I may be biased as a computer repairer but probably 1 in 4 people have a significantly dangerous virus on their PC. That means 1 in 4 would get their bitcoin wallet stolen. In fact, who says the repair technician they bring it to doesn't steal their wallet file too? And people in general aren't known for their strong passwords. The only way bitcoins will "work" on a huge scale is if nobody ever catches any malware ever.
I have to agree here, the number of ways that a user can end up losing their bitcoins to a thief is large. The solution to this problem requires probably just as much genius as creating the bitcoin itself. 
Topic: Potential obstacles for mass adoption of BTC - page 2. (Read 3942 times)
I say we design the "end user experience" around a hardware wallet (that does nothing but sign transactions) and make the vendors house the blockchain. Then the average end user only needs to know/keep the private key, and can use bitcoin at Point of Sale.
First step is to design a low cost bitcoin pos machine - that we can provide for cheap or no cost to the the vendor. If it's marketed correctly, we could see stores hanging bitcoin signs and offering discounts for using it.
First step is to design a low cost bitcoin pos machine - that we can provide for cheap or no cost to the the vendor. If it's marketed correctly, we could see stores hanging bitcoin signs and offering discounts for using it.
There needs to be an idiot-proof hardware wallet (dongle-like contraption or QR code scanner+keygen/signer).
Easy as pie, if we use a combination of smart-phone technology. So the vendor has a unique, generated QR code containing an address and the amount of the sale on a screen that you use an app to scan and hit 'pay'. Bingo.
The Blockchain.info wallet already has this functionality. Both vendor and customer need no additional hardware. People just need to start experimenting with using bitcoins. The current tools for experimentation are already there for the average person.
With BitInstant they can buy $40 worth of coins at 7-11 and start playing with it. As they start playing with it they will get more competent; just like they are more competent with online banking, email, etc.
I may be biased as a computer repairer but probably 1 in 4 people have a significantly dangerous virus on their PC. That means 1 in 4 would get their bitcoin wallet stolen. In fact, who says the repair technician they bring it to doesn't steal their wallet file too? And people in general aren't known for their strong passwords. The only way bitcoins will "work" on a huge scale is if nobody ever catches any malware ever.
bitcoin has too much of a bad rep, too much of the current community wanting it to stay anonymous, and too many not wanting to lose its silk road ties so they can carry on buying drugs. all reducing trust when it comes to legitimate real world adoption.
i think maybe litecoin should be adopted as the mass market currency, as the stepping stone to bitcoin. its already available via some exchanges, does not have the illegal stigma of silkroad or other bad press stuff. so maybe thats the way forward. litecoin for merchants and bitcoin for the anonymous..
and its a close second to bitcoin in the crypto currencies.
every bitcoin technology is compatible with litecoin and litecoin is so new that it does not have the bad rep. so lets treat litecoin as the new real world merchant version of crypto.
to instantly gain trust, reduce fraud and raise traceability, all the client needs to do is have a registered username which all addresses in the wallet are linked to. so the block chain can see whoo is doing what.
this will reduce fraud considerably. and gain trust. (not perfect but its a start)
any other idea's to make litecoin trustworthy for merchants.. as i feel bitcoin has its niche market and wants to stick with it. and wont be dragged out of the dark easily
i think maybe litecoin should be adopted as the mass market currency, as the stepping stone to bitcoin. its already available via some exchanges, does not have the illegal stigma of silkroad or other bad press stuff. so maybe thats the way forward. litecoin for merchants and bitcoin for the anonymous..
and its a close second to bitcoin in the crypto currencies.
every bitcoin technology is compatible with litecoin and litecoin is so new that it does not have the bad rep. so lets treat litecoin as the new real world merchant version of crypto.
to instantly gain trust, reduce fraud and raise traceability, all the client needs to do is have a registered username which all addresses in the wallet are linked to. so the block chain can see whoo is doing what.
this will reduce fraud considerably. and gain trust. (not perfect but its a start)
any other idea's to make litecoin trustworthy for merchants.. as i feel bitcoin has its niche market and wants to stick with it. and wont be dragged out of the dark easily
But you see, it's EXACTLY like a credit card in the respect of trust. When you swipe your card, I can take your info and charge however much I want to it, especially online. The verification groups would be trusted, and would in turn evaluate the trustworthiness of the vendor. Bitcoin fraud would be just as traceable as creditcard fraud. Even moreso for the fact that the blockchain has every transaction ever, making any stolen fraction of a bitcoin traceable.
Except we need to better than credit cards, or wheres the incentive to use bitcoin for the average joe.
Brilliant. If this isn't already being done, let's get to it.
Easy as pie, if we use a combination of smart-phone technology. So the vendor has a unique, generated QR code containing an address and the amount of the sale on a screen that you use an app to scan and hit 'pay'. Bingo.
The other method would be to have a 'debit card' type solution, where you have a registered card with the necessary key to sign a transaction, and you can just swipe and go. Firmware updates could make current gen credit card swipes able to use this tech through a verification and allocation company like the bank that handles the credit card machines. It would accept the transaction from your account, signed by way of the card, deduct a processing fee, and send it to the account for the business. With a book-keeping system, the host company can easy process refunds and chargebacks.
QR generated by the merchant's existing POS or computer would be workable (smartphone wallets only).
But the swipe a card doesn't work for security. We don't want the merchant's machine signing our transaction using our private key - way too much potential for theft that way. Back to a hardware device that signs for us (wouldn't have to be plugged in, maybe using something like paypass?)
But you see, it's EXACTLY like a credit card in the respect of trust. When you swipe your card, I can take your info and charge however much I want to it, especially online. The verification groups would be trusted, and would in turn evaluate the trustworthiness of the vendor. Bitcoin fraud would be just as traceable as creditcard fraud. Even moreso for the fact that the blockchain has every transaction ever, making any stolen fraction of a bitcoin traceable.
Brilliant. If this isn't already being done, let's get to it.
Easy as pie, if we use a combination of smart-phone technology. So the vendor has a unique, generated QR code containing an address and the amount of the sale on a screen that you use an app to scan and hit 'pay'. Bingo.
The other method would be to have a 'debit card' type solution, where you have a registered card with the necessary key to sign a transaction, and you can just swipe and go. Firmware updates could make current gen credit card swipes able to use this tech through a verification and allocation company like the bank that handles the credit card machines. It would accept the transaction from your account, signed by way of the card, deduct a processing fee, and send it to the account for the business. With a book-keeping system, the host company can easy process refunds and chargebacks.
QR generated by the merchant's existing POS or computer would be workable (smartphone wallets only).
But the swipe a card doesn't work for security. We don't want the merchant's machine signing our transaction using our private key - way too much potential for theft that way. Back to a hardware device that signs for us (wouldn't have to be plugged in, maybe using something like paypass?)
As long as government exists, there will be taxation. Since any major merchant/producer have a reviser, and they have a balance sheet and inventory list, they will not be able to pass the declaration inspection, even if they use BTC as the only method of transaction, BTC can not be formally accepted in any accounting systems known of today
If government want to put some limitation on BTC, they can also do some block on the major IP backbone, so that BTC protocol's port get blocked
I think the first big success for BTC will be happened on a tax heaven where there is no regulation on economy activities
If government want to put some limitation on BTC, they can also do some block on the major IP backbone, so that BTC protocol's port get blocked
I think the first big success for BTC will be happened on a tax heaven where there is no regulation on economy activities
Completely invalid since accepting bitcoin is sort of like bartering in the eyes of governments, and barter is already taxed (in case you didn't know). If they can tax and enforce taxation on barter, I don't see why they couldn't do the same with bitcoins (not that I support this heinous thievery).
depends on how you look at taxes.. if put back in a community.. lets say infrastructure, the firedepartment etc. etc. tax is not only about thievery if well used ...
But this is a problem if btc get really really adopted by the general public...in EU lots of tax money from hard working people at the moment is send to self created over paid jobs at Brussels 25k p/m that is thievery...
I say we design the "end user experience" around a hardware wallet (that does nothing but sign transactions) and make the vendors house the blockchain. Then the average end user only needs to know/keep the private key, and can use bitcoin at Point of Sale.
First step is to design a low cost bitcoin pos machine - that we can provide for cheap or no cost to the the vendor. If it's marketed correctly, we could see stores hanging bitcoin signs and offering discounts for using it.
First step is to design a low cost bitcoin pos machine - that we can provide for cheap or no cost to the the vendor. If it's marketed correctly, we could see stores hanging bitcoin signs and offering discounts for using it.
Brilliant. If this isn't already being done, let's get to it.
Easy as pie, if we use a combination of smart-phone technology. So the vendor has a unique, generated QR code containing an address and the amount of the sale on a screen that you use an app to scan and hit 'pay'. Bingo.
The other method would be to have a 'debit card' type solution, where you have a registered card with the necessary key to sign a transaction, and you can just swipe and go. Firmware updates could make current gen credit card swipes able to use this tech through a verification and allocation company like the bank that handles the credit card machines. It would accept the transaction from your account, signed by way of the card, deduct a processing fee, and send it to the account for the business. With a book-keeping system, the host company can easy process refunds and chargebacks.
I say we design the "end user experience" around a hardware wallet (that does nothing but sign transactions) and make the vendors house the blockchain. Then the average end user only needs to know/keep the private key, and can use bitcoin at Point of Sale.
First step is to design a low cost bitcoin pos machine - that we can provide for cheap or no cost to the the vendor. If it's marketed correctly, we could see stores hanging bitcoin signs and offering discounts for using it.
First step is to design a low cost bitcoin pos machine - that we can provide for cheap or no cost to the the vendor. If it's marketed correctly, we could see stores hanging bitcoin signs and offering discounts for using it.
Brilliant. If this isn't already being done, let's get to it.
Blockchain is the core of Bitcoin. Everything that doesn't rely on the blockchain is perversion of Satoshi's idea.
except that he mentions the simplified payment verification idea in the whitepaper
No. Imagine what will happen if everyone uses clients that don't need full blockchain.
True - but I really don't think there is going to be much alternative for the average person (who is really going to wait potentially days for their software to start working?).
I say we design the "end user experience" around a hardware wallet (that does nothing but sign transactions) and make the vendors house the blockchain. Then the average end user only needs to know/keep the private key, and can use bitcoin at Point of Sale.
First step is to design a low cost bitcoin pos machine - that we can provide for cheap or no cost to the the vendor. If it's marketed correctly, we could see stores hanging bitcoin signs and offering discounts for using it.
there are other clients that don't need to use it.
No. Imagine what will happen if everyone uses clients that don't need full blockchain.
Blockchain is the core of Bitcoin. Everything that doesn't rely on the blockchain is perversion of Satoshi's idea.
we REALLY need to be able to buy and sell bitcoin with one button. none of this anal raping we gotta go through. I'm in australia, and we don't have too many options. CryptoXchange charges $20 to cash out! what a rip
Ultimately, I believe, that the BTC community must transform from a cloistered technology community to that of a customer service focused business model; which puts the average consumers needs as the first priority.
I think this is very true - and I don't think governments have anything to worry about Bitcoin when it comes to that (as average consumers are already happy to give out all of their personal information to use credit cards anyway).
I have a hard time envisioning most people I know managing a bootable truecrypt drive just to protect their Bitcoin wallet. Some standardized, easy and safe way must be devised before the "masses" will even give it a try.
+1 on everything you wrote in this thread
However, may I suggest you try our Paytunia wallet (with a Yubikey as our optional second factor of authentication) : that's a lot easier and very secure for any amount that it is reasonable to hold in a wallet (ie the amount of cash people carry around in general). Any amount above and beyond that qualifies as savings and should be held in a paperwallet imho.
there are other clients that don't need to use it.
No. Imagine what will happen if everyone uses clients that don't need full blockchain.
there are other clients that don't need to use it.
No. Imagine what will happen if everyone uses clients that don't need full blockchain.
Imagine if we all went to the Dunkin' Doughnuts on the corner of 38th and Walnut at 9am on Wednesday!
There is a potential: Even a normal user can not fully understand these complexity around BTC, a pension fund can. Since BTC has gained popularity, it will become one of the candidate in their investment portfolio. And actually this is very positive to economy, since now people can be sure that their retirement is secured and they will stop saving and start to spend
It doesn't seem to matter how many websites lose everyone's coins, people keep on insisting on using them.
So most people are probably just going to be using websites, any maybe the more like PayPal those websites seem to the users the more popular they will be and the more coins they will get to run away with when they run away.
But hey, there are a few that have not run away yet and people keep on using those. So whats the problem, really?
-MarkM-
So most people are probably just going to be using websites, any maybe the more like PayPal those websites seem to the users the more popular they will be and the more coins they will get to run away with when they run away.
But hey, there are a few that have not run away yet and people keep on using those. So whats the problem, really?
-MarkM-
Jump to: