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Topic: ONE Minute Blocks! Bitcoin as fast as Dogecoin, faster than Litecoin? VOTE (Read 4346 times)

legendary
Activity: 3668
Merit: 6382
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That wouldn't work because of network propogation time.  The block time
must be greatly larger than the time it would take to get blocks broadcast
across the network or you risk losing consensus (too many different chains going on
by different miners solving blocks).

If this is indeed correct, then this is the smartest answer I've seen from the "conservative" part.


I said that in response to the suggestion that someone posted about one-second blocks.
This wouldn't be a factor for one minute blocks but I still don't think those are a good
idea because I don't see the benefit relative to the risk of changing the protocol.

The one second block "proposal" was an over-sarcastic answer to my post telling that quicker blocks may be good in the future.
Even if it's not an issue now, we still expect the network to grow, so maybe 1 minute is indeed to small. Better have a big margin there.

The benefit vs the risks on changing the protocol is indeed small now. But I think that the proposal to discuss this is good.
Because from such discussions, especially if they are constructive, we can gather a couple of good changes which, together, may make sense done all together (the benefit bigger than the risks).
And mho is that at some point Bitcoin will need a big change (fork).

Currently the "conservative" members are very strong - some with good arguments (which I respect), some not - and give the impression that Bitcoin is afraid of changes. Which is also not good. Because somebody that wants to invest for long time in Bitcoin would like to see that, with good reasons, Bitcoin will do all it takes, even a fork, to stay the best crypto coin.
Right now that doesn't seem to happen. At least that's my feeling.

Of course, it doesn't count much, because I am just a tiny bitcoiner, but how about the bigger ones? How about the ones to come? Selling needs good product and good strategy too.
legendary
Activity: 1302
Merit: 1004
Core dev leaves me neg feedback #abuse #political
That wouldn't work because of network propogation time.  The block time
must be greatly larger than the time it would take to get blocks broadcast
across the network or you risk losing consensus (too many different chains going on
by different miners solving blocks).

If this is indeed correct, then this is the smartest answer I've seen from the "conservative" part.


I said that in response to the suggestion that someone posted about one-second blocks.
This wouldn't be a factor for one minute blocks but I still don't think those are a good
idea because I don't see the benefit relative to the risk of changing the protocol.
legendary
Activity: 2674
Merit: 2965
Terminated.
Oh I thought bitcoin has to be at least over 100$ for miners to be profitable and if mining stops then the network shuts down.
This doesn't even make sense. Have you ever looked at previous charts? The price was well under $100, and there is no reason that it can't go that path again,
If a portion of miners leave once we reach ($100 per Bitcoin), the difficulty will drop and the profitability will be there again.
legendary
Activity: 3668
Merit: 6382
Looking for campaign manager? Contact icopress!
That wouldn't work because of network propogation time.  The block time
must be greatly larger than the time it would take to get blocks broadcast
across the network or you risk losing consensus (too many different chains going on
by different miners solving blocks).

If this is indeed correct, then this is the smartest answer I've seen from the "conservative" part.
legendary
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1003
Small Question, yeah and it will sound infinitely stupid?

- Can we implement Kimoto's Gravity Well (A Patched Up Secure Version, Of Course)
- Can BitCoin Implement Proof Of Stake Mining

Also, One Minute Blocks are Just Insane! (Not in a good way)
Isn't kimoto's gravity well only important for coins that have massive swings in mining power, i.e. not Bitcoin?  I guess it wouldn't hurt, but it's also not vital in my opinion.

10 minute blocks aren't a big problem if everyone decides to accept 1 or 2 confirmation transactions, but I agree that waiting an hour can be quite annoying.  1 minute blocks don't seem to have any big downsides to me, I'd be for it.
sr. member
Activity: 462
Merit: 250
What a bad idea, 10 minute is for safe.
We are now start to talk about increase the size of block size, if we make the block time to 1 minute, the size of the whole blockchain will be too large.
legendary
Activity: 4298
Merit: 3209
Oh I thought bitcoin has to be at least over 100$ for miners to be profitable and if mining stops then the network shuts down.

There is no minimum profitable price. Mining can be profitable at any price because miners drop out as the price falls. As miners drop out, the difficulty goes down, making it more profitable for the miners that stay.
sr. member
Activity: 331
Merit: 250
My thought exactly. LaudaM probably thinks something similar.

To add an argument to the sarcasm: A rise in price does not help adopting bitcoin as a currency. A stable price will help adoption. People that are just seeing bitcoin as a get rich quick scheme will cash out eventually causing another crash or at least a rollercoaster price. No merchant wants an unpredictable price.
Exactly. People just want to price to stop declining and start rising sharply again because of profits. Anyone who thinks in this way has a wrong image in their head and is just another random greedy person.
Bitcoin works as long as the price stays above 0$. Also, there will be no altcoin to takeover Bitcoin (unless something really bad happens). That is just not as likely as people think.
Anyone preaching otherwise should stay away from the Bitcoin Discussion section.

Your assumptions are as false as you consider mine Smiley
-snip-
Saying something doesn't make it true. False cause is the case here.


Update: Here's another 'no' for playing the good guy card.

Oh I thought bitcoin has to be at least over 100$ for miners to be profitable and if mining stops then the network shuts down.
legendary
Activity: 812
Merit: 1000
It is good as it is.There is no change needed at the moment.The current block time is acceptable and sometime appears little bit delays.Generally I am quite satisfied by the confirmation time.That can be risky to make it quicker.

Shouldn't really matter that much should it? seems like since bitcoin is still in beta without tons of payment services and structures built on top of it the confirm times are more noticeable.
legendary
Activity: 1358
Merit: 1014
We are on the cutting edge of technology. The idea that the most advanced transfer of value system invented by human beings should have to wait 10 minutes is ludicrous. Most people railing against this are afraid of change which is ironic because they are talking about the revolutionary bitcoin.

The transfer of value does not take 10 minutes.


Should we just post this every 5 posts on every confirmation thread on the board?

Bitcoin transactions take seconds. Bitcoin confirmations take 10 minutes.
Credit card transactions take seconds. Credit card confirmations take 180 days.

Confirmations != transactions
Yeah, like I said before, no one is out there complaining about how credit card transactions aren't instantaneous.
Someone should do a youtube video to explain why this is not a problem to educate the masses.
legendary
Activity: 1302
Merit: 1004
Core dev leaves me neg feedback #abuse #political
Why one minute? Let's go for it and make it one second. A typical miner can do 1 trillion hashes per second. That's plenty for a single block.

That wouldn't work because of network propogation time.  The block time
must be greatly larger than the time it would take to get blocks broadcast
across the network or you risk losing consensus (too many different chains going on
by different miners solving blocks).

hero member
Activity: 658
Merit: 500
I just lost track of whose points are being proved and for what purpose.
legendary
Activity: 3668
Merit: 6382
Looking for campaign manager? Contact icopress!
...

The last thread I've read about the 20Mb fork ended up with fascism and so on.
Here my points are just not read / understood (maybe I wrote strange, I don't know), but I better leave this, because else this thread will have bad end too and it's a shame.
Because, you know, it was a call for discussion and, I hope, for useful ideas, just in case somebody wants to read them.
legendary
Activity: 1512
Merit: 1009
Pretty curious to see a dev supporting such a deep change in the code... I don't really see the pros at being big enough for this change.
legendary
Activity: 2674
Merit: 2965
Terminated.
My thought exactly. LaudaM probably thinks something similar.

To add an argument to the sarcasm: A rise in price does not help adopting bitcoin as a currency. A stable price will help adoption. People that are just seeing bitcoin as a get rich quick scheme will cash out eventually causing another crash or at least a rollercoaster price. No merchant wants an unpredictable price.
Exactly. People just want to price to stop declining and start rising sharply again because of profits. Anyone who thinks in this way has a wrong image in their head and is just another random greedy person.
Bitcoin works as long as the price stays above 0$. Also, there will be no altcoin to takeover Bitcoin (unless something really bad happens). That is just not as likely as people think.
Anyone preaching otherwise should stay away from the Bitcoin Discussion section.

Your assumptions are as false as you consider mine Smiley
-snip-
Saying something doesn't make it true. False cause is the case here.


Update: Here's another 'no' for playing the good guy card.
legendary
Activity: 3668
Merit: 6382
Looking for campaign manager? Contact icopress!
It feels incredibly wrong to just leave things are they are without evaluating possible improving changes.

Yes, you are right.
As you can see, you can have any ideas you want, but no changes in bitcoin are allowed.

funny, you proved my point

I am surprised, however, I am glad that you are actually happy.

(I am sad about what I learnt today, again, about bitcoiners, but that's another story.)

My thought exactly. LaudaM probably thinks something similar.

To add an argument to the sarcasm: A rise in price does not help adopting bitcoin as a currency. A stable price will help adoption. People that are just seeing bitcoin as a get rich quick scheme will cash out eventually causing another crash or at least a rollercoaster price. No merchant wants an unpredictable price.

I said that price decline scares off people. If price is stable, merchants are fine. If the price is on a rising trend, I am almost sure that they will not mind.
For start a merchant may just sell the bitcoin asap for fiat. (Main reason: suppliers, employees, taxes are all paid in fiat.) If during the delay they get a few bucks for free, do you think that'll make them unhappy?
Keeping the coins would happen only as investment; using them as a currency, .. too big words yet. But all starts with step 1.

i voted for 5 minute blocks as it doesnt seem to be too risky and the transactions would be 2 times faster, i think it would attract more people to bitcoin though its just my opinion

It looks like I'm not the only heretic in here  Grin
sr. member
Activity: 364
Merit: 250
i voted for 5 minute blocks as it doesnt seem to be too risky and the transactions would be 2 times faster, i think it would attract more people to bitcoin though its just my opinion
copper member
Activity: 1498
Merit: 1499
No I dont escrow anymore.
We should have nanosecond confirmations.

I want my block confirmed before the transaction. That can only be done if we move to nanoseconds.

Whoever suggests anything else just doesn't want Bitcoin to evolve. That's probably why Satoshi left.

You just proved my point, thank you very much.
For how long is the discussion about the 20MB fork?  Cheesy

funny, you proved my point

My thought exactly. LaudaM probably thinks something similar.

To add an argument to the sarcasm: A rise in price does not help adopting bitcoin as a currency. A stable price will help adoption. People that are just seeing bitcoin as a get rich quick scheme will cash out eventually causing another crash or at least a rollercoaster price. No merchant wants an unpredictable price.
legendary
Activity: 3598
Merit: 2386
Viva Ut Vivas
We should have nanosecond confirmations.

I want my block confirmed before the transaction. That can only be done if we move to nanoseconds.

Whoever suggests anything else just doesn't want Bitcoin to evolve. That's probably why Satoshi left.

You just proved my point, thank you very much.
For how long is the discussion about the 20MB fork?  Cheesy

funny, you proved my point
legendary
Activity: 1078
Merit: 1024
Reducing block reward to 2.5 (25/10) and reducing time to 1 min could be an idea. That would equal to block size 10 mb (1 mb *10).

Still.... you might as well start a new shitcoin, all of this is not Bitcoin.

Bitcoin has value because its stable and people trust it. Start changing things to the people's taste of the day and it will lose all its value.

It feels incredibly wrong to just leave things are they are without evaluating possible improving changes.
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