My theory about the Antminer S5+ being more efficient than the Antminer S5

RichBC

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Quote from: Amph on January 02, 2016, 02:53:45 AM

this mean that if you undervolt and underclock the standard s5, you get the same efficiency? or there is soemthing more about it?

Yes it does mean you can improve the efficiency of an S5. However..... there are problems when you try and reduce the voltage to an S5 by very much as it does not hash. The best S5 are the ones with the latest V1.91 Hash Board, these can be significantly undervolted & underclocked and can give very good efficiencies, as good as 0.36J/GH

See this thread for discussion on this.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/antminer-s5-underclock-undervolt-best-jgh-1151460

Rich

Amph

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Quote from: VirosaGITS on January 01, 2016, 02:04:02 PM

Quote from: coinhelper on January 01, 2016, 12:51:30 PM

If the antminer s5+ uses less power than the S5 (as some say the J/GHs is less)!

Isn't this because, the controlling system needs less power.
It only requires one computer for three boards compared with the S5 which requires one computer per one board.

I believe this is the reason why some are confused and suggest that it i smore power efficient, it just needs less power to power the computer.

No its because the chips run at a lower frequency and lower voltage, but there are more of them. The controller use negligible amount of electricity, it really does not amount to 20% of the power if it "control the boards better or not".

Its the same reason why the latest batches of S7 have less chips, higher freq and 4.7TH/s. It is because they come overvolted and overclocked. Which means the latest batches are less efficients.

this mean that if you undervolt and underclock the standard s5, you get the same efficiency? or there is something more about it?

VirosaGITS

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Quote from: coinhelper on January 01, 2016, 02:22:13 PM

Quote from: VirosaGITS on January 01, 2016, 02:17:57 PM

Quote from: coinhelper on January 01, 2016, 02:08:20 PM

Quote from: VirosaGITS on January 01, 2016, 02:04:02 PM

Quote from: coinhelper on January 01, 2016, 12:51:30 PM

If the antminer s5+ uses less power than the S5 (as some say the J/GHs is less)!

Isn't this because, the controlling system needs less power.
It only requires one computer for three boards compared with the S5 which requires one computer per one board.

I believe this is the reason why some are confused and suggest that it i smore power efficient, it just needs less power to power the computer.

No its because the chips run at a lower frequency and lower voltage, but there are more of them. The controller use negligible amount of electricity, it really does not amount to 20% of the power if it "control the boards better or not".

Its the same reason why the latest batches of S7 have less chips, higher freq and 4.7TH/s. It is because they come overvolted and overclocked. Which means the latest batches are less efficients.

Please don't bring up antminer s7. We will have another argument with bitcoin miners about their miners. the first batch was rated at 4.86 THs. Users say that they only got around 7.4THs!

Anyway, thanks for the information regarding antminer s5 and atminer s5+s

People were supposed to receive compensation for delays and for some B2 miners being send to B1 buyers. Though some users also report not receiving compensation yet.
I thought you did not want to talk about it, however? Not here to argue, but no point in making several threads for things that were already discussed in depth either.

On that subject, Hashnest.com is still getting 4.86THs of their Antminer S7s. I though tthat both server types (ones sold publically and ones transferred to their sister companies) were the same!

Good raffle going on a the moment though, wasted 2mbtc and lost on hashnest.com/luckyhash/running!

So the s5+chips were more efficient than the s5s because the s5+ ones were underclocked and s5s was overclocked?

UnderVolted, thats what increase the efficiency, but it lower the maximum clock they can run at. (You lose some hashrate to gain efficiency)

But what RichBC said should still be kept in mind, a poor efficiency design vs a good efficiency design can also help. I don't currently think that alone could of amounted in a 20% efficiency difference, but i did see the buck converter on the S7 so its probably actually true, at least in part, to why those are less or more efficient.

coinhelper

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Activity: 63

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Quote from: VirosaGITS on January 01, 2016, 02:22:03 PM

Quote from: RichBC on January 01, 2016, 02:18:21 PM

Quote from: VirosaGITS on January 01, 2016, 02:04:02 PM

Its the same reason why the latest batches of S7 have less chips, higher freq and 4.7TH/s. It is because they come overvolted and overclocked. Which means the latest batches are less efficients.

The fundamental reason why the latest S7 are less efficient is because of the added inefficiency of the Buck Converter, they are not actually overclocked relative to the applied voltage.

Rich

So you're saying B2/B6 and B8 has the same core voltage, but a 100-125Mhz difference clock? Because people were able to overclock the prior to much higher hashrate while raising the volt, but not as much on the latest batch, suggesting that they were already higher clocked.

The buck converter can cause a 17% loss in efficiency?

He means exactly that! Bitmaintech have listed the highest possible hashrate/GHS in order to get their miners to sell better and quicker. If you wanted to not overclock, it could knock off over 400GHs of mining speed (in some cases)

coinhelper

member

Activity: 63

Merit: 10

Quote from: VirosaGITS on January 01, 2016, 02:17:57 PM

Quote from: coinhelper on January 01, 2016, 02:08:20 PM

Quote from: VirosaGITS on January 01, 2016, 02:04:02 PM

Quote from: coinhelper on January 01, 2016, 12:51:30 PM

If the antminer s5+ uses less power than the S5 (as some say the J/GHs is less)!

Isn't this because, the controlling system needs less power.
It only requires one computer for three boards compared with the S5 which requires one computer per one board.

I believe this is the reason why some are confused and suggest that it i smore power efficient, it just needs less power to power the computer.

No its because the chips run at a lower frequency and lower voltage, but there are more of them. The controller use negligible amount of electricity, it really does not amount to 20% of the power if it "control the boards better or not".

Its the same reason why the latest batches of S7 have less chips, higher freq and 4.7TH/s. It is because they come overvolted and overclocked. Which means the latest batches are less efficients.

Please don't bring up antminer s7. We will have another argument with bitcoin miners about their miners. the first batch was rated at 4.86 THs. Users say that they only got around 7.4THs!

Anyway, thanks for the information regarding antminer s5 and atminer s5+s

People were supposed to receive compensation for delays and for some B2 miners being send to B1 buyers. Though some users also report not receiving compensation yet.
I thought you did not want to talk about it, however? Not here to argue, but no point in making several threads for things that were already discussed in depth either.

On that subject, Hashnest.com is still getting 4.86THs of their Antminer S7s. I though tthat both server types (ones sold publically and ones transferred to their sister companies) were the same!

Good raffle going on a the moment though, wasted 2mbtc and lost on hashnest.com/luckyhash/running!

So the s5+chips were more efficient than the s5s because the s5+ ones were underclocked and s5s was overclocked?

VirosaGITS

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Activity: 1302

Merit: 1068

Quote from: RichBC on January 01, 2016, 02:18:21 PM

Quote from: VirosaGITS on January 01, 2016, 02:04:02 PM

Its the same reason why the latest batches of S7 have less chips, higher freq and 4.7TH/s. It is because they come overvolted and overclocked. Which means the latest batches are less efficients.

The fundamental reason why the latest S7 are less efficient is because of the added inefficiency of the Buck Converter, they are not actually overclocked relative to the applied voltage.

Rich

So you're saying B2/B6 and B8 has the same core voltage, but a 100-125Mhz difference clock? Because people were able to overclock the prior to much higher hashrate while raising the volt, but not as much on the latest batch, suggesting that they were already higher clocked.

The buck converter can cause a 17% loss in efficiency?

RichBC

hero member

Activity: 588

Merit: 500

Quote from: VirosaGITS on January 01, 2016, 02:04:02 PM

Its the same reason why the latest batches of S7 have less chips, higher freq and 4.7TH/s. It is because they come overvolted and overclocked. Which means the latest batches are less efficients.

The fundamental reason why the latest S7 are less efficient is because of the added inefficiency of the Buck Converter, they are not actually overclocked relative to the applied voltage.

Rich

VirosaGITS

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Activity: 1302

Merit: 1068

Quote from: coinhelper on January 01, 2016, 02:08:20 PM

Quote from: VirosaGITS on January 01, 2016, 02:04:02 PM

Quote from: coinhelper on January 01, 2016, 12:51:30 PM

If the antminer s5+ uses less power than the S5 (as some say the J/GHs is less)!

Isn't this because, the controlling system needs less power.
It only requires one computer for three boards compared with the S5 which requires one computer per one board.

I believe this is the reason why some are confused and suggest that it i smore power efficient, it just needs less power to power the computer.

No its because the chips run at a lower frequency and lower voltage, but there are more of them. The controller use negligible amount of electricity, it really does not amount to 20% of the power if it "control the boards better or not".

Its the same reason why the latest batches of S7 have less chips, higher freq and 4.7TH/s. It is because they come overvolted and overclocked. Which means the latest batches are less efficients.

Please don't bring up antminer s7. We will have another argument with bitcoin miners about their miners. the first batch was rated at 4.86 THs. Users say that they only got around 7.4THs!

Anyway, thanks for the information regarding antminer s5 and atminer s5+s

People were supposed to receive compensation for delays and for some B2 miners being send to B1 buyers. Though some users also report not receiving compensation yet.
I thought you did not want to talk about it, however? Not here to argue, but no point in making several threads for things that were already discussed in depth either.

coinhelper

member

Activity: 63

Merit: 10

Quote from: VirosaGITS on January 01, 2016, 02:04:02 PM

Quote from: coinhelper on January 01, 2016, 12:51:30 PM

If the antminer s5+ uses less power than the S5 (as some say the J/GHs is less)!

Isn't this because, the controlling system needs less power.
It only requires one computer for three boards compared with the S5 which requires one computer per one board.

I believe this is the reason why some are confused and suggest that it i smore power efficient, it just needs less power to power the computer.

No its because the chips run at a lower frequency and lower voltage, but there are more of them. The controller use negligible amount of electricity, it really does not amount to 20% of the power if it "control the boards better or not".

Its the same reason why the latest batches of S7 have less chips, higher freq and 4.7TH/s. It is because they come overvolted and overclocked. Which means the latest batches are less efficients.

Please don't bring up antminer s7. We will have another argument with bitcoin miners about their miners. the first batch was rated at 4.86 THs. Users say that they only got around 7.4THs!

Anyway, thanks for the information regarding antminer s5 and atminer s5+s

VirosaGITS

legendary

Activity: 1302

Merit: 1068

Quote from: coinhelper on January 01, 2016, 12:51:30 PM

If the antminer s5+ uses less power than the S5 (as some say the J/GHs is less)!

Isn't this because, the controlling system needs less power.
It only requires one computer for three boards compared with the S5 which requires one computer per one board.

I believe this is the reason why some are confused and suggest that it i smore power efficient, it just needs less power to power the computer.

No its because the chips run at a lower frequency and lower voltage, but there are more of them. The controller use negligible amount of electricity, it really does not amount to 20% of the power if it "control the boards better or not".

Its the same reason why the latest batches of S7 have less chips, higher freq and 4.7TH/s. It is because they come overvolted and overclocked. Which means the latest batches are less efficients.

coinhelper

member

Activity: 63

Merit: 10

If the antminer s5+ uses less power than the S5 (as some say the J/GHs is less)!

Isn't this because, the controlling system needs less power.
It only requires one computer for three boards compared with the S5 which requires one computer per one board.

I believe this is the reason why some are confused and suggest that it i smore power efficient, it just needs less power to power the computer.

Topic: My theory about the Antminer S5+ being more efficient than the Antminer S5 (Read 646 times)