NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information - page 1017.

Come-from-Beyond

legendary

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Newbie

Quote from: caratheodory on February 07, 2014, 01:30:33 PM

Quote from: Come-from-Beyond on February 07, 2014, 01:13:27 PM

Quote from: caratheodory on February 07, 2014, 01:10:10 PM

Can someone explain how he found out the passphrase of the genesis account?

http://security.stackexchange.com/questions/22717/how-secure-are-passwords-made-of-whole-english-sentences

Right and if you read it, they argue the same as I do.

Sorry, I meant that 1 sentence from a book is equal to 1 word from English dictionary. Thus we have a password with only 1 (one) "symbol" and entropy equal to number of sentences. More popular sentences have a higher chance to be used, thus if u try all sentences in order according to their Google "citing" index u'll pick a passphrase quite quickly.

bitcoinpaul

hero member

Activity: 910

Merit: 1000

Quote from: CIYAM on February 07, 2014, 10:08:15 AM

Although the Nxt Asset Exchange will be a useful addition I think that we are missing something that could be much more useful (and perhaps a "killer" addition) and that is "atomic cross-chain crypto-currency transfers" (some of you would recall I've already mentioned it).

As far as I can tell no-one has actually built such a system and also so far I can't even tell if such a transfer using TierNolan's approach (https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Atomic_cross-chain_trading) has ever actually been tested (if anyone has a link that shows such a transaction having taken place then I'd be very interested to see it).

IMO this would really be a "game changer" as it could allow people to trade crypto's directly without an exchange and without risk (beyond having to wait for the "refund" problem that is necessary for TierNolan's solution in case the trade doesn't get finalised).

It wouldn't work fast enough to do "day trading" but for those not in a huge rush the promise of 100% secure transactions with only minimal blockchain fees would be pretty appealing.

What do you guys think?

Good idea, also for marketing. Don't know how this would work though Wink

Are smart people besides CIYAM thinking about it?

xyzzyx

sr. member

Activity: 490

Merit: 250

I don't really come from outer space.

Quote from: caratheodory on February 07, 2014, 01:30:33 PM

Quote from: Come-from-Beyond on February 07, 2014, 01:13:27 PM

Quote from: caratheodory on February 07, 2014, 01:10:10 PM

Can someone explain how he found out the passphrase of the genesis account?

http://security.stackexchange.com/questions/22717/how-secure-are-passwords-made-of-whole-english-sentences

Right and if you read it, they argue the same as I do. The only way to guess such a passphrase is if it's already in their database because a lot of people use it. That it was is, I think, surprising. There are a lot of sentences and quotes from books in the world, either the opening phrase from 1984 is very widely used (seems unlikely given how uneducated people are) or there's something more to this.

I'd like if EvilDoctor could comment on this, given that he cracked the passphrase in a day, it would be great. I'm interested in how crackers are building their passphrase dictionaries nowadays.

I don't know how he did it, but read this:

http://arstechnica.com/security/2013/10/how-the-bible-and-youtube-are-fueling-the-next-frontier-of-password-cracking/

bitcoinpaul

hero member

Activity: 910

Merit: 1000

Quote from: iruu on February 07, 2014, 10:07:14 AM

Quote from: Come-from-Beyond on February 07, 2014, 10:01:11 AM

S/he must be a Grandmaster of Cryptography.

That's an argument from authority. That's not how you prove things. Even if Schneider were to say "it looks ok" it doesn't matter much.
You prove code by formally verifying it and giving your proof. Someone could post it anonymously and it still would be valid.
There's always the possibility of bugs due to bugs in language implementation itself, or even hardware, but there's no way around that.

A reputable cryptographer analyses our code and you don't know, what that would mean for Nxt? Jesus...

opticalcarrier

full member

Activity: 238

Merit: 100

Please critique my security strategy:

1. ubuntu OS on 8GB RAM laptop

2. comment out swap entry in fstab

3. fstab has a tmpfs RAMdrive mounted on boot

4. use onetime to generate an encrypted file on the RAMdrv where key is same length as passphrase

5. move that encrypted file to disk for local storage, USB, cloud, family, friends, etc for safekeeping

6. bonus: make OTP key such that an easily-memorized misspell generates a different passphrase that belongs to other account that has history. PLAUSIBLE DENIABILITY

msin

legendary

Activity: 1470

Merit: 1004

Do we have a thread for those who deserve Dev Bounties from unclaimed Nxt? I recommend the following allocation for dev:

QBTC (nxtcrypto) - 100k
Passion_LTC (Nxtvote, Nxtion, etc) - 150k
l8oore (asset exchange) - 200k

We can add to these amounts in the future for ongoing projects.

Also, should I even bother with the crypto algo review? Sounds like Jesse James can help us with that. On that note I recommend a 250k bounty for Jesse James from unclaimed dev Nxt. If we still want a crypto review, I can use 10 BTC from my own wallet, but I need a very clear and concise response on what we specifically need from someone reviewing the algo.

caratheodory

newbie

Activity: 23

Merit: 0

Quote from: Come-from-Beyond on February 07, 2014, 01:13:27 PM

Quote from: caratheodory on February 07, 2014, 01:10:10 PM

Can someone explain how he found out the passphrase of the genesis account?

http://security.stackexchange.com/questions/22717/how-secure-are-passwords-made-of-whole-english-sentences

Right and if you read it, they argue the same as I do. The only way to guess such a passphrase is if it's already in their database because a lot of people use it. That it was is, I think, surprising. There are a lot of sentences and quotes from books in the world, either the opening phrase from 1984 is very widely used (seems unlikely given how uneducated people are) or there's something more to this.

I'd like if EvilDoctor could comment on this, given that he cracked the passphrase in a day, it would be great. I'm interested in how crackers are building their passphrase dictionaries nowadays.

FrictionlessCoin

legendary

Activity: 868

Merit: 1000

Cryptotalk.org - Get paid for every post!

Quote from: Anon136 on February 07, 2014, 01:23:14 PM

Quote from: Isildur23 on February 07, 2014, 12:25:26 PM

Guys, sorry for the super silly question. I read every post here but when i saw that FC was promoting NEM i ignored every post in which i see "NEM". Now i see that Utopianfuture is responsible for NEM and most of the active people here are in the staheholders' list of NEM (are they really? Anon? Come-from-beyond?). Will NEM have the same features like Nxt (especially transparent forging)? And the only difference will be the community and developers? I know I gotta be missing something and i sound silly but i have to ask. Thank you for the response!

its not like we endorse it or think its a good idea. its just that all we had to do to get on that list was type the word interested in a post on his thread. it was so easy to get on that list that there was no reason not to.

nem is just a clone headed up by a troll. i wouldn't bother with it too much. i would keep your eyes open for nxt forks that actually do something innovative though. probably the first successful distributed autonomous corporations will be built on nxt forks.

"A clone headed up by a troll", so what do you call the 40 BTC that the NEM folks already raised for development??!

Are they really going to come up with something?

FrictionlessCoin

legendary

Activity: 868

Merit: 1000

Cryptotalk.org - Get paid for every post!

Quote from: Isildur23 on February 07, 2014, 12:25:26 PM

Guys, sorry for the super silly question. I read every post here but when i saw that FC was promoting NEM i ignored every post in which i see "NEM". Now i see that Utopianfuture is responsible for NEM and most of the active people here are in the staheholders' list of NEM (are they really? Anon? Come-from-beyond?). Will NEM have the same features like Nxt (especially transparent forging)? And the only difference will be the community and developers? I know I gotta be missing something and i sound silly but i have to ask. Thank you for the response!

NEM is a clone of Nxt created by Nxt insiders. So rather than improving on Nxt, these folks have decided to fork a clone of Nxt.

NEX does not involve Nxt insiders.

So Nxt folks condone NEM efforts because they are all buddies with them.

Nxt folks however take great efforts to criticize NEX because NEX folks aren't Nxt insiders.

Emule

full member

Activity: 168

Merit: 100

Quote from: timmyd on February 07, 2014, 01:18:15 PM

Quote from: EvilDave on February 07, 2014, 01:13:49 PM

Quote from: Isildur23 on February 07, 2014, 12:25:26 PM

Guys, sorry for the super silly question. I read every post here but when i saw that FC was promoting NEM i ignored every post in which i see "NEM". Now i see that Utopianfuture is responsible for NEM and most of the active people here are in the staheholders' list of NEM (are they really? Anon? Come-from-beyond?). Will NEM have the same features like Nxt (especially transparent forging)? And the only difference will be the community and developers? I know I gotta be missing something and i sound silly but i have to ask. Thank you for the response!

FC promoting NEM ? I think u may be suffering from some confusion here.

OI, Frictionless, r u promoting NEM ?

Ans why do u and eMule seem to be joined at the hip ?

Ye they allways apear together

Ah come on don't put the blame on me they broke your software and its worthless now, blame bcnext

give up guys sell and go home.

Come-from-Beyond

legendary

Activity: 2142

Merit: 1010

Newbie

Looks like Nxt does repeat Bitcoin history. We should check https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Common_Vulnerabilities_and_Exposures to see what to expect in the future...

Anon136

legendary

Activity: 1722

Merit: 1217

Quote from: Isildur23 on February 07, 2014, 12:25:26 PM

Guys, sorry for the super silly question. I read every post here but when i saw that FC was promoting NEM i ignored every post in which i see "NEM". Now i see that Utopianfuture is responsible for NEM and most of the active people here are in the staheholders' list of NEM (are they really? Anon? Come-from-beyond?). Will NEM have the same features like Nxt (especially transparent forging)? And the only difference will be the community and developers? I know I gotta be missing something and i sound silly but i have to ask. Thank you for the response!

its not like we endorse it or think its a good idea. its just that all we had to do to get on that list was type the word interested in a post on his thread. it was so easy to get on that list that there was no reason not to.

nem is just a clone headed up by a troll. i wouldn't bother with it too much. i would keep your eyes open for nxt forks that actually do something innovative though. probably the first successful distributed autonomous corporations will be built on nxt forks.

Isildur23

full member

Activity: 178

Merit: 100

Quote from: EvilDave on February 07, 2014, 01:13:49 PM

Quote from: Isildur23 on February 07, 2014, 12:25:26 PM

Guys, sorry for the super silly question. I read every post here but when i saw that FC was promoting NEM i ignored every post in which i see "NEM". Now i see that Utopianfuture is responsible for NEM and most of the active people here are in the staheholders' list of NEM (are they really? Anon? Come-from-beyond?). Will NEM have the same features like Nxt (especially transparent forging)? And the only difference will be the community and developers? I know I gotta be missing something and i sound silly but i have to ask. Thank you for the response!

FC promoting NEM ? I think u may be suffering from some confusion here.

OI, Frictionless, r u promoting NEM ?

Ans why do u and eMule seem to be joined at the hip ?

Ok, maybe i missread something (i wasn't focusing on his posts). But will somebody still answer my questions (marked them in bold). Sorry again if they are too silly.

timmyd

hero member

Activity: 714

Merit: 500

Quote from: EvilDave on February 07, 2014, 01:13:49 PM

Quote from: Isildur23 on February 07, 2014, 12:25:26 PM

Guys, sorry for the super silly question. I read every post here but when i saw that FC was promoting NEM i ignored every post in which i see "NEM". Now i see that Utopianfuture is responsible for NEM and most of the active people here are in the staheholders' list of NEM (are they really? Anon? Come-from-beyond?). Will NEM have the same features like Nxt (especially transparent forging)? And the only difference will be the community and developers? I know I gotta be missing something and i sound silly but i have to ask. Thank you for the response!

FC promoting NEM ? I think u may be suffering from some confusion here.

OI, Frictionless, r u promoting NEM ?

Ans why do u and eMule seem to be joined at the hip ?

Ye they allways apear together

salsacz

hero member

Activity: 490

Merit: 504

car: probably because this famous phrase has got 506 000 pages on googlesearch

EvilDave

hero member

Activity: 854

Merit: 1001

Quote from: Isildur23 on February 07, 2014, 12:25:26 PM

Guys, sorry for the super silly question. I read every post here but when i saw that FC was promoting NEM i ignored every post in which i see "NEM". Now i see that Utopianfuture is responsible for NEM and most of the active people here are in the staheholders' list of NEM (are they really? Anon? Come-from-beyond?). Will NEM have the same features like Nxt (especially transparent forging)? And the only difference will be the community and developers? I know I gotta be missing something and i sound silly but i have to ask. Thank you for the response!

FC promoting NEM ? I think u may be suffering from some confusion here.

OI !, Frictionless, r u promoting NEM ?

And why do u and eMule seem to be joined at the hip ?

Come-from-Beyond

legendary

Activity: 2142

Merit: 1010

Newbie

Quote from: caratheodory on February 07, 2014, 01:10:10 PM

Can someone explain how he found out the passphrase of the genesis account?

http://security.stackexchange.com/questions/22717/how-secure-are-passwords-made-of-whole-english-sentences

caratheodory

newbie

Activity: 23

Merit: 0

Quote from: Come-from-Beyond on February 07, 2014, 10:59:26 AM

Critical bug disclosure

Few days ago the guy who found a vulnerability in Blockchain.Info and picked the secret phrase of Nxt genesis account found a security flaw in NRS cryptographic algorithm.

Can someone explain how he found out the passphrase of the genesis account?

"It was a bright cold day in April, and the clocks were striking thirteen."

It has 14 words and some punctuation. Ignoring the punctuation and using a simple 2000 words long dictionary (and this is tiny! There are 1013913 words in the English language) we get 2000^14 possible passphrases, or about 10^46 possibilities, if we go by characters from the alphabet, it has 26^72 ~ 10^101 possibilities. A password written in base 58 and 26 characters long is also about 10^46 possibilities. In comparison, a random 8 character long password takes 3 hours to crack on a desktop pc. 9 char -> 3days, 10 char -> 1 year, 11 char -> 48 years. 26 char -> An octillion years.

Now it is a given that the entropy of a random password is much higher than that of a phrase from a novel, but I still can't see how he could crack the passphrase unless the entire thing was already in his dictionary! Let's not forget he was using a python script which is notably slow!

EvilDave

hero member

Activity: 854

Merit: 1001

Quote from: xyzzyx on February 07, 2014, 11:42:39 AM

Quote from: Come-from-Beyond on February 07, 2014, 11:24:27 AM

Quote from: Anon136 on February 07, 2014, 11:18:04 AM

rofl. i completely missed that thread where i was mentioned like a dozen times

U should monetize ur reputation. If u were a fiat gateway operator for Asset Exchange, u would help the community a lot. I would accept dollars issued by u without any doubt. Think of such a business plz...

Anon136,

If you do consider fiat gateway, iDeal might be something to look into for accepting Euros.

http://www.ideal.nl/banken/?lang=eng-GB

I had asked in this thread earlier if anyone had any experience with it, and a member did PM me to tell me that he used it and that it was awesome. If you're interested, I can ask him to PM you, also, to get an idea of how it is used.

He gave me this link:

http://www.bitcoinvergelijker.nl/

But I don't speak Dutch so I only got a vague idea of what is said there.

That was me....what do you need to know about iDeal ?
It's way simple: direct money transfer (via a web interface), from your account to merchant account using your accounts internet banking access system. As easy as Bitcoin, but from the banksters....
AFAIK, it's only in NL at the moment, but your first link hints that they want to take it Europe-wide.
Most BTC merchants in NL use it (as well as all NL online shops/pizza delivery/etc) and u can go from "want Bitcoin" to having the BTC on your wallet in 10 minutes.

Gotta run, some other NL members can mybe explain more.
Try Google translate, btw, give u an idea of whats going on....and try the iDeal interface out, see how it works.

BaiMangal

member

Activity: 111

Merit: 10

Quote from: Anon136 on February 07, 2014, 12:41:53 PM

you know guys. we could cut out the dollar by tying our main token that we trade with to something extremely liquid but lacking other properties of money. the nxt token representation of the object will give it its strong money characteristics and the high liquidity of the item its tied to could give a stable and recognizable price.

so just as an offhand example, the basic pricing could be done by having the main medium of exchange be a token that represents 1 egg. say i am an egg farmer, i issue 1 million grade a egg colored tokens. the nxt/egg cross becomes the deepest and most liquid token in the market and so then nxt becomes priced in eggs. if you want to know what the value of a nxt is in dollars then you go to the supermarket and check out the price of eggs and just do the conversion. if you want eggs than you just trade 1 token for 1 egg to the egg farmer.

eggs probably bag example. ill try to think of something better.

Very good idea! I have a profitable forex bot and I am thinking of assets based on it. It be very easy to value them and nxt as well. It is making 3-4% monthly profit..

Topic: NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information - page 1017. (Read 2761644 times)