Topic: Open source Bitcoin ATM? (Read 2041 times)

I think what's needed is presence in shopping malls especically where food is served. I say this for several reasons.

Shopping malls are private entities open to having additional financial contribution, especially when it benefits their resellers.

They are located next to resellers that would love not to pay interchange fees or wait to be reimbursed at end of day, or several days.

Food items and small ticket items annoy resellers the most when people want to pay by card or mobile wallets that charge interchange and other associated fees, especially when most customers pay cash as all payment processors rope resellers into minimum monthly contributions.

Security is present 24 hours a day. No vandalism. It's a secure area to complete your purchase as well.

Obviously you are on the doorstep of mass uptake via shops located on site.

Getting the stores on board is the hardest and most significant step, ESP for price stability.

Very interesting idea. No, integrating bitcoin into it would not be tricky. In fact, it would be perfectly doable. I would take the way it currently works is that the ATM dispenses fiat bills after checking the balance of the account holder with their bank. Sometimes there's not even such a check, and the ATM dispenses money and could leave the account holders account with a negative balance, once it's synched with the bank.

As for a bitcoin ATM, an existing type of ATM could be used, but instead of talking with the bank, the system could be talking with a 'bitcoin clearing house'. This could for instance be some kind of open software system incorporating bitcoind, run by the entity administrating the open source bitcoin ATM. It need not be some big corporate 'bitcoin clearing house', but just a system run by the operator of said ATM. Using such a system, the operator could even have more ATM's, all connected to his 'bitcoin clearing house'. And there would be no direct connection with any banking entity in this system, so the ATM's could not be frozen by some arbitrary action by some overzealous official or bank employee or by some false alert issues by a monitoring program.

The issues such an operator would face:

1. Local compliance in regards to rules and regulations.
2. Theft/destruction of an ATM, following loss of money and repair/replacement costs.

Obviously, not complying with 1. makes the operator liable to confiscation of any equipment and possible fines/force from local authorities.

The risk associated with point 2. could be reduced by placing the machine in a well trafficked area (like a 7-11 store), and empty it when the shop is closed for the night.

It's a wonderful idea, and I think an ATM that could both receive and dispense money would be the best. Then the operator would either have to remove cash on a regular basis, or add cash - depending on which direction there's most pressure.

Now, the easiest starting point for creating something like this would be to have an existing ATM and associated software in source code from. Then we would already have the pieces that's talking to the ATM and doing all the functions required, so the only thing would be to create the connection where the ATM talks to the 'bitcoin clearing house' software. And perhaps it would also be required to create a network connection of sorts from the ATM, perhaps through existing local wireless network, or by incorporating a mobile network.

I would absolutely love to be a part of a project like this, and I would be able to do/participate in the software/programming part of it. It's a pitty though, that fiat bills are different in nearly all parts of the world, so perhaps there should be some kind of system in such an ATM that could 'easily' be adjusted for the local currency. I don't have any experience as to how things are done mechanically in such a system, but I'm sure there's some people that would be able to give some input to it.

But the idea is brilliant Salty, and then people wouldn't need to meet in hotel lobbies to conduct their trade!

I think it's a good idea to create a Bitcoin vending machine that dispenses Bitcoins for cash. I think it's a bad idea to create a currency exchange device that converts Bitcoin to local currencies. The former would encourage people to acquire Bitcoins to spend. The latter may be seen as a way to launder money from overseas.

well, how do you think they intend to overcome the possibility of double spending?
would you have to wait for a confirmation before you receive your cash?

I don't know, the press launch for the bitcoinATM is tomorrow, their website is not very detailed. Maybe I am talking about reinventing their wheel who knows...

is this the one you are talking about being connected to the banking network or whatever? Because if it is, it seems like cyprus is the last place you want to put it, unless it's some kind of conspiratorial trick...
http://motherboard.vice.com/blog/the-worlds-first-bitcoin-atm-to-dispense-cyprus-bills

Thinking about the problem of fluctuating exchange rates, what if the machines themselves were an exchange system? You put money in, put in your bid, and wait for another machine or user to want to sell at your bid price....

The machine operator does, loads it up with however much btc and £10 notes, gets a text off the android machine to say its running low on tenners or it needs emptying...

that would be brilliant

Err, and who operates the ATM and how? Somebody has to deliver the BTC for fiat.

Lulz

This could work..... if the ATM was this shape:

Sorry to rain on your parade, but dwarfs are notoriously expensive to utilise in this fashion;

http://www.cheeky-events.co.uk/dwarf-and-midget-hire.html

*Sigh* Back to the drawing board...

Yes this is the difficult thing I deliberately avoided getting into at this point, how to call the price of btc and not end up 'subsidising' its operation due to market fluctuations. I think a buffered daily or weekly rate might work, it requires proper thought.  


It would be up to the individual operator/builder in each case, for example in my country you'd have to apply for a 'fit and proper test', and then apply for the Money Services License.

Exactly why this could be a game changer, however I feel you'd need some presence in '1st world' countries so people can send money to their families. This would speed up adoption.

again, the difficult question, and where this idea may lose its viability, market fluctuation.

Thanks for your thoughts.

All you need is an android app, a wad of cash, and a booth with a dwarf in it wearing headphones so you can tell him how much to give. Bam. Done

No you missed a point which is quite important. It would not interface with the banking system in any way, ONLY btc-cash.

Yes, I know but not interfacing with banks would make the task much simpler? you can buy a cash counter/stacker for £125 http://www.intelligentvending.co.uk/payment-systems-telemetry/banknote-readers-note-stackers/gba-st2.htm, a MDB - USB interface for similar or less, and an android phone for similar. Add in another £200 for a nice steel box, and the whole thing costs < £500. The software is the hard part to me not being a programmer.

Interesting thoughts. However the exchange market converts BTC <> $ ¥ € . If you have an ATM system then you have an operator essentially acting as a gateway to the FX market. So the ATM operator would hedge his positions in the most liquid market. That's what banks usually do. I've read that even smaller companies pay up to 0.50-1.00% for FX transactions. And so we are back to the exchange problem, because a "BTC bank" would have to use the exchange for hedging.

There are different kinds of functions of banks, exchanges, market markers which possibly can be completely re-invented, re-designed. But one of the most crucial aspects are commonly overlooked on this board, and that is the aspects of law. If you the Bitcoin entities have the same kinds of regulations as the standard entities and the interaces are controlled by the existing banks, exchanges, it doesn't much of a difference, at least where that infrastructure exists. It does not make much sense to convert $ into BTC and then into ¥, because you are only going to pay much higher fees most of the time.

The real power in the short term is in places where infrastructure does not exist. Say for poor countries where there are not even proper banks and ATMs. Imagine being able to roll out a banking infrastructure around BTC. You would basically save 99% of the costs.

Or transactions which otherwise not possible. In other cases counterparty risks are just so much greater. Say if MtGox would be shutdown the price would probably drop by 70% in a matter of days, and the market would dry up. So in this sense BTC is not safe at all.

The machine itself not exist already, it's a standard ATM.
it's the a function of integrating bitcoin into it that's a little tricky.

Well, what are you waiting for guys?

Do you have any skills in electronics and/or programming? 

Even if I whole-heartily support the idea, this is far from being a trivial task...