Not communism: The real cause of hyperinflation in Venezuela - page 2.

The Ghoul

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Quote from: mindrust on August 28, 2021, 12:15:12 AM

Quote from: Kittygalore on August 24, 2021, 10:38:11 AM

The real cause of hyperinflation in Venezuela is a combination of continuous printing of fiat, corruption of the government officials and zero to no investment in public service. It's not communism there, I think they have socialism which aims to satisfy the needs of the people first before anything else which is a bad move for them.

Not only the officials are corrupt. The whole country is. These government guys did't come from a different country. They are Venezuelan people. The other stuff like printing FIAT and socialism are not even significant compared to the fact that these people are corrupt. Cuba is socialism too but we don't hear them bitching or dying of hunger.

So in the end, whether people in a country starve to death has nothing to do with communism, socialism, or capitalism.

What determines their living conditions is the level of national development and production efficiency. It can even be said that the welfare and health care system is built on high production efficiency.

mindrust

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Quote from: Kittygalore on August 24, 2021, 10:38:11 AM

The real cause of hyperinflation in Venezuela is a combination of continuous printing of fiat, corruption of the government officials and zero to no investment in public service. It's not communism there, I think they have socialism which aims to satisfy the needs of the people first before anything else which is a bad move for them.

Not only the officials are corrupt. The whole country is. These government guys did't come from a different country. They are Venezuelan people. The other stuff like printing FIAT and socialism are not even significant compared to the fact that these people are corrupt. Cuba is socialism too but we don't hear them bitching or dying of hunger.

The Ghoul

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Quote from: Poker Player on August 25, 2021, 09:52:47 AM

In any case, I don't care where he is from, he seems to think communist regimes are wonderful, and that only happens if you are very close to those who are in charge. As a fellow forum member told him:

Quote from: amishmanish on August 06, 2021, 10:08:30 PM

Dear CCP representative, Welcome to Democracy 101.

Please do not quote other irrelevant posts.

I elaborated on the hyperinflation in Venezuela. topic quoted from an economics article.

I did have a fierce quarrel with amishmanish, but it did not hinder this topic.

I gave you another post with a merit.And I will continue to update my not communism series. Wink

Poker Player

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Quote from: LUCKMCFLY on August 22, 2021, 01:44:40 PM

Well, in reality communism is fully to blame for the catastrophe that Venezuela is now going through, is it a fallacy to say that this absurd policy did not end the country? OP is Venezuelan? the only way to speak like this is because he is obviously a supporter of the government, the elimination of small and medium industry, the total of the whole disaster began when unsustainable economic decisions were made and full of impulses.

It does not make any sense to say that the disaster did not come after being in a communist system, now the only solution that can be seen is for that whole system to be destroyed, or for them to adopt BTC for everything, so that hyperinflation ends, and that is what I say properly since every economic study points it out. The source was obviously made by an economist who has no idea about the situation in Venezuela nor did he experience it.

Actually, I would say he is Chinese. I was familiar with his nickname and when I saw his post history, I saw that he created this thread:

Is there discrimination in the forum?

In any case, I don't care where he is from, he seems to think communist regimes are wonderful, and that only happens if you are very close to those who are in charge. As a fellow forum member told him:

Quote from: amishmanish on August 06, 2021, 10:08:30 PM

Dear CCP representative, Welcome to Democracy 101.

DooMAD

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Leave no FUD unchallenged

Quote from: mindrust on August 22, 2021, 01:47:56 PM

The country is just corrupt.

This. Whether your country is capitalist, socialist, authoritarian, libertarian, or whatever else, if people in the government are lining their own pockets and the pockets of their supporters, it can and likely will fail at some point. You can't have people siphoning off large sums of money without consequence.

Kittygalore

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The real cause of hyperinflation in Venezuela is a combination of continuous printing of fiat, corruption of the government officials and zero to no investment in public service. It's not communism there, I think they have socialism which aims to satisfy the needs of the people first before anything else which is a bad move for them.

herurist

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Quote from: mindrust on August 22, 2021, 01:47:56 PM

Norway and Saudi Arabia also depend on the oil exports but they didn't collapse.

I think the situation of Venezuela has nothing to do with the oil prices.

The country is just corrupt.

Some people just cannot differ right from wrong and they cannot think for the long term.

indeed the complex problem here is when rich countries are not accompanied by competent human resources and this is a real example and the difference is very clear.
Norway is a country that even though the country is small but they can manage and make the excess of fuel and oil a profit for the country and even its people and if you look at things that are in Venezuela, this actually feels inversely proportional when government policies depend on only one sector in this case. state revenues and accompanied by very high levels of subsidies, resulting in nepotism everywhere and indeed hyperimplation is certain and can no longer be maintained because indeed the policies that the government is carrying out are indirectly destroyed from within by some corrupt governments themselves.

Hydrogen

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Venezuela's government waged war against capitalism and the private sector in the country. That's what caused the demise of their economy. They harassed and threatened to nationalize factories in the country run by toyota, kelloggs and other big name brands. Then after toyota, kelloggs and other corporations fled the country, state officials went in and looted everything like common thieves.

State regulators overprinted the native currency, the bolivar, in an effort to compensate for the destruction of jobs and business their heavy handed authoritarian approach had caused.

Socialism? Communism? Whatever you call them, they floated the idea they could give people free things (free healthcare, free education). And promoted the idea that attacking and destroying capitalism would improve qualify of life. If you attack your local economy and kill off most of big business people rely upon to support themselves, your economy dies. Who would have guessed.

Wind_FURY

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Communism, Socialism, Capitalism, and other “ISMs” will lose control of the financial system as long as the leaders behind the “ISMs” are INCOMPETENT. I believe one of the next countries to experience a Hyperinflation Event will be that of CapitalISM. The unsustainability of BRRR money printing economics.

Darker45

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Quote from: Assface16678 on August 21, 2021, 11:39:42 AM

It's a combination of socialism and corruption of their government and over reliance to oil that has caused this hyperinflation that they have been experiencing now and if the leaders of this country invested on infrastructures like hospitals, schools and other public infrastructure then we would've seen something different, they got too complacent that they didn't expect oil to go down in prices.

I doubt the particular form of government in Venezuela is the one primarily causing the economy and the entire country, so to speak, to crumble down. Venezuela is not even truly a socialist country. The problem, of course, is a lot more complicated than it may seem, but I guess it is mainly the government's mismanagement that led to the country's failure. Of course, too much reliance on oil is just one big failure representing mismanagement. That's basically a lack of foresight on the part of the government's experts.

johnyj

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Beyond Imagination

TLDR,

The only reason for hyperinflation is increased money supply by many magnitudes. Those newly printed money are distributed to a few government officers that owns the oil supply, lots of people in the country does not get more reward for produce anything, thus the supply of tangible products and services are still very limited, then the price of everything just go up

The strange thing is that once price go up, there is usually a higher motive to drive more production, but if it goes up too fast, there is no motive of production, hoarding assets instead become the first choice

hatshepsut93

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How it has nothing to do with communism if Venezuela's government is heavily influenced by marxism which causes them to make all those irrational decisions that led to their downfall. If they weren't socialist, they would have adopted better policies. Of course capitalist governments can do stupid things too, but they rarely screw up so extremely that their currency enters a hyperinflation.

7788bitcoin

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Quote from: mindrust on August 22, 2021, 01:47:56 PM

~
Norway and Saudi Arabia also depend on the oil exports but they didn't collapse.
I think the situation of Venezuela has nothing to do with the oil prices.
The country is just corrupt.
Some people just cannot differ right from wrong and they cannot think for the long term.

Even i think that the situation in Venezuela happened because of corrupt officials and the leaders who comes up with bad economic policies will ruin any economy and i believe that the constant bad economic policies is the core reason why their economy went into hyperinflation.

Quote from: mindrust on August 22, 2021, 01:47:56 PM

Look at Afghanistan... The US gave them guns and training so they can fight Taliban, built their infrastructure, educated them, spend trillions of Dollars. In the end when the US left, all surrendered to Taliban. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

One of the strangest decisions i have seen, no idea what kind of policies Biden will come up. spend trillions in the war sacrificed life and then soldiers who lost their limbs and is handicap fighting the war and now leaving everything behind after 20 years and dragging them back to where they started Huh

.

mindrust

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Quote from: Tim-BTC on August 20, 2021, 03:15:16 AM

The main reasons for the general collapse of the Venezuelan economy are:

1. The collapse in oil prices and the government’s printing of money. And in the face of this economic crisis, brings us the biggest warning is that printing money can not solve any economic problems, will only make the crisis more serious;

Norway and Saudi Arabia also depend on the oil exports but they didn't collapse.

I think the situation of Venezuela has nothing to do with the oil prices.

The country is just corrupt.

Some people just cannot differ right from wrong and they cannot think for the long term.

----

Look at Afghanistan... The US gave them guns and training so they can fight Taliban, built their infrastructure, educated them, spend trillions of Dollars. In the end when the US left, all surrendered to Taliban. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

LUCKMCFLY

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Well, in reality communism is fully to blame for the catastrophe that Venezuela is now going through, is it a fallacy to say that this absurd policy did not end the country? OP is Venezuelan? the only way to speak like this is because he is obviously a supporter of the government, the elimination of small and medium industry, the total of the whole disaster began when unsustainable economic decisions were made and full of impulses.

It does not make any sense to say that the disaster did not come after being in a communist system, now the only solution that can be seen is for that whole system to be destroyed, or for them to adopt BTC for everything, so that hyperinflation ends, and that is what I say properly since every economic study points it out. The source was obviously made by an economist who has no idea about the situation in Venezuela nor did he experience it.

uneng

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I don't understand. You say the failure of Venezuela has nothing to do with communism, although you literally explain how communism works in practice from your second point (abnormal trade theory) on. If negotiations with foreigner nations were disturbed it was due to the ideology, if the government became heavily interventionist in economy it was also due to the ideology.
You just forgot mentioning the human rights violations, unrestrained corruptionl, power abuse and close connection with another communist countries. All these factors also lead foreigner countries and investors to stay away, harming the local economy even more.

teosanru

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Well, what I heard about the reason for the crisis in Venezuela was pretty simple, it was the oil pricing going rock bottom due to global supply increase as well as later due to onset of covid. In this situation, while the expenditure of government was pretty high, the incomes and foreign exchanges of the country shrank a lot leading to a terrible fiscal deficit for which the country had no option other than to print a lot of money and therefore leading to this hyperinflationary scenario. Very simple speaking there is no way that this fiscal deficit could be filled until there is an increase in oil prices once again, but even then there could still be issues with the Venezuelan currencies, I think it's just another Zimbabwe in making.

blckhawk

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Quote from: Assface16678 on August 21, 2021, 11:39:42 AM

It's a combination of socialism and corruption of their government and over reliance to oil that has caused this hyperinflation that they have been experiencing now and if the leaders of this country invested on infrastructures like hospitals, schools and other public infrastructure then we would've seen something different, they got too complacent that they didn't expect oil to go down in prices.

I think from what I've read, it's more of an oil thing and it's more on the side of the successor of the late president in which the corruption just got more bigger I think. I think what they failed to do is that they didn't have the right people in their cabinets to deal with different situations.

just_Alice

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You’re thinking too good of the Venezuelan government. The Dutch disease may be present (at least comparing the description you gave and some of their issues tells so), but it’s only half of the problems.

What about the insanely corrupt government? And outright economic ignorance. They have the biggest oil reserves in the world and the governments can’t even implement it on the global market, and create appropriate conditions for small business development. On top of that, they print money like crazy, which results in hyperinflation.

Coyster

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Quote from: ?? on ??

It is hard to stop such a downward spiral with a falling economy and rising inflation. Relying on one export good like oil is not enough to sustain a whole country. Another big factor in Venezuela is corruption, it prevents that necessary funds are actually used for investment into education and infrastructure within the country.

The current situation in Venezuela makes me think about my own country, which is one of the largest oil producing/exporting states and yet one very corrupt country in the world, concentrating solely on oil may be counterproductive, but it's not really too bad, what's worse is when the revenue being generated from it isn't put into good use, it then becomes a situation were the country is using up it's only valuable resource, but Instead of the proceeds to be used for the development of the country, it is going straight into the pockets of a few 'privileged' individuals.

It's a pretty difficult situation Venezuela finds themselves presently, and tbh, I do hope things in my own country do not get as bad as that, corruption is really the bane of many countries and their economies, if people in power can more often than not, put the needs of their people first, then many countries would prolly not be struggling economically today.

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