Topic: NOOB need help. OLD ass wallet HOW TO ? (Read 2104 times)

Yeah, localbitcoins "can" be good... Depends on where you live and who is available etc... Usual precautions apply.

As for mixer's... BitMixer closed recently... ChipMixer is a recent addition to the marketplace, but is pretty reliable in my experience. I've heard good things about BitBlender, but never used it...

ChipMixer works slightly differently to "traditional" mixer's... They just give you private keys rather than forwarding to an address... The keys are preloaded with value so it can mix almost instantly. They currently work on a donation system.

Traditional mixer's like BitBlender generally ask for a forwarding address, and allow you to specify a fee in a range (to help "randomise" the fee and make it harder to identify it as being a mixer transaction)... And allow you to set a timer for when the forwarding transaction is done... Again, to make it more difficult to track.

One thing to be wary of is "clone" sites that look exactly like the original with a similar URL but are scams...

Hello Thank for all your help HCP.

"It is probably going to be tough to split them up yourself in such a way that a determined person will not be able to track them, given that the blockchain is a public ledger... You could use a Bitcoin Mixer (see the sig Wink), they support multiple "forward" addresses (I'm sure other mixers do as well)... so you would generate a bunch of new Trezor addresses, then send a transaction with all your coins from OriginalTrezorAddress, and say X BTC to NewAddressA, Y BTC to NewAddressB, Z BTC to NewAddressC etc etc...

If you just do it yourself... it would be easy for someone to see the coins go from OriginalTrezorAddress to these other addresses... with the mixer, all the transactions to the NewAddresses will come from random addresses with no link to you (in theory anyway Wink)"

I will check your sig out. Haven't had time as of late been busy. So how are these mixers safe ? ..........I create say for example 50 new addys on my trezor. then send 1 coin to mixer then to one of those addresses and etc until I have 50 new addys all with 1 btc each ............ ? These are just free services no hidden fees or BS like that? Also I will still get charged a sending fee from my wallet correct this will happen basically anytime i move them somewhere ?. Are there things I need to be careful of for choosing a mixer or extra steps to check when using the mixer ?

step 1  btc to mixer.
step 2 mix it .............. how long does it take to mix ?
step 3 then enter it into new addy to send to and done.

Almost seems to easy o.O ****slowly putting tinfoil hat back on****

Never used one before. Does it mix right away or take time and how can I be sure that coin being mixed will come back ? I dont like the idea of it being out of my hardware wallet. Is this basically the only way. Thank you.

One last thing what is a good site to use for selling a few. I heard Local bitcoins is good ? You can actually meet up with people in you area and sell them. Or am i wrong about that ?

Thanks... that was mighty generous of you



It is probably going to be tough to split them up yourself in such a way that a determined person will not be able to track them, given that the blockchain is a public ledger... You could use a Bitcoin Mixer (see the sig ), they support multiple "forward" addresses (I'm sure other mixers do as well)... so you would generate a bunch of new Trezor addresses, then send a transaction with all your coins from OriginalTrezorAddress, and say X BTC to NewAddressA, Y BTC to NewAddressB, Z BTC to NewAddressC etc etc...

If you just do it yourself... it would be easy for someone to see the coins go from OriginalTrezorAddress to these other addresses... with the mixer, all the transactions to the NewAddresses will come from random addresses with no link to you (in theory anyway )



The "watch only" wallet is exactly that... it just allows you to view the addresses/transactions/balance... but you CANNOT spend from it... there are no private keys stored in it... so it is safe to have it on an online (or even public) computers from a security of wallet perspective... you just need to be mindful of the privacy implications

So the workflow to send, is to plug the Trezor into the computer with Electrum. Then create the transaction and attempt to send, it should ask for authentication via the Trezor (showing address and amount etc)... you do the verification and the transaction gets signed on the Trezor device... and it gives the signed transaction back to Electrum to broadcast.

Electrum will be able to update WITHOUT the trezor attached and even if you send from elsewhere... it has the "Master Public Key" so it knows all your Trezor addresses (hence the privacy implications mentioned above) and will be able to receive updates from the blockchain about your transactions

Yes, you can have watching only wallet on as many computers as you like. Security is not the issue with doing this... privacy is.



Usually a good idea to check that... it allows "Replace-By-Fee" (aka RBF)... whereby you can easily bump up the fee on a transaction that you have sent, without having to resort to trying double spend or "Child Pays For Parent"/CPFP etc, in the event that your transaction gets stuck for low fees



Assuming your transactions are all confirmed, then yes... Core is empty and no longer needed. I'd keep a backup of the wallet.dat file ("just in case")... but you probably don't need the Core application or the downloaded blockchain data any more.



Yes, that seed is now the key to ALL your coins... even if your Trezor were to be stolen/lost/damaged tomorrow, you can still recover all your coins with just the seed. So, make sure you have a nice secure, safe backup of that seed... for the amounts you're dealing with... a safety deposit box at your bank may be a wise investment.



Yes... the private keys are safely locked inside the Trezor and never exposed to the host computer. If on a diff computer, you can use whatever wallet you want that is compatible with Trezor

glad it worked out nicely for you...

It must be a trill to wake up and:

ah uhh I think I have a six years old wallet full of BTC...let see if I can make that work....

specially with increase of BTC price..

what a foresight to have them kept like that

also a good tip i came across while reading was covering you camera when installing and writing down your trezor seed. Some people might laugh at that thought however after I read that I totally wiped my trezor good thing I didnt have anything it in at the time, then paper and taped up my camera and re install to write down new seed. Just thought I would try to contribute what i could to this post of mine hahah might not be much but for me I thought it was important.

Looks like i have done it ! woohooo

I will send you your tips today sir and thank you again. hopefully its enough to keep you on retainer for future security questions lol

(privacy) I put all my coins into one address some say not to however I didnt want to risk typing in another address when my test was already successful. How do I split them up when sending so ppl cant see my true balance ? I send the amounts to my celluim wallet first ? can they track it back to my trezor ? or do i break them up into addresses on my trezor first.

My electrum hardware wallet i tried to send some from it and it just ask for output from trezor (couldnt find the output thing on my trezor) ?? so being a watch only i cant send from this wallet correct has to be from my actual trezor ?
Always use the same computer that has my electrum hard wallet to send with my trezor ? so it will always update and i can view my watch only wallet. Or can i have the watch only wallet on multiple computers and check whenever. Still kinda of confused with the watch only wallet


also on electrum it has a box that says REPLACEABLE should i have that checked or no ?

my core wallet balance is zero can i throw all my usbs with backout in garbage now ? its way safer on my trezor and no need for core any more ?

the only thing that can lose my coins now is loss of the trezor seed correct ?

I can can use my trezor on any computer now with less worry about being infected ? If i use my trezor on a diff computer do i need to download electrum hardwallet to that computer again ?

I think that is all for security and privacy unless you have some more tips.

Not sure I would have used 1 BTC for a test! Hahaha But glad to hear it all seems to have worked as it should...



Clever thinking not using the USB with the wallet file... I'd completely overlooked that!



That fee looks lowish... 4520 sats / 225 bytes = 20.8 sats/byte... But the network load has been relatively low of late... The vast majority of unconfirmed transactions are down below the 20-40 sats/byte mark: https://btc.com/stats/unconfirmed-tx

Did you adjust the fee "slider" in Core when you created the transaction?



The hardware one is effectively the "watching wallet" for the Trezor... So it's good to keep so you can see your up to date balance and create transactions etc. It's perfectly safe to have on an online computer as it doesn't hold private keys.



The fees are set when you create the transaction... So for your initial transactions to get the coins into Trezor, they are set in Core. After you have all your coins in Trezor the fees will be set in whatever wallet you are using with Trezor (ie. Electrum). Electrum has several options for fees, dynamic or manual. It gives you a lot of control, if you want it.



Mycelium is considered one of the better Android wallets... Although the fee system is what I'd call "dynamic preset". You basically get 4 settings "low-prio", "economic", "normal" and "priority"... This is somewhat akin to the slider in Core and Mycelium's guess at "25 blocks", "10 blocks", "5 blocks" and "1 block" confirmation time. The actual amounts are dynamic and change according to current network conditions.

From personal experience, the fees tend to be a little higher than other wallets, but that should mean that your transaction won't get "stuck".

There is also a version of Electrum for Android, which you might want to check out as well.



To minimise fees, I would suggest that you send all in one transaction, set the fee slider as you want in Bitcoin Core... Double check the fee before you send. There are methods to "accelerate" your transaction if it gets stuck, so you should be able to use a minimal fee (I'd recommend the 20+ as an absolute minimum).



No, once the transaction is created and signed, you don't need Core for anything else... You could theoretically remove it (keep the wallet file of course "just in case" )

Personally, I'd wait until everything was fully moved and shifted to the Trezor and confirmed before removing it (mainly because having to resync would be a total P.I.T.A!!?! )


If the transaction has been confirmed, and your Trezor address shows 1 BTC on a block explorer... Then it sounds like that 1 BTC is safely in your Trezor wallet

Okay So I think I did it properly !! *crosses fingers*  With a 1 btc test.

I did a 1 btc transaction with my core that is only up to date to 2015 or something. I did the transaction to my trezor from my core wallet on my offline computer. got the raw data hex to and used another usb to plugged into my online computer and used coinb.in/#broadcast. I did not use my USB with the wallet file for this of course.

my trezor now says 1 btc balance. (See last question please)

my core wallet fee said .00004520

Here is the summary from my trezor
size: 225(bytes)
Fee rate : .000208888~ per kb
Fee: .00004520
Lock time:
41 confirmations

so now that 1 btc is safely into my trezor ? If this fee rate correct ? Seems low for nowadays.

A few more questions.

I installed my trezor and then i downloaded electrum and selected hardware wallet to connect the two ? is this correct to do ? or should i make another electrum wallet thats not hardware.

How to set fees with coin.in/#broadcast ? or are they just auto set from the site
How to set fees with electrum ? or will it be same as trezor which i have set to high fees ? is that correct ?

I use mycellium on my phone is that a safe one to send small amounts to from my trezor ? and how to configure fees for mycellium ?

Any other tips for using trezor, electrum,mycell, core and coinb.in so I do not get roasted with fees because I will soon send all of my coins there I dont not want to do that just yet. Want to make sure my test of 1 btc looks good to you. Or safety tips.

once i send all my coins do i need to sync bitcoin core wallet fully for the transaction to be complete ? example i now have 1 btc in my trezor however is it actually there even tho my core is not fully synced ? Or do i have to sync and then even more fees will be paid once its fully sync.

Or did i do properly and my 1 BTC is safe and sound sleeping in my trezor no more fees and I can go ahead and do all the rest now  

Also HPC can you PM me your you bitcoin wallet address. I would like to offer you some compensation for all your help you have gone above and beyond my friend. Im sure I will have some more newb questions up and coming. Ok I cancel the sync encrypt dummy wallet and disconnect computer. Would you use this computer to put my actual USB with my wallet file on it if u were in my shoes lol ? Basically its been online for only less then 24 hours and all apps deleted and only been to three sites trezor electrum and bitcoin.org. Should be alright o.O alright on to the next steps tonight I will let u know tomorrow how it went.l Have a great night

Sadly, very normal... The blockchain data is quite large... Around 140+gigs these days... And takes a while to download, verify and index. This is why I said to just sync up to 2013. You don't need blocks from today if you haven't sent or received any transactions for 6 years!

It should tell you what date you are currently synced up to... If you cant see the full dialog box showing the current block number and date and time remaining etc... Click the green progress bar at the bottom of the main window.

Once it is at a date you're happy with... You can disconnect the client (click the little network icon in the bottom right corner) and then your computer from the network.

Can't answer that... My tinfoil hat is a different size to yours! But there is no point buying a new computer once your coins are already in a hardware wallet... They're supposedly safe on totally compromised systems...

Granted there is some risk having your wallet.dat on the old computer, even for a short length of time online... But you'd need to assess if you're comfortable with that or not.



Fees are based on the "data" size of the transaction... And NOT the amount of BTC being sent... The data size is mostly dependent on the number of inputs to a transaction. The inputs are determined by how many individual payments you received to your wallet. So if your 50 coins came from 50 payments, you'd have 50 inputs (and quite a large transaction)... However, if your 50 coins came from 5 payments, your transaction would only have 5 inputs and be about 1/10th the size.

Regardless of how many inputs you have, sending all the coins in one transaction should result in less fees overall... As then you would only have 1 output (34 bytes) + 1 transaction data (10 bytes) = 44 bytes of "output" data instead of having 50 transactions with 1 output each (50*34 + 50*10 = 1700+500= 2200 bytes)!  

Fees are measured in sats/byte... So, given current fee levels of like 200+ sats/byte... You're looking at 8800 sats for 1 transaction... And 440,000 sats in total for 50 transactions. (NOTE: this is only the cost of the outputs, the inputs actually cost about 5 times as much as the outputs 148-180 bytes per input)...

Hello. So here is where i am now. However I have a few questions.

1. Setup TREZOR as required (if you want to use Electrum, go for it) and generate a receiving address.
2. Install and Setup Bitcoin Core. DO NOT use your old wallet.dat at the moment, just create a "dummy" wallet. At this stage I'd also recommend setting the Display Units to "BTC" just to avoid any confusion later (Settings -> Options -> Display -> Units to show amounts in)
3. Run Bitcoin Core and let it sync up to at least when you stopped using your wallet (ie. Let it sync until say 2012 or 2013 just to be safe if you think you stopped 6 years ago). This actually shouldn't take very long.

---------I am just download bitcoin core it is syncing is it normal I left it on over night and its only got 40 percent done so far ??
The new computer I used I deleted all third party apps and only visited trezor, electrum and bitcoin core official websites. Off my secure WIFI.

Next question is it safe to do the next steps off my computer ? should be ok i think *put on tinfoil hat* or do u suggest buying a new computer to keep offline at all times and do the USB transfers from offline to the one im currently using ?

6. Make a copy of your wallet.dat from the USB and put it in the Bitcoin Core datadir (By default, on windows this should be %appdata%\Bitcoin unless you changed it during install/setup), overwriting the default wallet.dat that would have been created during install/setup.
7. Start Bitcoin Core. It will likely need to spend a few minutes rescanning (but not redownloading) the blockchain for the transactions for your wallet. Once complete, you should be able to see all your coins, addresses and transaction history etc.
8. Once you can see all your coins, you can create a "test" transaction that sends a small amount of coins to your new TREZOR. Be mindful not to send "dust" Wink
9. Re-connect to the internet to broadcast the transaction and then disconnect again. (see notes below for alternatives)
10. Once you are satisfied that the TREZOR is working as it should be with your "test" transaction, you can then create a transaction that sends ALL your coins to your TREZOR (either the address from Step #1 or create a new TREZOR address). (see below)
11. Re-connect to the internet and send the transaction. (see below)

One last thing about fees. Do it matter now large of transaction I am doing ? example if i send 50+ at once would i still get the same fees as sending 1coin 50 times.

Ok... so at this point I would probably do something like the following:

• 1. Setup TREZOR as required (if you want to use Electrum, go for it) and generate a receiving address.
• 2. Install and Setup Bitcoin Core. DO NOT use your old wallet.dat at the moment, just create a "dummy" wallet. At this stage I'd also recommend setting the Display Units to "BTC" just to avoid any confusion later (Settings -> Options -> Display -> Units to show amounts in)
• 3. Run Bitcoin Core and let it sync up to at least when you stopped using your wallet (ie. Let it sync until say 2012 or 2013 just to be safe if you think you stopped 6 years ago). This actually shouldn't take very long.
• 4. Shut down Bitcoin Core
• 5. Disconnect from ALL networks
• 6. Make a copy of your wallet.dat from the USB and put it in the Bitcoin Core datadir (By default, on windows this should be %appdata%\Bitcoin unless you changed it during install/setup), overwriting the default wallet.dat that would have been created during install/setup.
• 7. Start Bitcoin Core. It will likely need to spend a few minutes rescanning (but not redownloading) the blockchain for the transactions for your wallet. Once complete, you should be able to see all your coins, addresses and transaction history etc.
• 8. Once you can see all your coins, you can create a "test" transaction that sends a small amount of coins to your new TREZOR. Be mindful not to send "dust"
• 9. Re-connect to the internet to broadcast the transaction and then disconnect again. (see notes below for alternatives)
• 10. Once you are satisfied that the TREZOR is working as it should be with your "test" transaction, you can then create a transaction that sends ALL your coins to your TREZOR (either the address from Step #1 or create a new TREZOR address). (see below)
• 11. Re-connect to the internet and send the transaction. (see below)

NOTES:
- Please note that the above is just what I would do, if I was in your situation. I don't necessarily recommend that you follow the same procedure.

- Step 7, If you don't see your coins or any transaction history, you'll need to check the wallet addresses and see if they still hold coins. ("File -> Receiving Addresses") and check some of the addresses on a block explorer like blockchain.info. Once you find the addresses with coins, make sure that you have sync'd Core up to the last date that these addresses have transactions listed for them.

- Step 8, I would recommend that you send at least 0.001 BTC as a test and don't send anything smaller.

- Step 9 and Step 11, if you'd rather not reconnect the computer with your wallet.dat on it to the internet, you can simply copy the "raw" transaction onto a USB, transfer it to another computer and broadcast using one the websites listed below. These websites can't do anything "bad" with your already signed transaction, it is no different to broadcasting the transaction to the network yourself.

To get the raw transaction, simply right-click on the new "unconfirmed" transaction in the "Transactions" tab, and select "copy raw transaction". Then paste that data into a text document (it will just be a big long "hex" string of numbers/characters), save the text file onto a USB and transfer to another computer.

Then on the online computer, copy the hex from the text document and paste into one of the following:
https://coinb.in/#broadcast
http://blockr.io/tx/push
https://live.blockcypher.com/btc/pushtx/
https://btc.com/tools/tx/publish

Several of these sites give you the option to "decode" or "verify" so you can double check the transaction details (output address, amount and fee etc) before broadcasting.


- Step 10, I would recommend that you switch on "Enable Coin Control Features" and "Spend unconfirmed Change" in Settings (Settings -> Options -> Wallet). Especially if you sent a test transaction, as you'll no doubt end up with "change" from that test and as your Core won't be sync'd, any change from the test won't be "confirmed" until you let Core sync all the way!

When you got to setup the transaction, on the "Send" tab, click the "Inputs" button and then the "Select All" button. You should be able to see the "bytes" value. This will also enable you to work out an appropriate fee. These websites will give you an idea of the fees currently in use:
https://btc.com/stats/unconfirmed-tx
https://bitcoinfees.21.co/

Please note that if you fail to use a "proper" fee, there is a good chance that your transaction (and all your coins) could get "stuck" in an unconfirmed state. I would highly recommend that you let Bitcoin Core calculate a fee for you (Use "Recommended" setting in the "Send" tab and use the slider to adjust to an amount/confirmation time that you are comfortable with)... unless you are 110% sure you know what you're doing setting a custom fee.

Hello Thank you for you response it helped a lot.  Heres where i am at right now

I have my new computer:
I have my trezor
I have my old USB with wallet file

My Next Step I am going to do is:
download electrum plug in trezor and create wallets.

does this sound right so far ?? do i also need to download core ?

after this step is what scares me because i do not know what to do.

Then I go offline with my computer. Then plug my USB stick in with my old wallet file.
I should be able to see my coins at this point ?



I have never sent or received coins on this address. It is synced up to last time I sent 6-7 years ago.

If cannot see cions What if I cannot ? Do i need to download block chain to sync ? do i download with my usb stick in the computer that my coins are on ?

"If you can see ALL of your coins, you will be able to create and sign a transaction that sends those coins to another address (ie. a receive address on your newly setup TREZOR)."
do i do this offline or do i have to go online to create this ? and how do i create this signed transaction.

Is there a way just to send a small amount of coins as a test ?

which way would be the lowest fees of moving 50-100 coins ?

So sorry about all these question I just want to learn as much as possible before I do something stupid and lose them......A small test would be great if that is possible to move a small amount.
I would like to keep my usb with my coins offline as much as possible until they go to my trezor.

So, you can setup your TREZOR as per the TREZOR installation instructions. I'm sure it came with appropriate documentation and they have a lot of stuff on their website: http://doc.satoshilabs.com/trezor-user/index.html

Once you have it setup, generate a receive address... you'll need it to send all your coins to later.

So have you received any coins to the wallet or not? And is the wallet sync'd up to the point where you last received coins? ie. can you open Bitcoin Core and see ALL your coins? Is the balance what you expect to see, regardless of the fact that Bitcoin Core may be ~6 years behind in terms of blocks downloaded.

If you can see ALL of your coins, you will be able to create and sign a transaction that sends those coins to another address (ie. a receive address on your newly setup TREZOR).

Depends on your personal level of paranoia and the perceived level of risk you are willing to carry. If you think your computer is clean (run malwarebytes, spybot search and destroy, SomeOtherAntivirusAntiMalwareApp etc)... then switch off the WiFi, turn on Bitcoin Core and create and sign the transaction that sends ALL your coins to your new TREZOR address. I'd advise triple checking that the address is correct

If you don't then back up all your stuff, re-install a clean OS or use a live linux distro like Tails or buy a new computer... do whatever makes you feel secure. The only person that question is you.

Yes, moving your coins will require fees. Also, fees are a LOT higher than they were 6 years ago. Might pay to make sure you're familiar with 'average' fees these days (ref: https://btc.com/stats/unconfirmed-tx and https://bitcoinfees.21.co/) required for fast confirmation times.

No, you don't need to store any coins in an Electrum wallet, you can send them all straight to the TREZOR.

finally remembered my password on here lol jeffjeff22 also wanted to add that I would like to do as much offline as possible with minimal fees.  Anymore help would be great, also can you explain a bit more easier i am totally not a tech person you guys are amazing for trying to help so much !!! I thank you all

If you have NOT received any coins since you last sync'd your bitcoin QT wallet... and you still have all the old blockchain data on your computer along with your wallet file... then you could effectively just setup the TREZOR, generate a receiving address and then create and sign a transaction offline that sends all your coins to that receiving address. You would then just need to transfer that signed raw transaction to an online computer and broadcast it to the network using one of these:
https://coinb.in/#broadcast
http://blockr.io/tx/push
https://live.blockcypher.com/btc/pushtx/
https://btc.com/tools/tx/publish


I have not touched my wallet at all.  Are these safe ? Sorry I am not tech savvy at all lol can you break this down a little bit ? Would u suggest getting a new computer to do this so its safer ? I do not want my coins online for very long. It is out of my comfort zone what I am transferring however I know having them on trezor will be safer.

Is it okay to set up my trezor and electrum from my own computer I have had for many years using my WIFI. Or should I take an extra step buy a new computer ? I am using windows at the moment also worries me about this virus heart bleed etc etc. 

So set up trezor and electrum. Then what I take my USB stick plug into my laptop offline ? get address and then go to my trezor and send them. Also what about fees ? are there any for moving them onto my trezor ? I do not need to move them to electru, correct ? I can transfer all the to my trezor.

Hello Sorry I lost my user name and password to account on here lol so i created another. I couldnt see my post it got moved here so if another pops up please ignore it.

Yes I have the wallet.dat file and private keys

Regarding the malware question, to me, a lot depends on how many bitcoins the wallet controls and your comfort level. For me, if it had more than 100 (maybe even over 50) then I'd at minimum use Linux/tails and perhaps even a new laptop running something besides a Windows.

Export the private keys and then send from them to your Trezor address.  And make sure you download everything (electrum etc) from the real web site.

You need to send your coins to an address controlled by your TREZOR.

If you have NOT received any coins since you last sync'd your bitcoin QT wallet... and you still have all the old blockchain data on your computer along with your wallet file... then you could effectively just setup the TREZOR, generate a receiving address and then create and sign a transaction offline that sends all your coins to that receiving address. You would then just need to transfer that signed raw transaction to an online computer and broadcast it to the network using one of these:
https://coinb.in/#broadcast
http://blockr.io/tx/push
https://live.blockcypher.com/btc/pushtx/
https://btc.com/tools/tx/publish

If you have received coins or you no longer have the old blockchain data, then you either have to let Bitcoin Core sync up... will take a while and gobble up some 120+Gigs of diskspace... and then send your coins to your TREZOR.
or
You can dump out your private keys from Bitcoin-QT (dumpwallet or dumpprivkey) and then sweep them into an address that is controlled by your TREZOR using Electrum.

If you need to dump out your private keys, then you'll want to do this either on an airgapped computer or a virtual machine with no networking etc... maybe even consider using a "live" distro like TailsOS or something with all the networking disabled.