Topic: Perfect government by protocol - page 3. (Read 4029 times)

So you're simply going to stick your head in the sand and refuse to examine the more important question of why people shouldn't break the Constitution? Makes sense since there's no good reason not to..


Wrong, it happened a hell of a lot sooner then that, more like 20 years or so after the war with Britain when the SCOTUS started issuing various opinions reinforcing the role of the federal government over state sovereignty.


Look, this is what I think you don't understand:

The constitution is just 4 pieces of paper, basically a PR statement of a small gang of people making rules for everyone else and enforcing them through the use of violence. It's not a contract, no one signed it and even if they did last I checked contract can't be transferred to the signatory's posterity so why on Earth would anyone follow the constitution when it so much more lucrative not to? Do you know of a single case where it's more than obvious they didn't follow the constitution and they faced any ANY negative repercussions at all?

What you are asking for is for human beings to act against their human nature by following a document they have no actual obligations to follow while forgoing huge rewards for the exact opposite actions, news flash, it's not going to happen, like ever.

It's simple really, the constitution either gave you the government that you have today or it was unable to prevent it, in either case it's unfit to fulfill it's intended role. Wake up already!


All there is is you and your freedom and if YOU aren't going to protect yourself and your freedom, no one will. Instead of trying to improve a dying idea, how about you instead examine what services does the government provide and try and offer those at a lower price and with a higher quality as a private business with a voluntary customer base. Because that's where the real solutions lies, no where else.

Try to imagine Obama or another president actually in public saying: "Lets change that whole constitution thingie in my favor".
Even with all his money from the banks and media propaganda that would be an near impossible political fight.

The other road would be to change the way taxes are collected to a more normal way, however this would entail creating a completely new division of government and then convincing people that they should stop using their constitutional protocol.

Slightly easier, but still pretty hard.

Keep in mind that the system doesn't start out corrupted (or it wouldn't live a day) so a leader or bribe happy bank would have to:
1. Take control over one or multiple government instances; military, police, judges AND the leader.
2. Take control of the media.
3. Push the populace to abandon the constitution.
4. They would now control the government, but as BTC are used they still can't print money so the payback is limited/political consequences to taking from the taxes as it's more noticeable than inflation.
5. They convince people to abandon BTC for something they can print.

Until you do ALL FIVE steps you will see almost nothing in return on your investment - zilch.
What are these steps with the US?
1. Buy pres.
2. Buy media.
3. Buy/infiltrate FED board.
4. Done.

You also get payoff at step 1 instead of step 4. Notice the difference?

So yes it's VERY much a question of "how to do it practically", not why. You "could" also convince the majority of BTC users to switch to my alt chain that gives me 10% of all fees - but practically that would never effing happen.

Keep in mind it took the US about 200 years to get corrupted from start to finish, so with my protocol and BTC for national currency you could have a very long lasting stable wealthy society.

Precisely, that's why I asked and not

Noun
tax (countable and uncountable; plural taxes)
Money paid to the government other than for transaction-specific goods and services.
-wiktionary

So in other words if you have a government with police/military authority and you are paying something to them - that something is a tax.

Non-specific is the key here where most "fees" pay for "bank", "health insurance" or similar.

However you can call it a fee if you want; not really the point here.

1. Every citizen runs a client, similar in ways to the BTC client.
2. That client helps maintain a distributed DB (blockchain) over who should get taxes.
3. Different client users might have different powers as agreed upon with that protocol.
4. "Power" here would be the ability to change a government divisions proportional income from of the total tax income.
5. Such power holders could be "judges" or "presidents" that you vote on via YOUR client.
6. Any breach of protocol would be impossible just like with BTC - you would simply be creating a fork.
7. The DB tells your client that say "police" should get 10% of the budget.
8. Your client is used to pay the tax according to this public data.
9. If you pay 11% or 9% to the police it is not accepted and your public key = person number will not have a tax registered.

So in a system like that how can a president stay in power after being voted out?

Sure he could continue CALLING himself president, but all the flowing tax revenue would now flow to the new guy who would consequently come to hold power even if the old guy resisted a while.

Thus protocol/constitution is unbreakable.
EDIT: Or at least you would have to force a majority of the country to change habits etc. to do it.

I have written some 80 pages on this idea/subject already if you want a copy.

Why would anyone "not break the constitution"?

I don't understand. Why should I have to pay for something I don't want or wont get any benefit from?

EDIT: Actually now that I think about it a bit more:


Well.. if it's a government "they believe in" then the services the government provides, regardless of whether those services benefit them or not, are services that they want and are paying for, hence it's a fee.

I disagree:

A fee usually is accompanied by a specific benefit or service.

A TAX is paid to a government that may help others, but not YOU. If they DO help you that help is often diverse and not specific to just one service.

Its nitpicking, but I think it makes sense that people would pay a voluntary tax to government they believed in.


Whether the tax is entirely voluntary or collected as today I think my idea would improve governments by making it at least harder for them to break the constitution.

Voter fraud for instance would be made impossible and you could have elections every day if you wanted to. Put together that would make it near impossible to buy elections once/twice and then rob the country four-eight years in a row.

There is no such thing as voluntary taxes - it's an oxymoron. The appropriate name for what you call voluntary taxes is "a fee".

I think if you have a bad government spending unwisely it matters little HOW they get their taxes.

With this system taxes would have to be voluntary, however if you had not paid you would be charged for everything you used in the public sphere even the roads.

With all taxes voluntary the government actually has to care.

With bitcoin taxes will need to go to consumption ones and also land taxes.

These are both fairer and less destructive to income and businesses.

The past 11 years I have been interested in leadership.

I'm about to hand in my bachelors project which is a program framework for expressing the distribution rules of an organization. Basically to avoid corruption you let a program "hold the bag".

That is pretty cool and my program is awesome. However it runs on a normal server so any attempt to control a corrupt elite also in control of said server would fail.

EDIT: Thread on framework that is combined with concepts from BTC here: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.935674


Then today I think I finally found a way to make it perfect.

The key was leaving out storage!

Some explanation is due:
1. A protocol defines the rules of an organization.
2. The database of my project is turned into a blockchain type database.
3. People pay "taxes"/membership fees to the organization.
4. The taxes are immediately sent to the address specified in the org chain database.
5. All DB changing actions by users are signed/authorized using their key.

If you try to change the rules your block will not become part of the chain.
Since the chain does not store any value it can be made public without anyone emptying the "treasury".

Taxes would be paid with bitcoin.

Citizens who paid their tax would be able to identify themselves using their public/private key when applying for health care/school/other.


If this is possible it will be big. People will be able to organize themselves without fear that the politicians can break their constitution. Even the libertarians here should like that.

I myself believe strongly in government, but only when it is good government. I have seen what people can accomplish together and that is why governments are needed I think - joint investments beyond even companies.

After some quick thinking I believe my framework ideas can also be reused so that not every organization would need to be programmed from scratch.

Its fine if you don't get what I'm talking about I just got excited and had to tell someone. It's going to be a bitch to program this though...