using stolen cloud mining accounts as I already explained upthread.
You can't just make up bullshit without proof, math, and a white paper.
Are you sure you are actually an academic
I do not need to. It is you that is making the claim that it is not, and proving a negative is even harder. What I have already done is disprove your assertion that POW mining is equivalent to paying the utility companies for electricity. That is why the weather is so critical.
Edit: In another context I would agree than my claim requires proof; however give the title of this thread "My rebuttal to the fairness of proof-of-work launch (Monero's holier than thou)" my claim is valid since the onus is on the OP to prove his assertion not on the rest of use to disprove it.
June 26, 2016, 04:52:22 PM
As far as what is already there in the market when it comes to fairness Monero's POW is among the best.
You can't prove that. How many people weren't using stolen cloud mining accounts as I already explained upthread.
You can't just make up bullshit without proof, math, and a white paper.
Are you sure you are actually an academic
June 26, 2016, 04:49:25 PM
The weather creates an uneven playing field https://www.wunderground.com
Yes the Butterfly Effect impacts everything. But if anything you are supporting the position that it doesn't matter which method of distribution is employed. So why are you arguing against Monero's "only proof-of-work is fair" doctrine?
My point is that the distribution can have some mathematically provable bounds on insider ownership (my plan), so some people may judge this is more or equivalently trustless (i.e. worthy) as a proof-of-work launch. Others may have a different opinion.
And my point is Monero can't use that dogma to claim they are provably more fairly distributed.
First of all, there is no point in comparing Monero's distribution method or that of any coin for that matter with your proprietary secret sauce. As far as I am concerned, your proprietary secret sauce has zero value until people can use it. That means you will have to reveal it and run the risk that someone will copy it and not pay you for your intellectual property, As far as what is already there in the market when it comes to fairness Monero's POW is among the best.
June 26, 2016, 04:36:20 PM
The weather creates an uneven playing field https://www.wunderground.com
Yes the Butterfly Effect impacts everything. But if anything you are supporting the position that it doesn't matter which method of distribution is employed. So why are you arguing against Monero's "only proof-of-work is fair" doctrine?
My point is that the distribution can have some mathematically provable bounds on insider ownership (my plan), so some people may judge this is more or equivalently trustless (i.e. worthy) as a proof-of-work launch. Others may have a different opinion.
And my point is Monero can't use that dogma to claim they are provably more fairly distributed.
June 26, 2016, 04:28:26 PM
The weather creates an uneven playing field https://www.wunderground.com
June 26, 2016, 04:22:32 PM
Why do you not simply argue that Moenro's POW is unfair because it discriminates against Americans in favor of Canadians? Furthermore even within the same Canadian province there is also discrimination since those who live in Prince George BC like myself, have an unfair advantage over those who live in Victoria BC. As for those who live in any part of Africa they are really discriminated against. Then there is also religions discrimination. The economics of mining Monero are very different in say Vatican City and Makkah. Jerusalem is somewhere in between.
Fairness has nothing to do with uniformity.
June 26, 2016, 04:20:30 PM
Why do you not simply argue that Moenro's POW is unfair because it discriminates against Americans in favor of Canadians? Furthermore even within the same Canadian province there is also discrimination since those who live in Prince George BC like myself, have an unfair advantage over those who live in Victoria BC. As for those who live in any part of Africa they are really discriminated against. Then there is also religions discrimination. The economics of mining Monero are very different in say Vatican City and Makkah. Jerusalem is somewhere in between.
June 26, 2016, 04:17:14 PM
I like most of what I see from the Monero community, for some I care less, for some I care more. Just as in real life.
I don't like promotional dogma (i.e. lies & deception masquerading as idealistic), bullshit, and lack of complete solutions that could actually make a difference.
If they were more
June 26, 2016, 04:13:05 PM
I think even a cursory glance over this forum section will make your position re: Monero abundantly clear by now as you can't help but to crosspost your opinion about that project in every troll or non troll thread.
Are you planning on going back to coding anytime soon? Or will you continue spending your energy in expressing your disgust?
They might or might not have a lack of leadership, but you are most certainly lacking any form of mature self control at the moment.
Are you planning on going back to coding anytime soon? Or will you continue spending your energy in expressing your disgust?
They might or might not have a lack of leadership, but you are most certainly lacking any form of mature self control at the moment.
I understand. But I think my burst here based on a new insight about proof-of-work not being any more provably fair, that no one has written about before, justifies making sure that enough readers are aware of this new way of thinking about fairness of altcoins.
And Monero has bullshitted everyone so much with their dogma, I think it is justified to make it front page news, when all their dogma is revealed to be bullshit.
They should focus on telling the truth, which is they are an anonymity technology token. Period. Until that changes.
They stop the bullshit. And I go coding. Deal?
Not a deal I am able to entertain, sorry. You can control yourself but I am unable - and unwilling - to control some random people on the internet. besides. I'm a nobody.
I like most of what I see from the Monero community, for some I care less, for some I care more. Just as in real life.
You will have to find more suitable partner for that agreement.
Over and out, sleep is healthy :p
Edit: For what it's worth, your video made you very sympathetic. I just don't get that periodical raging bull mode. I also think you are barking up the wrong tree, but that is my personal opinion and not worth discussing as you won't convince me otherwise and I won't convince you.
June 26, 2016, 04:07:03 PM
I think even a cursory glance over this forum section will make your position re: Monero abundantly clear by now as you can't help but to crosspost your opinion about that project in every troll or non troll thread.
Are you planning on going back to coding anytime soon? Or will you continue spending your energy in expressing your disgust?
They might or might not have a lack of leadership, but you are most certainly lacking any form of mature self control at the moment.
Are you planning on going back to coding anytime soon? Or will you continue spending your energy in expressing your disgust?
They might or might not have a lack of leadership, but you are most certainly lacking any form of mature self control at the moment.
I understand. But I think my burst here based on a new insight about proof-of-work not being any more provably fair, that no one has written about before, justifies making sure that enough readers are aware of this new way of thinking about fairness of altcoins.
And Monero has bullshitted everyone so much with their dogma, I think it is justified to make it front page news, when all their dogma is revealed to be bullshit.
They should focus on telling the truth, which is they are an anonymity technology token. Period. Until that changes.
They stop the bullshit. And I go coding. Deal?
June 26, 2016, 04:04:11 PM
I think even a cursory glance over this forum section will make your position re: Monero abundantly clear by now as you can't help but to crosspost your opinion about that project in every troll or non troll thread.
Are you planning on going back to coding anytime soon? Or will you continue spending your energy in expressing your disgust?
They might or might not have a lack of leadership, but you are most certainly lacking any form of mature self control at the moment.
Are you planning on going back to coding anytime soon? Or will you continue spending your energy in expressing your disgust?
They might or might not have a lack of leadership, but you are most certainly lacking any form of mature self control at the moment.
June 26, 2016, 03:50:06 PM
POW is the LEAST dirty way of generating coins in a fair manner since anyone in the world can mine on virtually the same ground
You can't prove how many people weren't mining with stolen cloud computing as I pointed out:
...even stolen cloud cloud computing accounts...
Monero and Bitcoin can never prove their distribution was any more fair than any other.
Sorry. Monero has no more "holier than thou" bullshit excuse for their lack of leadership and rapid development.
To make sure it is 100% clear that my only recent complaint against Monero were the following and nothing else:
1. Their "we are the shit and assimilate or die" community attitude.
1. Their "we are the shit and assimilate or die" community attitude.
I think you may be misinterpreting the "We are the only viable fungable choice join us while there is still time before TPTB move against us" for "your coin is stupid capitulate".
Although those arguments do come in the form of trolling far too often but as a community we really don't have control of that and that is what makes it an open community, your arguing for a centralized authority to come in and control which is against all VC beliefs. Think about that please. You have to take the good with the bad in some situations to achieve true freedom.
2. Pushing it as the only worthy altcoin, when in fact they haven't yet earned that distinction. Just because you claim to have competitive and fair distribution and an open source development, doesn't mean you've actually changed anything yet in our world and ecosystem. It will be self-evident once you do.
I may be wrong but I do believe (even when I'm not holding like right now) that XMR really is the only current viable solution to fungability. If you know of another please enlighten me, and don't tell me about vaporware, I mean a tangible functioning product right now. In the future this assuredly will not be true but right now I believe it to be.
Perhaps you missed my rebuttal to that "Monero is fungible" sales pitch:
Only systems that are structurally incompatible with fraud don't suffer from the overhang of potential fraud.
This is indeed true. Unfortunately Monero has periodic forks and thus its mining is not structurally incompatible with protocol fucked by the consensus or even a very powerful hashrate adversary.
So to argue that ring sigs are structurally incompatible with blacklisting is not absolutely true, for as long as mining could change the protocol and force every txn to reveal its viewkey.
Altcoins can't have assured protocol resilience without assured decentralization of mining AND scaling. Because without scaling, you can't prevent against 51% (or 10X) attack.
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