PaperCoins - page 2. | Bitcointalksearch.org

jago25_98

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Crypto Geek

Quote from: paraipan on January 29, 2012, 06:28:07 PM

I use https://www.bitaddress.org to print me some bills. Then i cut them and fund with whatever small amounts i need. I write the value they carry by hand after funding with an android phone. The page script is clients side so the priv keys are in your possession at all times so you can even save the page as html and it will work. I'm not affiliated in any way just using the service.

I'd love to see this automated in the official frontend client - select amount, hit print.

I don't like the temptation of reusing bills. Reusing instead of tearing up and making a new one really defeats much of the point of Bitcoin doesn't it. Same for holograms really; I prefer those for promotion.

cbeast

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Let's talk governance, lipstick, and pigs.

Casascius has a POS system https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Casascius_Bitcoin_POS_system that should be compatible with paper coins/bills/wallets. If it has a sweep function then it should be functional for any coffee shop, convenience store, or walmart system. Everything is coming together on all fronts. We should be approaching critical mass soon. Let's just hope it doesn't blow up in our face.

Red Emerald

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I just started saving some of my BTC on a sheet printed out from bitaddress.org.

I was originally planning on just filling all of the addresses with the same amount, but I like the idea of having varying amounts instead.

I don't know if I would use them for trade. I think using them as storage would be more useful to me.

jtimon

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Quote from: bitfreak! on January 30, 2012, 07:12:57 AM

I've thought a lot about this. Home made bills with a QR code is obviously the best way to do it, the holograms are just over the top and completely unnecessary imo. They're only good as a collectable item and exchange between friends, not for real world trade.

I remember a thread not long ago where some one had submitted some nice paper bill designs, can't be bothered looking for it though. It would be very easy to print your own bitcoin bills, so I think this is the best way to do it.

The purpose of bitbills is to be transferable, thus they must hide the private key in a way.
But I like more the idea of printing your own bills only for one use.

ovidiusoft

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Quote from: cbeast on January 30, 2012, 08:26:30 AM

It would be a good idea to have a way to secure the priv key or a secure container for the paper coins themselves. Prying eyes could get them in advance. It's feasible to make a physical wallet booklet that takes a common sheet of paper and folds/perfs it into it into checks quickly.

Indeed. It should be fairly easy to change my design so that you fold the QR code, leaving only the amount visible.

cbeast

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Let's talk governance, lipstick, and pigs.

Quote from: bitfreak! on January 30, 2012, 07:12:57 AM

I've thought a lot about this. Home made bills with a QR code is obviously the best way to do it, the holograms are just over the top and completely unnecessary imo. They're only good as a collectable item and exchange between friends, not for real world trade.

I remember a thread not long ago where some one had submitted some nice paper bill designs, can't be bothered looking for it though. It would be very easy to print your own bitcoin bills, so I think this is the best way to do it.

It would be a good idea to have a way to secure the priv key or a secure container for the paper coins themselves. Prying eyes could get them in advance. It's feasible to make a physical wallet booklet that takes a common sheet of paper and folds/perfs it into it into checks quickly.

bitfreak!

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electronic [r]evolution

I've thought a lot about this. Home made bills with a QR code is obviously the best way to do it, the holograms are just over the top and completely unnecessary imo. They're only good as a collectable item and exchange between friends, not for real world trade.

I remember a thread not long ago where some one had submitted some nice paper bill designs, can't be bothered looking for it though. It would be very easy to print your own bitcoin bills, so I think this is the best way to do it.

jtimon

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I remember a couple of old threads about this same thing.

Revalin

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165YUuQUWhBz3d27iXKxRiazQnjEtJNG9g

That's perfect. You can embed the payment key and the change address into a single QR code.

"3.95 BTC please." Hand them a 5 BTC note. They scan it. 10 seconds later your phone chirps to let you know the 1.05 BTC change was just sent with no obvious double-spends.

That's faster and easier than waiting for them to count out fiat change.

cbeast

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Let's talk governance, lipstick, and pigs.

Quote from: casascius on January 29, 2012, 10:38:28 PM

Quote from: paraipan on January 29, 2012, 07:29:54 PM

or just have a keyring or card with a qr where the merchant could return the change

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/the-perfect-tool-for-bitcoin-newbies-get-them-a-deposit-card-57303

Or to any other bill the customer holds.

Ok, so you could put the next public address in a series on the bill given for purchase.

casascius

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The Casascius 1oz 10BTC Silver Round (w/ Gold B)

Quote from: paraipan on January 29, 2012, 07:29:54 PM

or just have a keyring or card with a qr where the merchant could return the change

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/the-perfect-tool-for-bitcoin-newbies-get-them-a-deposit-card-57303

Or to any other bill the customer holds.

ovidiusoft

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Activity: 252

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Quote from: cbeast on January 29, 2012, 07:33:45 PM

I'm not sure I understand the difference between sweeping and importing a private key.

Sweeping is importing a private key and immediately transfering all funds to another address. It's good practice when someone else knows that private key.

paraipan

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Quote from: cbeast on January 29, 2012, 07:33:45 PM

Quote from: paraipan on January 29, 2012, 07:29:54 PM

Quote from: cbeast on January 29, 2012, 07:24:54 PM

A paper bill is fine, but has one small problem. Unless you know exactly how much your purchase will be, there will be a balance left over on your paper bill. You can't just throw it away after an amount is swept off. You will need to move the balance to a secure address somehow. It would be great to have an automated way to make your bill expire after a predetermined set period of time and the balance is then moved to the next address in a series.

or just have a keyring or card with a qr where the merchant could return the change

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/the-perfect-tool-for-bitcoin-newbies-get-them-a-deposit-card-57303

I'm not sure I understand the difference between sweeping and importing a private key.

sweep = import + send amount to really private and secure key

cbeast

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Let's talk governance, lipstick, and pigs.

Quote from: paraipan on January 29, 2012, 07:29:54 PM

Quote from: cbeast on January 29, 2012, 07:24:54 PM

A paper bill is fine, but has one small problem. Unless you know exactly how much your purchase will be, there will be a balance left over on your paper bill. You can't just throw it away after an amount is swept off. You will need to move the balance to a secure address somehow. It would be great to have an automated way to make your bill expire after a predetermined set period of time and the balance is then moved to the next address in a series.

or just have a keyring or card with a qr where the merchant could return the change

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/the-perfect-tool-for-bitcoin-newbies-get-them-a-deposit-card-57303

I'm not sure I understand the difference between sweeping and importing a private key.

ovidiusoft

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Activity: 252

Merit: 250

Quote from: cbeast on January 29, 2012, 07:24:54 PM

A paper bill is fine, but has one small problem. Unless you know exactly how much your purchase will be, there will be a balance left over on your paper bill. You can't just throw it away after an amount is swept off. You will need to move the balance to a secure address somehow. It would be great to have an automated way to make your bill expire after a predetermined set period of time and the balance is then moved to the next address in a series.

My initial thought was that the remainder will be sent by the seller to another address you provide (I even thought we might include it in the QR code), basically emulating how you pay with cash right now. I also assumed the buyer trusts the seller.

But your idea of expiration is much better, if it's doable. At a minimum, one could run another sweep after returning from the store ("gather all remainders from my used PaperCoins"), but doing it automatically would be cool.

paraipan

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Quote from: cbeast on January 29, 2012, 07:24:54 PM

A paper bill is fine, but has one small problem. Unless you know exactly how much your purchase will be, there will be a balance left over on your paper bill. You can't just throw it away after an amount is swept off. You will need to move the balance to a secure address somehow. It would be great to have an automated way to make your bill expire after a predetermined set period of time and the balance is then moved to the next address in a series.

or just have a keyring or card with a qr where the merchant could return the change

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/the-perfect-tool-for-bitcoin-newbies-get-them-a-deposit-card-57303

cbeast

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Activity: 1736

Merit: 1014

Let's talk governance, lipstick, and pigs.

A paper bill is fine, but has one small problem. Unless you know exactly how much your purchase will be, there will be a balance left over on your paper bill. You can't just throw it away after an amount is swept off. You will need to move the balance to a secure address somehow. It would be great to have an automated way to make your bill expire after a predetermined set period of time and the balance is then moved to the next address in a series.

Revalin

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Activity: 728

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165YUuQUWhBz3d27iXKxRiazQnjEtJNG9g

This is elegant and easy. I like it.

The general process can also be done electronically - you can have your phone put up a QR code that provides keys for a few addresses that total the correct amount. It recreates all the phone security problems, but adds some convenience.

I'd love to see this process become the default. It would work well regardless of if the buyer wants to use phones or paper.

molecular

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Quote from: casascius on January 29, 2012, 06:40:45 PM

I think people printing their own "bitcoin bills" would be a very sustainable idea. No security would be needed

Merchants would sweep the bills immediately via QR code. Merchants could give back change by sending it back to one of the bills, or by printing a new bill.

Interesting.

You'd have to sweep the change-bill yourself immediately or trust the merchant. Neither is out of the question, of course.

ovidiusoft

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Merit: 250

Quote from: paraipan on January 29, 2012, 06:44:10 PM

Quote from: casascius on January 29, 2012, 06:42:05 PM

Bitaddress.org was meant for you to save and run offline. It is a single self-contained html file with inline javascript and no external references or links. Save to your hard disk, notice it still is completely functional when run without an internet connection.

+1 i obviously edited my post to late saying the same thing

Indeed

. So my script duplicates that functionality - but it allow some customization (I hope someone with more talent than me can contribut a getter design). The next script I'll release will make it easier for Electrum users to generate PaperCoins. You will run it like this: "script ...." and it will create a new wallet (so you'll have it later if you want to, but separate from your main one), transfer funds, generate PDF, all automagically. Later, I want to integrate it into the Electrum client GUI and I'm hoping this topic will attract other client developers who will want to add the same functionality to their software. Then, we can work with POS software developers to add the sweep (+send remainder) functionality. That's my secret plan! Oh wait...

Topic: PaperCoins - page 2. (Read 4126 times)