[NEW POOL & MINER] - BitcoinPool.com - Jump In! ~NO FEES~ :) - page 35.

elFarto

newbie

Activity: 4

Merit: 0

Quote from: geebus on March 09, 2011, 03:52:30 AM

Quote from: nster on March 09, 2011, 02:15:43 AM

-a 5 -t 8 -o [email protected]:#### -u XXXXXXXX -p XXXXXXXXX is how you are supposed to set it up

I'm using it with deepbit's pool (deepbit.net) it also works with btcmine.com's miner

I dug through the source code of Ufasoft's miner.

Basically, most miners (poclbm, diablominer, rpc-miner, jgarzik's cpu miner) work like this:

Client (Request for Getwork w/ Authorization Headers included) --> Server
Server (Respond with Getwork) --> Client
Client (Send Hash from Getwork) --> Server
Server (Respond with Accepted, or Invalid/Stale) --> Client

Ufasoft's Miner works like this:
Client (Request Getwork) --> Server
Server (Prompt for Authorization) --> Client
Client (Respond with Credentials) --> Server
Server (Respond with Getwork) --> Client
Client (Send Hash from Getwork) --> Server
Server (Prompt for Authorization) --> Client
Client (Respond with Credentials) --> Server
Server (Respond with Accepted, or Invalid/Stale) --> Client

Twice as much network traffic, and incompatible with our pool simply because they don't include the credentials in the headers on every request.

Maybe you can email ufasoft about it and see if they can modify the way their miner works.

I'd like to point out my RPC Proxy fixes this issue with Ufasoft's client, as it doesn't use any authorization locally, and always sends authorization to the server.

Regards
elFarto

slush

legendary

Activity: 1386

Merit: 1097

Quote from: shackleford on March 09, 2011, 09:39:04 AM

it looks like you are trying to make it more efficient to allow more people in.

I'd like to notice that they are doing it more effective for them (for the pool), but using this "hacked" miner is less effective for users. We had long discussion with FairUser and Geebus about this and it looks they still don't understand what they are doing. Pretty bad for pool operators Wink

. Their "mining efficiency" is absolutely irrelevant number.

I'm not using "ineffective miners" on my pool because I'm masochist but because it is good for users. By the way, everybody on my pool (or every other current pool) can "optimize" his miner by setting custom ask rate on command line. But I really don't recommend that.

Because I don't like to start long discussion about nothing again, this is both my first and last post in this thread. Thank you for reading.

shackleford

full member

Activity: 281

Merit: 100

Thanks for the pool guys. Slush's pool is closed and it looks like you are trying to make it more efficient to allow more people in.

To spite the thread being peppered with ^prick remarks it is appreciated. Hope we get a block soon.

xenon481

sr. member

Activity: 406

Merit: 250

Quote from: FairUser on March 09, 2011, 01:18:52 AM

Quote from: xenon481 on March 08, 2011, 08:54:32 AM

By asking a CPU Miner (or any miner that isn't at least some X% of the network's total power) to process the entire getwork solution space before performing another GetWork, you are dooming that Miner to a very significant percentage of Stale shares.

Yup, you're right. CPU miners are doomed either way. Either they ask for new work so fast that they don't even have a chance at getting through 1% of a single getwork request, or they risk working too long on a getwork and the network's block count increases by one making their work stale. CPU miner's are simply too slow to be able to run at a high efficiency against any pool, or even the bitcoin network at this point. Because the average block is solved in less time than it takes on a average CPU to process even 1 getwork all the way through, it's really not worth using a CPU to mine for bitcoins at this point.

When taking GPU's vs CPU's, it's truly a night and day difference. You could take the most powerful DUAL CPU/QUAD CORE Intel server (~12,700 khash/s) and run it against a ATI 5750 card (~150,000 khash/s) and the ATI card will smoke that server hands down...we've tried. Wink

We built and tested this the Pool with GPU's.
Could you imagine us trying to build and test a pool with CPU's?! ROFL Cheesy

So you admit that your pool too favors faster miners when you specifically (incorrectly in every way except your one shortsighted emotions over statistics way) chided Slush's pool for doing so in your OP.

Quote from: FairUser

[...] or “weight based shares" (slush's pool) which favors faster cards [...]

And only getting ~12,700khash/s is ridiculously low for a high end Intel CPU. People are reporting upwards of ~24,000khash/s when mining with their CPUs.

kseistrup

hero member

Activity: 566

Merit: 500

Unselfish actions pay back better

Quote from: geebus on March 09, 2011, 04:57:59 AM

I changed all dates to show GMT/UTC instead of server timezone (GMT-8).

Cool, thanks!

geebus

sr. member

Activity: 258

Merit: 250

Quote from: kseistrup on March 09, 2011, 03:10:05 AM

Enhancement request: Please show datetimes in UTC (seems to be PST for now?).

Rationale: Once I have figured out the time difference between the pool server and me, it'as easy to convert the timestamps on the website to localtime. However, countries switch to and from daylight saving time using different rules, and so each user has to take into account the DST rules that prevail at the pool server. It would be somewhat safe to say that most users can convert from UTC to his own timezone on the fly, hence my request.

Cheers,

I changed all dates to show GMT/UTC instead of server timezone (GMT-8).

LMGTFY

hero member

Activity: 644

Merit: 503

Quote from: geebus on March 09, 2011, 03:52:30 AM

I dug through the source code of Ufasoft's miner.
...
Twice as much network traffic, and incompatible with our pool simply because they don't include the credentials in the headers on every request.

Maybe you can email ufasoft about it and see if they can modify the way their miner works.

[Tycho] (deepbit) has already raised this with ufasoft. Apparently it's because of the HTTP library ufasoft is using. I don't know if ufasoft is planning to remedy that - it kind of sounds like [Tycho] added a workaround to deepbit.

geebus

sr. member

Activity: 258

Merit: 250

Quote from: nster on March 09, 2011, 02:15:43 AM

-a 5 -t 8 -o [email protected]:#### -u XXXXXXXX -p XXXXXXXXX is how you are supposed to set it up

I'm using it with deepbit's pool (deepbit.net) it also works with btcmine.com's miner

I dug through the source code of Ufasoft's miner.

Basically, most miners (poclbm, diablominer, rpc-miner, jgarzik's cpu miner) work like this:

Client (Request for Getwork w/ Authorization Headers included) --> Server
Server (Respond with Getwork) --> Client
Client (Send Hash from Getwork) --> Server
Server (Respond with Accepted, or Invalid/Stale) --> Client

Ufasoft's Miner works like this:
Client (Request Getwork) --> Server
Server (Prompt for Authorization) --> Client
Client (Respond with Credentials) --> Server
Server (Respond with Getwork) --> Client
Client (Send Hash from Getwork) --> Server
Server (Prompt for Authorization) --> Client
Client (Respond with Credentials) --> Server
Server (Respond with Accepted, or Invalid/Stale) --> Client

Twice as much network traffic, and incompatible with our pool simply because they don't include the credentials in the headers on every request.

Maybe you can email ufasoft about it and see if they can modify the way their miner works.

geebus

sr. member

Activity: 258

Merit: 250

Quote from: M4v3R on March 09, 2011, 02:39:27 AM

Hm... at current rate, it seems to pay ~~more~~less on my 5850 than other pools. But I'll have to mine longer to be sure.

Edit: I did the calculations wrong. It actually paid less, approx. 0.1 BTC per hour.

We pay based on the amount you're contributing vs what the whole group has contributed. If you're getting paid less, you're contributing a smaller portion of the whole.

kseistrup

hero member

Activity: 566

Merit: 500

Unselfish actions pay back better

Enhancement request: Please show datetimes in UTC (seems to be PST for now?).

Rationale: Once I have figured out the time difference between the pool server and me, it'as easy to convert the timestamps on the website to localtime. However, countries switch to and from daylight saving time using different rules, and so each user has to take into account the DST rules that prevail at the pool server. It would be somewhat safe to say that most users can convert from UTC to his own timezone on the fly, hence my request.

Cheers,

M4v3R

hero member

Activity: 607

Merit: 500

Hm... at current rate, it seems to pay ~~more~~less on my 5850 than other pools. But I'll have to mine longer to be sure.

Edit: I did the calculations wrong. It actually paid less, approx. 0.1 BTC per hour.

FairUser

sr. member

Activity: 1344

Merit: 264

bit.ly/3QXp3oh | Ultimate Launchpad on TON

Quote from: nster on March 09, 2011, 02:15:43 AM

-a 5 -t 8 -o [email protected]:#### -u XXXXXXXX -p XXXXXXXXX is how you are supposed to set it up

I'm using it with deepbit's pool (deepbit.net) it also works with btcmine.com's miner

Here's what I'm trying:

C:\Users\User>C:\Users\User\Downloads\bitcoin-miner.exe -a 60 -t 4 -o http://bitcoinpool.com:8334/ -u MYusername -p MYpassword
bitcoin-miner 0.3.2 Copyright (c) 2011 Ufasoft http://ufasoft.com/open/bitcoin

4 threads Using SSE2
0 MHash/s

It just sits their @ 0 MHash/s. I also looked under wireshark, and it's still not passing the "Authorization" header.
I don't see how a pool could track this miner's answer without using the Authorization header to know which worker is who's....

Huh

Please correct me if I'm running the command incorrectly. I don't see much documentation on it.

kseistrup

hero member

Activity: 566

Merit: 500

Unselfish actions pay back better

Quote from: FairUser on March 08, 2011, 07:51:18 PM

OK, we made a change. Auto-banning is turned off for now. CPU miners are safe.

Thanks, mate(s)!

nster

full member

Activity: 126

Merit: 100

Quote from: FairUser on March 09, 2011, 02:06:32 AM

I just tested ufasoft's CPU miner.

I was unable to connect to our pool.
I used wireshark to take a closer look at what is going on. Here is what I found:

POST / HTTP/1.1
Content-Length: 43
Host: bitcoinpool.com:8334
Cache-Control: no-cache

{"method": "getwork", "params": [], "id":0}HTTP/1.0 401 not authorized

The red text is the response from our server.
The blue test is the request to our server.
It appears that this CPU miner is somehow missing the "Authorization" in the HTTP headers when making the request.
I haven't used this client before, so I attempted to use it on slush's pool too. It didn't work their either.

So how many people have gotten this miner to work??
I would also be curious to know how you got it working...because I can't see how it's Authenticating to the pool servers.
I did enter my login and password on the command line, but it doesn't look like it's sending that information to the server in anyway....which would be the a very good reason why it is not working for some of you! Wink

Hopefully ufasoft will fix this issue soon.

(This was tested on a Win7 x64 w/ Intel I7 quad core.)

-a 5 -t 8 -o [email protected]:#### -u XXXXXXXX -p XXXXXXXXX is how you are supposed to set it up

I'm using it with deepbit's pool (deepbit.net) it also works with btcmine.com's miner

FairUser

sr. member

Activity: 1344

Merit: 264

bit.ly/3QXp3oh | Ultimate Launchpad on TON

I just tested ufasoft's CPU miner.

I was unable to connect to our pool.
I used wireshark to take a closer look at what is going on. Here is what I found:

POST / HTTP/1.1
Content-Length: 43
Host: bitcoinpool.com:8334
Cache-Control: no-cache

{"method": "getwork", "params": [], "id":0}HTTP/1.0 401 not authorized

The red text is the response from our server.
The blue test is the request to our server.
It appears that this CPU miner is somehow missing the "Authorization" in the HTTP headers when making the request.
I haven't used this client before, so I attempted to use it on slush's pool too. It didn't work their either.

So how many people have gotten this miner to work??
I would also be curious to know how you got it working...because I can't see how it's Authenticating to the pool servers.
I did enter my login and password on the command line, but it doesn't look like it's sending that information to the server in anyway....which would be the a very good reason why it is not working for some of you! Wink

Hopefully ufasoft will fix this issue soon.

(This was tested on a Win7 x64 w/ Intel I7 quad core.)

geebus

sr. member

Activity: 258

Merit: 250

Quote from: M4v3R on March 09, 2011, 02:01:34 AM

What about payouts? When are you paying the BTC and how can I change the threshold?

We pay as soon as the block is confirmed, and currently, it will pay whatever you've earned, rounded to the 8th digit after the decimal for compatibility with bitcoind. We explain it in our FAQ.

We'll be adding payment thresholds later.

M4v3R

hero member

Activity: 607

Merit: 500

What about payouts? When are you paying the BTC and how can I change the threshold?

FairUser

sr. member

Activity: 1344

Merit: 264

bit.ly/3QXp3oh | Ultimate Launchpad on TON

Quote from: TinkerToyTech on March 09, 2011, 01:22:46 AM

Think of it as printing lottery tickets instead of money, you printing outthe chance for a chacne at some real money,

and if someone can go through the paces for gpu mining for throttable minimg for me and can perhaps help me set it up
I would arrange payment in a say, tv card for the US, I have a couple AVERMEDIA ATSC cards around and I'll mail you
one in payment if you can help me get setup mining wiht my cpu and dual gpu on a single card. Please. email
[email protected] or @tinkerToyTech on the twitter and that facebook thing

I'll be happy to help you out, no payment is necessary. Maybe a donation once we get you up and you've been able to mine for awhile. Wink

PM me the following information:
- What type of video card do you currently have
- What the driver version is for your video card

TinkerToyTech

newbie

Activity: 6

Merit: 0

Think of it as printing lottery tickets instead of money, you printing outthe chance for a chacne at some real money,

and if someone can go through the paces for gpu mining for throttable minimg for meand can perhaps help me set it up
I would arrange payment in a say, tv card for the US, I have a couple AVERMEDIA ATSC cards around and I'll mail you
one in payment if you can help me get setup mining wiht my cpu and dual gpu on a single card. Please. email
[email protected] or @tinkerToyTech on the twitter and that facebook thing

Quote from: geebus on March 09, 2011, 12:05:04 AM

Quote from: jgarzik on March 08, 2011, 11:02:12 PM

This efficiency number is a bit misleading, IMO.

There is no guarantee that a solution exists in a 'getwork' data unit.

Better to rename "efficiency" as "luck." It is more clear.

It's "efficiency" in the sense that it's the percentage of how close you are to a 1:1 ratio of getworks asked to answers submitted. It's more "efficient" in regards to a pool because it causes less traffic on the server, and allows for more users to connect and participate, thus increasing the potential for blocks to be solved at a faster rate.

The miner itself yields results at the same speed as the core version of m0mchill's miner, but with a greatly reduced network load.

ef·fi·cien·cy [ih-fish-uhn-see]
–noun, plural -cies.

1) the ratio of the work done or energy developed by a machine, engine, etc., to the energy supplied to it, usually expressed as a percentage.

By dictionary definition, our miner fork is more efficient if you're looking at the getworks as "energy" and answers as "work done".

FairUser

sr. member

Activity: 1344

Merit: 264

bit.ly/3QXp3oh | Ultimate Launchpad on TON

Quote from: xenon481 on March 08, 2011, 08:54:32 AM

By asking a CPU Miner (or any miner that isn't at least some X% of the network's total power) to process the entire getwork solution space before performing another GetWork, you are dooming that Miner to a very significant percentage of Stale shares.

Yup, you're right. CPU miners are doomed either way. Either they ask for new work so fast that they don't even have a chance at getting through 1% of a single getwork request, or they risk working too long on a getwork and the network's block count increases by one making their work stale. CPU miner's are simply too slow to be able to run at a high efficiency against any pool, or even the bitcoin network at this point. Because the average block is solved in less time than it takes on a average CPU to process even 1 getwork all the way through, it's really not worth using a CPU to mine for bitcoins at this point.

When taking GPU's vs CPU's, it's truly a night and day difference. You could take the most powerful DUAL CPU/QUAD CORE Intel server (~12,700 khash/s) and run it against a ATI 5750 card (~150,000 khash/s) and the ATI card will smoke that server hands down...we've tried. Wink

We built and tested this the Pool with GPU's.
Could you imagine us trying to build and test a pool with CPU's?! ROFL Cheesy

Topic: [NEW POOL & MINER] - BitcoinPool.com - Jump In! ~NO FEES~ :) - page 35. (Read 101960 times)