NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information - page 218.

CIYAM

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Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer

Quote from: ChuckOne on March 21, 2014, 01:33:52 PM

Nevertheless, it is trading not transferring. You cannot transfer 1 BTC to 10 NXT. That makes no sense (at least not for me.)

It isn't applying to "other block chains" but just Assets within the NXT block chain.

If you created an Asset called BTC and an Asset called NXT (just to confuse everyone) then actually *you could* trade 1 BTC for 10 NXT.

Grin

DrearyUrbanite

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Quote from: Anon136 on March 21, 2014, 01:09:14 PM

my daughter just came in here naked and when i asked her why she was nudie she says "want pink shirt not blue shirt"...

It happens. I helped raise 7 of them and the youngest is now 20.

CIYAM

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Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer

Quote from: ChuckOne on March 21, 2014, 01:31:20 PM

1) Valid, but account could forge on more than one node.

True that would help protect them from flooding.

Quote from: ChuckOne on March 21, 2014, 01:31:20 PM

2) Any idea why the pseudo-random function of BCNext is not fair? I mean, okay that is a little sample calculation. Pre-compute the next 1000000 generationSignatures and look if they behave as random as you need it. Anybody done this so far?

I don't know - this would need to be modeled and should probably be tested through testnet at least to get some idea of what we might expect for mainnet.

ChuckOne

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☕ NXT-4BTE-8Y4K-CDS2-6TB82

Quote from: CIYAM on March 21, 2014, 01:32:03 PM

Quote from: ChuckOne on March 21, 2014, 01:25:51 PM

I think cross-chain trading would be the most accurate.

You do not transfer or transact from one chain to another but trade together.

It all happens on "the one chain" though (the Nxt block chain) which is why I think "cross-chain" would be misleading for this.

Not sure. I am no native speaker.

Nevertheless, it is trading not transferring. You cannot transfer 1 BTC to 10 NXT. That makes no sense (at least not for me.)

Anon136

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: Anon136 on March 21, 2014, 01:14:08 PM

Quote from: Come-from-Beyond on March 21, 2014, 01:12:19 PM

Quote from: Anon136 on March 21, 2014, 01:09:14 PM

my daughter just came in here naked and when i asked her why she was nudie she says "want pink shirt not blue shirt"...

I expected to hear something like "gimme NXT to buy shirt"...

she has 1000 nxt in her money box. she doesnt know what it is. i put it on a bitcoin paper wallet and she just calls it q-car-code (her way of saying qrcode). but she knows its valuable, she keeps it safe and doesnt play with it. she gets that its money or something proximate.

shes ahead of the curve then when it comes to (im guessing) 3 year olds lol

2.5

CIYAM

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Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer

Quote from: ChuckOne on March 21, 2014, 01:25:51 PM

I think cross-chain trading would be the most accurate.

You do not transfer or transact from one chain to another but trade together.

It all happens on "the one chain" though (the Nxt block chain) which is why I think "cross-chain" would be misleading for this.

ChuckOne

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☕ NXT-4BTE-8Y4K-CDS2-6TB82

Quote from: CIYAM on March 21, 2014, 12:42:11 PM

Quote from: ChuckOne on March 21, 2014, 12:38:34 PM

So, it comes down to: do we need an x > 1 and what for do we need that?

Yup - that's it in a nutshell - the two reasons we might need that are:

1. To help prevent "flood attacks" (by making the flooder have to attack more than one IP address)

2. To help improve "randomness" so things like the "lottery" (and other similar things) are viewed as "statistically fair".

1) Valid, but account could forge on more than one node.

2) Any idea why the pseudo-random function of BCNext is not fair? I mean, okay that is a little sample calculation. Pre-compute the next 1000000 generationSignatures and look if they behave as random as you need it. Anybody done this so far?

ChuckOne

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Quote from: Daedelus on March 21, 2014, 01:22:51 PM

Quote from: CIYAM on March 21, 2014, 01:10:52 PM

Quote from: Daedelus on March 21, 2014, 01:08:17 PM

The problem I see is people use Atomic CCT so it would need some kind of entry....

Sure - so the main point being that what I was talking about allows you to trade "one Asset for another" (in the Nxt system) and to do that "atomically" (through an AT).

Maybe "Atomic Asset Transfer" works better?

I will draft something and post for scrutiny

I think cross-chain trading would be the most accurate.

You do not transfer or transact from one chain to another but trade together.

Daedelus

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Quote from: CIYAM on March 21, 2014, 01:10:52 PM

Quote from: Daedelus on March 21, 2014, 01:08:17 PM

The problem I see is people use Atomic CCT so it would need some kind of entry....

Sure - so the main point being that what I was talking about allows you to trade "one Asset for another" (in the Nxt system) and to do that "atomically" (through an AT).

Maybe "Atomic Asset Transfer" works better?

I will draft something and post for scrutiny

Come-from-Beyond

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Newbie

Quote from: Anon136 on March 21, 2014, 01:14:08 PM

she has 1000 nxt in her money box. she doesnt know what it is. i put it on a bitcoin paper wallet and she just calls it q-car-code (her way of saying qrcode). but she knows its valuable, she keeps it safe and doesnt play with it. she gets that its money or something proximate.

IIRC she took part in most of ur interviews with Tai Zen, so she knows more than u think.

CIYAM

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Activity: 1890

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Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer

Quote from: Anon136 on March 21, 2014, 01:12:41 PM

if you have really figured this out CIYAM than my hats off to you. im not even going to ask how it works because i already know that i wont be able to understand. that is several tiers of amazing above my head.

We have "only begun to scratch the surface" of what will be possible with AT - it is really what will make Nxt a "platform".

paradigmflux

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small fry

Hey guys, http://hashrate.org has had a bit of a facelift.
Yesterday we paid out 0.008 BTC/MH/day equivilent in NXT - why mine anywhere else?

Anon136

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Quote from: Come-from-Beyond on March 21, 2014, 01:12:19 PM

Quote from: Anon136 on March 21, 2014, 01:09:14 PM

my daughter just came in here naked and when i asked her why she was nudie she says "want pink shirt not blue shirt"...

I expected to hear something like "gimme NXT to buy shirt"...

she has 1000 nxt in her money box. she doesnt know what it is. i put it on a bitcoin paper wallet and she just calls it q-car-code (her way of saying qrcode). but she knows its valuable, she keeps it safe and doesnt play with it. she gets that its money or something proximate.

Anon136

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Activity: 1722

Merit: 1217

Quote from: CIYAM on March 21, 2014, 01:10:52 PM

Quote from: Daedelus on March 21, 2014, 01:08:17 PM

The problem I see is people use Atomic CCT so it would need some kind of entry....

Sure - so the main point being that what I was talking about allows you to trade "one Asset for another" (in the Nxt system) and to do that "atomically" (through an AT).

Maybe "Atomic Asset Transfer" works better?

if you have really figured this out CIYAM than my hats off to you. im not even going to ask how it works because i already know that i wont be able to understand. that is several tiers of amazing above my head.

Come-from-Beyond

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Newbie

Quote from: Anon136 on March 21, 2014, 01:09:14 PM

my daughter just came in here naked and when i asked her why she was nudie she says "want pink shirt not blue shirt"...

I expected to hear something like "gimme NXT to buy shirt"...

CIYAM

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Activity: 1890

Merit: 1086

Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer

Quote from: Daedelus on March 21, 2014, 01:08:17 PM

The problem I see is people use Atomic CCT so it would need some kind of entry....

Sure - so the main point being that what I was talking about allows you to trade "one Asset for another" (in the Nxt system) and to do that "atomically" (through an AT).

Maybe "Atomic Asset Transfer" works better?

Anon136

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Activity: 1722

Merit: 1217

my daughter just came in here naked and when i asked her why she was nudie she says "want pink shirt not blue shirt"...

Daedelus

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Quote from: CIYAM on March 21, 2014, 01:02:12 PM

Quote from: Daedelus on March 21, 2014, 12:58:57 PM

CIYAM, you used the phrase "atomic cross chain transfers" earlier. Is that different to "atomic cross chain transactions"?

Hmm... maybe I screwed up - I was taking about the idea of being able to exchange "Assets" through an AT (vs. say moving currency between "parallel chains").

So forget the term "atomic cross chain transfers" (would just confuse).

Perhaps "atomic asset transfers" might be better?

The problem I see is people use Atomic CCT so it would need some kind of entry....

EDIT: Don't worry, not important right now, I'll sort something Grin

Anon136

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Quote from: Come-from-Beyond on March 21, 2014, 12:54:56 PM

Quote from: Anon136 on March 21, 2014, 12:52:12 PM

we could just do 1 pow block every 24 hours and extend the active stake holding time out from 1 day to 3-7 days. (which it always should have been imo anyway). 1 pow block per day isnt that bad is it? and it would give us soooo much extra security.

Doesn't this ruin "transparency" of forging for blocks that r close to a moment when a PoW block to be generated?

not necessarily. first you decide how many blocks into the future it is ideal for people to be able to predict. lets say 10 as an offhand example. once someone submits a valid pow block you could record it then but not have it effect the process of deduction until 10 blocks after its submission. so for example say it was submitted as block 100,000. you could make it so that that hashing this block isnt part of the generation sigature perramiter until block 100,010.

its actually a really really solid solution the only drawback is that everyone will say "na na na boo boo we told you so" Tongue

*edit* also i need to give credit to my uncle, it may actually be his idea, we arnt sure who thought of it first.

CIYAM

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Activity: 1890

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Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer

Quote from: Daedelus on March 21, 2014, 12:58:57 PM

CIYAM, you used the phrase "atomic cross chain transfers" earlier. Is that different to "atomic cross chain transactions"?

Hmm... maybe I screwed up - I was taking about the idea of being able to exchange "Assets" through an AT (vs. say moving currency between "parallel chains").

So forget the term "atomic cross chain transfers" (would just confuse).

Perhaps "atomic asset transfers" might be better?

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