Possible to Manipulate bitcoin price??

Quidat

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Quote from: Nazmul012 on June 16, 2020, 01:22:40 AM

Quote from: Justin999 on May 19, 2020, 02:57:13 AM

Manipulating bitcoin price is easily possible & Controlled by big fish Trades, whales & holders. If we notice bitcoin chart from January 2017 to till 2020, Everywhere indicates manipulation. After making market bullish, they told us a fairy story that bitcoin is illegal. Can be stolen by hackers, Reasons for money laundering and so ban by usa, china, India or bla bla bla. Then people sell their hodling share to save theirs balance and thus market drops.
Then Big fish buy bitcoin with low price & start saying that:: bitcoin have a great future. Will hit $100k this year, will hit $1M soon etc etc and makes us crazy to investment in bitcoin again. So Pump-dump Pump-dump is going on & on and they make profit from It(Us). Small traders like us, are in loss after all. I hope soon some celebrity will have revails about how much bitcoin they have & tell us to buy bitcoin so that bitcoin will hit $20k soon as 2017 and then..... Cheesy

So true. Bitcoin lovers are always expecting high price of bitcoin. But there are some big traders/whales, they can manipulate market so badly anytime. small traders like us, Can't do anything against it. But if you can be an experienced wise trader, the amount of loss can be minimize. Although now people are buying crypto for have some profit during this Covid-19

Thank you for your opinion. Its very helpful for meh

Are people responses on here do satisfy you regarding into your question or query? If yes, then better to lock up this thread before it would go into mega spam thread. If no, then leave it as it should be.
Answering on the topic when it comes to manipulation thing then its always been possible, this had been also quite rampant in traditional markets like stocks or forex but on a very conservative way of manipulation
since its a centralized market which obvious manipulation would really have corresponding legal act or consequences.How much more in a unregulated market? There are lots of whales that can anytime
influence market price movements.

Raflesia

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Quote from: iv4n on June 16, 2020, 03:37:34 AM

Bitcoin lovers hold for that higher prices, bitcoin lovers also have an amount for having fun, trading or gambling, where we have a chance to make more. Small traders lose money because they are greedy, make a reasonable goal with amount you trading with. Don't expect to invest $50 in trading and to make $1000 in few days. It's not impossible, but it's like very hard to do that. Try to make 5% from your amount on weekly basis and maybe you will be more luck in long run.
It's possible to manipulate every market, is it easy or hard depends on how big market is. As market grows in value it's harder to manipulate it with.

It is greed that makes us forget about patterns that have been applied before, indeed, most of now want to always be for a short time even though it is difficult to do if the market conditions are uncertain or fluctuations.
But for me daily trading is also enough to take a little percentage but it is also not impossible to continue there must be a bad thing so we must be able to see or analyze what has been traded in the long term.

Gambling is not a good thing when we have extra money so having fun is necessary so that we don't get stressed.

iv4n

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Quote from: Nazmul012 on June 16, 2020, 01:22:40 AM

Quote from: Justin999 on May 19, 2020, 02:57:13 AM

Manipulating bitcoin price is easily possible & Controlled by big fish Trades, whales & holders. If we notice bitcoin chart from January 2017 to till 2020, Everywhere indicates manipulation. After making market bullish, they told us a fairy story that bitcoin is illegal. Can be stolen by hackers, Reasons for money laundering and so ban by usa, china, India or bla bla bla. Then people sell their hodling share to save theirs balance and thus market drops.
Then Big fish buy bitcoin with low price & start saying that:: bitcoin have a great future. Will hit $100k this year, will hit $1M soon etc etc and makes us crazy to investment in bitcoin again. So Pump-dump Pump-dump is going on & on and they make profit from It(Us). Small traders like us, are in loss after all. I hope soon some celebrity will have revails about how much bitcoin they have & tell us to buy bitcoin so that bitcoin will hit $20k soon as 2017 and then..... Cheesy

So true. Bitcoin lovers are always expecting high price of bitcoin. But there are some big traders/whales, they can manipulate market so badly anytime. small traders like us, Can't do anything against it. But if you can be an experienced wise trader, the amount of loss can be minimize. Although now people are buying crypto for have some profit during this Covid-19

Bitcoin lovers hold for that higher prices, bitcoin lovers also have an amount for having fun, trading or gambling, where we have a chance to make more. Small traders lose money because they are greedy, make a reasonable goal with amount you trading with. Don't expect to invest $50 in trading and to make $1000 in few days. It's not impossible, but it's like very hard to do that. Try to make 5% from your amount on weekly basis and maybe you will be more luck in long run.
It's possible to manipulate every market, is it easy or hard depends on how big market is. As market grows in value it's harder to manipulate it with.

Nazmul012

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Quote from: Justin999 on May 19, 2020, 02:57:13 AM

Manipulating bitcoin price is easily possible & Controlled by big fish Trades, whales & holders. If we notice bitcoin chart from January 2017 to till 2020, Everywhere indicates manipulation. After making market bullish, they told us a fairy story that bitcoin is illegal. Can be stolen by hackers, Reasons for money laundering and so ban by usa, china, India or bla bla bla. Then people sell their hodling share to save theirs balance and thus market drops.
Then Big fish buy bitcoin with low price & start saying that:: bitcoin have a great future. Will hit $100k this year, will hit $1M soon etc etc and makes us crazy to investment in bitcoin again. So Pump-dump Pump-dump is going on & on and they make profit from It(Us). Small traders like us, are in loss after all. I hope soon some celebrity will have revails about how much bitcoin they have & tell us to buy bitcoin so that bitcoin will hit $20k soon as 2017 and then..... Cheesy

So true. Bitcoin lovers are always expecting high price of bitcoin. But there are some big traders/whales, they can manipulate market so badly anytime. small traders like us, Can't do anything against it. But if you can be an experienced wise trader, the amount of loss can be minimize. Although now people are buying crypto for have some profit during this Covid-19

STT

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The Big Short movie the price went up as it was not a market set price but arbitrary reflection via a properiety bond, so fixed prices. In the end they did correct price downwards after a delay as apparently they had left it unhedged on the idea the short was not likely to pay off, a bit like insurance underwritting I guess.

So far as the dollar, The Fed also can fix prices via interest rates and some more direct measures. It can be called on but its a long process to alter, eventually the market is bigger then people setting the prices but via QE they are the market makers and largest holders. I believe bonds are held within government pension plans, there is speculation that eventually every pension fund would be eventually forced to buy government bonds hence balancing the QE. Thats manipulation but with the peoples consent in theory, the same could be said of extremes taken in Venezula eventually it couldnt be patched up and every market resets fixed or not.
BTC is nowhere as controlled as all that because its a distributed system.

adaseb

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Ask yourself this? Is it possible to manipulate the price of stocks on the stock market? Basically we got what? 35 Million people unemployed and the NASDAQ100 looks like it engulfed the entire drop and could quite possibility reach its ATH in the next few weeks? Makes sense? Of course not.

Sure people are saying that the fed printing dollars is creating inflation which means they need to spend their USD so it doesnt' lose value. Or there are millions of new retail investors who are bored at home and are buying stocks with the $1200 stimulus cheques and its propping up the market.

Or it could be like that Big Short movie, where they all went Short but the markets still went up before it eventually collpased. Hence markets are manipulated everywhere. So yes its possible to manipulate it however its rarely done in Crypto as its done in the stock markets.

Kelvinid

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You can't simply underestimate the capability of whales in the crypto market. They are so much influential as they have the money to play. However, as we all aware of that possible manipulations, we also anticipate it in a way of opposing their strategy. But sadly, not all of us are knowledgeable about this kind, and somewhat it hard for newcomers to escape because of their limitations.
It is to think that, we can't certainly eliminate this activity until such time that all crypto holders are becoming whales.

Janation

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Absolutely yes and you can't ignore that thing knowing that whales will strike if they wanted. We can't simply think that Bitcoin is 100% a decentralized coin this time, manipulations are often to happen, only we saw this time that hypes aren't particularly working unlike what it happens last 2017.
But for me, I'm so glad to have not happening again and it saves noobs to suffer losses.

I don't think you need to call them noobs.

Since we are talking about manipulation, and this whales manipulating the market whenever they wanted to as you said, everyone, can lose, including you. If you call people who lose at that time where the market behaves unpredictably noobs, then I guess we all belong there. Either way, we all started to be noobs so don't mock your starting point.

Mahanton

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Absolutely yes and you can't ignore that thing knowing that whales will strike if they wanted. We can't simply think that Bitcoin is 100% a decentralized coin this time, manipulations are often to happen, only we saw this time that hypes aren't particularly working unlike what it happens last 2017.
But for me, I'm so glad to have not happening again and it saves noobs to suffer losses.

Manipulation is indeed do exist to these markets since they do have the money that can really led to prices on what they wanted.
We know that the price can swing up on big percentage without even expecting.So its not something new that's why its important
that we should take actions on anything that do happen into this market.They are there and just trying to make up fud or fomo
so that the entire community will react and that's the time they would set in.

KTChampions

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Quote from: bitbunnny on May 22, 2020, 02:27:10 PM

Such theories about Bitcoin price being manipulated appear all the time. And the power of manipulation is often given to whales.
To my opinion whales are been given more significance than they actually have and I think that due to Bitcoin features and how it's functioning I think that the price is difficult to manipulate and that is often an excuse when price is in bad position.
So, manipulation of price is more a theory than fact.

I think the main reason for the emergence of these theories is the low (compared with other markets) liquidity of the crypto market. I think this is an obvious line of reasoning: the less liquidity, the less volume you can move the price, which means that whoever owns large assets manipulates the price. I think these theories will gradually die out, but for this the cryptocurrency market must develop.

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Speculations and manipulations will always happen but at the same time those are not the norms of the market, plus even if you do manipulation there is going to be a response to it so I do not think it matters. Let's say you managed to drop bitcoin from 10k to 6k as a manipulation, that doesn't mean that bitcoin price will stay at 6k forever, it will go back over 10k once again anyway.

So, I do not think it really matters that much, it changes the short term traders future and all that, but for people like me who are long term investors I do not think it really matters as much as you think it matters, whatever happens inside a year happens, I only look at it as what has happened to my coin after years and that can't change with manipulation at all.

STT

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Wisdom of crowds and consensus of opinion is what moves markets, otherwise you get a million people who are distributed and opposing pulling on a rope in different directions means we dont generally move too much in one direction at a time. A whale distorting the market is then less likely then everyone in that crowd of people or at least one side in the tug of war, just let go of the rope and what happens is we go flying. By this I mean when sell orders or buy orders are badly out of balance the market will move and sometimes rapidly. Its not a whale, its just the crowd effect and its not foreign as a concept as it happens all the time and in many markets and situations not just Bitcoin. As sheep do we recognise our own movements, not really we think its something magical like whales or secret agents, it cant just be people shifting about and getting scared all at once from the same news.

bitbunnny

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Such theories about Bitcoin price being manipulated appear all the time. And the power of manipulation is often given to whales.
To my opinion whales are been given more significance than they actually have and I think that due to Bitcoin features and how it's functioning I think that the price is difficult to manipulate and that is often an excuse when price is in bad position.
So, manipulation of price is more a theory than fact.

onrise

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Quote from: fortunecrypto on May 21, 2020, 08:31:28 AM

It applies to every market, as long as there are whales in a market there will always manipulation not only on Bitcoin but also on other coins, there was a time that a whales or group of whales manipulate the market, to crash the market, some small investors make profits from that, in my own opinion it's ok that the price crashes because that is the best time to always buy that you want to buy.

For whale’s thing may not be impossible though in btc you really need to have that big position to either buy/sell in order to move the market. Or a group of big intuitions or people must come together and do the trade likewise in order to move their ways. It may be done to an extent and thus in those scenarios many small investors fall in the public mode and create more selling pressure leading to more fall in market.

sheenshane

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That makes Bitcoin or any financial market trading more challenging and risky because if there are no manipulations from whales who else will be trading since there will be no chance of getting a profit from it. Sad point here is we don't belong to the whales or the big fish who can manipulate the price of bitcoin by pulling in and out their bitcoins to control the price in the market and because of these whales and big fish most of the time became a winner in the end.

However, whales and big fish will not live without small-time traders like us because we serve as the prey for them if they are able to catch us might as well be more careful and earn from them if we succeed.

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Quote from: Justin999 on May 19, 2020, 02:57:13 AM

Manipulating bitcoin price is easily possible & Controled by big fish Trades, whales & holders. If we notice bitcoin chart from January 2017 to till 2020, Eerywhere indicates manupulation. After making market bullish, they told us a fairy story that bitcoin is illegal. Can be stolen by hackers, Reasons for money laundering and so ban by usa, china, india or bla bla bla. Then people sell their hodling share to save theirs balance and thus market drops.
Then Big fish buy bitcoin with low price & start saying that:: bitcoin have a great future. Will hit $100k this year, will hit $1M soon etc etc and makes us crazy to investment in bitcoin again. So Pump-dump Pump-dump is going on & on and they make profit from It(Us). Small traders like us, are in loss after all. I hope soon some celebrety will have revails about how much bitcoin they have & tell us to buy bitcoin so that bitcoin will hit $20k soon as 2017 and then..... Cheesy

There is no impossible specially if we are talking about whales here in crypto.

Look if 5 whales having hundred thousands or even million bitcoins will go together and make same decision to
manipulate market?for sure they can just make the market Up and Down in just a matter of 24 hours.

They can Make the price fall and let panicking people sell off.

Then after few hours of dumping they will buy back again to make the price Move up trend again so buyers
will take advantage.

This cycle can be done multiple times in a span of 1 day so what can be the effect in the market?for sure another
bad for the newbie and starting to trust Crypto.

Ridwan Fauzi

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But one thing that you should know they (whales or someone who has a lot of bitcoin) will make buying and selling bitcoin depend on the news.

That is mean, we are as a small trader still have a chance to avoid any manipulation. We can buy bitcoin before whales do and otherwise when they will sell bitcoin we can sell it before day do.

This is why I'll tend to use trendline strategy and see book order when I trade. I'll know if something bad and something good will happen. As you have to know as well, someone who has a lot of money can do anything not only in bitcoin.

mahilchii

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Even a fairly small amount of capital can manipulate BTC yes it is possible and we have experienced this several times, one common tactics whales use to manipulate the crypto currency market are pump and dump. They will work out this especially effective with low market cap coins well that's how they make the market However they can.

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Quote from: cafetools on May 21, 2020, 12:25:28 AM

In order for a whale to tank Bitcoins price by even a tiny %1 they would need to sell suddenly $1,700,000,000 dollars. I just dont see it, altcoins with a lower market cap much easier.

Yes one billion and 700 million is %1, and IF a whale dumped this much what would happen?

BTC price would go from $9500 to $9405 dropping $95 or %1

You have a misconception about liquidity in the cryptocurrency market. Most of the volumes displayed by any exchange is fake. In fact, the volume of transactions determining the price of bitcoin is much less than you can see at CMC, I think that if someone throws 1.7 billion dollars to the market, then depending on the direction the price will easily make + 10x or -10x

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I feel like it is not the whales nor the speculators who are making bitcoin move this much, I feel like news websites have more power over bitcoin than anybody else. Its not really news websites but more like any "news" that comes from anywhere. Look at the 2009 bitcoin thingy, people saw that someone cashed out who was a very early bird, and they thought it was for sure satoshi and suddenly everyone is acting like there is a chance it was actually satoshi and price went down.

As you can see this wasn't a whale since it was only 50 btc, it wasn't really a speculator, it wasn't anything at all, it was just a news that was proven wrong later on which caused the prices to drop significantly. Hence I believe news in bitcoin world have bigger impact than anything else.

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