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Topic: Provably fair gambling sites - page 2. (Read 2714 times)

deluxeCITY
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Activity: 532
Merit: 500
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 05:24:38 PM
#38
Quote from: activebiz on March 14, 2015, 05:18:52 PM
I don't think there are such casinos around. the best suggestions would be primedice, coinroyale.

There are fair casino's just look at any that have been out the longest and i am sure if there was a problem then there would be multiple complaints in any amount of time before i started my sig campaign i played bitdice and never had a problem in well over 5 months the site has been going over a year so i recommend them for that plus a decent owner who will not do a runnerr.
activebiz
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Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 05:18:52 PM
#37
I don't think there are such casinos around. the best suggestions would be primedice, coinroyale.
GannickusX
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Activity: 490
Merit: 500
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 03:00:51 PM
#36
Quote from: ?? on ??
Quote from: Bardman on March 14, 2015, 11:53:18 AM
If i write a simulation using martingale i will eventually bust, and that would happen with any other strategy, why dont you try it yourself, your reasoning is incorrect not mine, the ones that dont will bust the house? People are greedy, for example the guy who won 7k btc on just-dice and ended up loosing, people its always greedy and thats why a 0% house edge casino would still win

Ok, let's do it -- a simple simulation of a greedy player who never stops gambling (unless he busts):


Code:
var startingBankroll = 100;
var bet = 1;


while(true) {
	var bankroll = startingBankroll;

	for (var i = 1; bankroll > 0; ++i) {

		bankroll += Math.random() < 0.5 ? bet : -bet;
		
		if (i % 100000000 === 0)
			console.log('Player has made', i , 'bets at a profit of:', bankroll-startingBankroll, ' BTC');
	}
	console.log('PLAYER BUST!');
}

Now run that, and watch as the vast majority of players will bust. But occasionally you'll get to a real gem like this guy:

Quote
Player has made 2300000000 bets at a profit of: 161962  BTC
Player has made 2400000000 bets at a profit of: 175434  BTC
Player has made 2500000000 bets at a profit of: 195960  BTC
Player has made 2600000000 bets at a profit of: 207738  BTC
Player has made 2700000000 bets at a profit of: 205418  BTC
Player has made 2800000000 bets at a profit of: 209382  BTC
Player has made 2900000000 bets at a profit of: 206398  BTC
Player has made 3000000000 bets at a profit of: 217148  BTC
Player has made 3100000000 bets at a profit of: 237032  BTC
Player has made 3200000000 bets at a profit of: 251848  BTC
Player has made 3300000000 bets at a profit of: 248634  BTC
Player has made 3400000000 bets at a profit of: 252256  BTC
Player has made 3500000000 bets at a profit of: 251060  BTC
Player has made 3600000000 bets at a profit of: 260898  BTC
Player has made 3700000000 bets at a profit of: 281134  BTC
Player has made 3800000000 bets at a profit of: 294792  BTC
Player has made 3900000000 bets at a profit of: 291088  BTC
Player has made 4000000000 bets at a profit of: 295030  BTC
Player has made 4100000000 bets at a profit of: 295540  BTC
Player has made 4200000000 bets at a profit of: 304886  BTC
Player has made 4300000000 bets at a profit of: 323828  BTC
Player has made 4400000000 bets at a profit of: 337964  BTC
Player has made 4500000000 bets at a profit of: 334380  BTC
Player has made 4600000000 bets at a profit of: 338690  BTC

You really think the casino can handle billions of more bets, hoping it can make its hundreds of thousands of bitcoins back? And do you honestly think a casino would be willing to expose itself to unbounded liability for 0 expected profit?! It doesn't work, never has, never will.

But perhaps, what we'll see is bet-match-making where 0% house edge is actually feasible. That way players can play with 0-edge, and casinos aren't the counter-party

Im sorry to tell you but your simulation is wrong or i just didnt understand how was the player betting
superSTAR777
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Activity: 252
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★777Coin.com★ Fun BTC Casino!
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 01:57:06 PM
#35
Quote from: janggernaut on March 13, 2015, 10:38:02 PM
can anyone give me suggest about 5 gambling sites which really use "Provably fair"?
because many people said, "house always win".

house edge wins , doesnt means site is not provably fair , just its that site maintain a edge to make profit and there ar tons of honest sites Smiley like primedice, prcdice , etc
Bardman
hero member
Activity: 952
Merit: 516
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 01:15:49 PM
#34
Quote from: ?? on ??
Quote from: Bardman on March 14, 2015, 12:55:16 PM
I dont understand that at all, what is that player using? Martingale? And how is he making 4 bilion bets?

He is able to make that many bets -- because he hasn't yet busted. In my simulation, the player never quits until he's busted (just like you said, about a player being greedy). So even though he's up hundreds of thousands of bitcoins, he caries on. Which just shows how ridiculous using the "greed" nonsense is. With no house edge, a player being greedy doesn't help the casino -- just increases its chance of the casino busting (all for making 0 expected return. a silly value proposition)

What strategy is he using Huh
DogecoinMachine
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www.Crypto.Games: Multiple Games, Multiple Coins
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 01:03:48 PM
#33
https//www.crypto-games.net -> Provably Fair Dice & Slot
Bardman
hero member
Activity: 952
Merit: 516
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 12:55:16 PM
#32
Quote from: ?? on ??
Quote from: Bardman on March 14, 2015, 11:53:18 AM
If i write a simulation using martingale i will eventually bust, and that would happen with any other strategy, why dont you try it yourself, your reasoning is incorrect not mine, the ones that dont will bust the house? People are greedy, for example the guy who won 7k btc on just-dice and ended up loosing, people its always greedy and thats why a 0% house edge casino would still win

Ok, let's do it -- a simple simulation of a greedy player who never stops gambling (unless he busts):


Code:
var startingBankroll = 100;
var bet = 1;


while(true) {
	var bankroll = startingBankroll;

	for (var i = 1; bankroll > 0; ++i) {

		bankroll += Math.random() < 0.5 ? bet : -bet;
		
		if (i % 100000000 === 0)
			console.log('Player has made', i , 'bets at a profit of:', bankroll-startingBankroll, ' BTC');
	}
	console.log('PLAYER BUST!');
}

Now run that, and watch as the vast majority of players will bust. But occasionally you'll get to a real gem like this guy:

Quote
Player has made 2300000000 bets at a profit of: 161962  BTC
Player has made 2400000000 bets at a profit of: 175434  BTC
Player has made 2500000000 bets at a profit of: 195960  BTC
Player has made 2600000000 bets at a profit of: 207738  BTC
Player has made 2700000000 bets at a profit of: 205418  BTC
Player has made 2800000000 bets at a profit of: 209382  BTC
Player has made 2900000000 bets at a profit of: 206398  BTC
Player has made 3000000000 bets at a profit of: 217148  BTC
Player has made 3100000000 bets at a profit of: 237032  BTC
Player has made 3200000000 bets at a profit of: 251848  BTC
Player has made 3300000000 bets at a profit of: 248634  BTC
Player has made 3400000000 bets at a profit of: 252256  BTC
Player has made 3500000000 bets at a profit of: 251060  BTC
Player has made 3600000000 bets at a profit of: 260898  BTC
Player has made 3700000000 bets at a profit of: 281134  BTC
Player has made 3800000000 bets at a profit of: 294792  BTC
Player has made 3900000000 bets at a profit of: 291088  BTC
Player has made 4000000000 bets at a profit of: 295030  BTC
Player has made 4100000000 bets at a profit of: 295540  BTC
Player has made 4200000000 bets at a profit of: 304886  BTC
Player has made 4300000000 bets at a profit of: 323828  BTC
Player has made 4400000000 bets at a profit of: 337964  BTC
Player has made 4500000000 bets at a profit of: 334380  BTC
Player has made 4600000000 bets at a profit of: 338690  BTC

You really think the casino can handle billions of more bets, hoping it can make its hundreds of thousands of bitcoins back? And do you honestly think a casino would be willing to expose itself to unbounded liability for 0 expected profit?! It doesn't work, never has, never will.

But perhaps, what we'll see is bet-match-making where 0% house edge is actually feasible. That way players can play with 0-edge, and casinos aren't the counter-party

I dont understand that at all, what is that player using? Martingale? And how is he making 4 bilion bets?
Bardman
hero member
Activity: 952
Merit: 516
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 11:53:18 AM
#31
Quote from: ?? on ??
Quote from: janggernaut on March 13, 2015, 10:38:02 PM
can anyone give me suggest about 5 gambling sites which really use "Provably fair"?
because many people said, "house always win".

Provably fair simply means -- "if the casino cheats you, you can detect it". It doesn't mean you can stop them cheating you (you can't) and doesn't mean you expect to make money (you don't). It just means that if the casino is cheating you, it's detectable.

Quote from: janggernaut on March 13, 2015, 10:58:24 PM
ok, thank you all,
but how about 999dice? its recommended for gambling?

No, definitely not. They lie about being provably fair, with a backdoor scheme. If they cheat you, you can't know for sure. Hence it being not provably fair. This place is scum anyway, you should avoid it. They also claim to operate on a 0.05% margin, while allowing 40 BTC wins. lolz

Quote from: GannickusX on March 14, 2015, 05:14:27 AM
I thought there were casinos with 0% house edge around here, correct me if im wrong

There are. Some PvP games allow no edge (since they're not exposed to any risk). Money Pot allows you to play with a 0% house edge (by instantly cashing out) at the expense of being bait to bonus snatchers. DirectDice spams every thread with claims of 0% for frequent betters. I haven't looked into it though, as it sounds like some tard/scammy scheme.

Quote from: Bardman on March 14, 2015, 11:18:56 AM
Not really?? With a 0% house edge casinos would still win

That's incorrect, as is your reasoning. You can write a simulation if you don't believe it. But even if the vast-majority of people will bust with a 0% house edge, the ones that don't will bust the house. A casino couldn't safely offer a 0 house edge game for a single satoshi if it could be played an infinite amount of times.





If i write a simulation using martingale i will eventually bust, and that would happen with any other strategy, why dont you try it yourself, your reasoning is incorrect not mine, the ones that dont will bust the house? People are greedy, for example the guy who won 7k btc on just-dice and ended up loosing, people its always greedy and thats why a 0% house edge casino would still win
micromen
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Activity: 668
Merit: 393
Crypto-Games.net: Multiple Games, Multiple Coins
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 11:48:42 AM
#30
personally I like safedice.com Smiley
Slark
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Activity: 1862
Merit: 1004
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 11:41:18 AM
#29
Op, as you now probably know gambling is not that easy you will probably lose more than you win. You will lose no matter what, it does not matter if game is rigged or it is "provably fair" I got the impression that you are looking for a online bitcoin casino which is better than most because it will allow you to win more. There is no such place. So just pick your favourite casino and start playing.
Shogen
legendary
Activity: 966
Merit: 1001
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 11:26:08 AM
#28
Quote from: Bardman on March 14, 2015, 11:18:56 AM
Quote from: goose20 on March 14, 2015, 11:15:12 AM
Quote from: Minnlo on March 14, 2015, 10:48:31 AM
Quote from: Bardman on March 14, 2015, 10:27:55 AM
Quote from: Minnlo on March 14, 2015, 10:26:30 AM
Quote from: GannickusX on March 14, 2015, 05:14:27 AM
I thought there were casinos with 0% house edge around here, correct me if im wrong

AFAIK there are at least 2 games with 0% house edge, the PvP on Primedice and the PvP raffle game on Peerbet. The downside is that there are not many players and it is hard for you to find a good match.

A dice with 0% house edge would still make profit so i dont know why no one made it, it would atract a lot of players

I don't quite get it. By definition, "0% house edge" means the game has a expected value of zero to both the players and the house.
So how would a 0% house edge game bring profit to the house?  Huh


It doesn't in itself.

But the house hopes players will play other house games that do have a house edge.

It's a marketing strategy.

Not really?? With a 0% house edge casinos would still win, why? Easy at the moment you start using a strategy, it doesnt matter you name it, martingale you would still lose using martingale, yes the odds are a bit better per bet now but you will still see 20 lose streaks or more, the 0 house edge only affects players if you bet static, you bet 10k satoshis every bet, yes in the long term you would have a 0 profit but no one is gonna do that, right? So as i said before casinos would still win

Well it looks like you are assuming people will keep on playing until they are broke. Tongue
With that assumption, I guess you are right. A player need to have extremely good luck to wipe out the house bankroll before losing all his money, when the house has hundreds or thousands times more bitcoin.
Bardman
hero member
Activity: 952
Merit: 516
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 11:18:56 AM
#27
Quote from: goose20 on March 14, 2015, 11:15:12 AM
Quote from: Minnlo on March 14, 2015, 10:48:31 AM
Quote from: Bardman on March 14, 2015, 10:27:55 AM
Quote from: Minnlo on March 14, 2015, 10:26:30 AM
Quote from: GannickusX on March 14, 2015, 05:14:27 AM
I thought there were casinos with 0% house edge around here, correct me if im wrong

AFAIK there are at least 2 games with 0% house edge, the PvP on Primedice and the PvP raffle game on Peerbet. The downside is that there are not many players and it is hard for you to find a good match.

A dice with 0% house edge would still make profit so i dont know why no one made it, it would atract a lot of players

I don't quite get it. By definition, "0% house edge" means the game has a expected value of zero to both the players and the house.
So how would a 0% house edge game bring profit to the house?  Huh


It doesn't in itself.

But the house hopes players will play other house games that do have a house edge.

It's a marketing strategy.

Not really?? With a 0% house edge casinos would still win, why? Easy at the moment you start using a strategy, it doesnt matter you name it, martingale you would still lose using martingale, yes the odds are a bit better per bet now but you will still see 20 lose streaks or more, the 0 house edge only affects players if you bet static, you bet 10k satoshis every bet, yes in the long term you would have a 0 profit but no one is gonna do that, right? So as i said before casinos would still win
goose20
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Activity: 1173
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Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 11:15:12 AM
#26
Quote from: Minnlo on March 14, 2015, 10:48:31 AM
Quote from: Bardman on March 14, 2015, 10:27:55 AM
Quote from: Minnlo on March 14, 2015, 10:26:30 AM
Quote from: GannickusX on March 14, 2015, 05:14:27 AM
I thought there were casinos with 0% house edge around here, correct me if im wrong

AFAIK there are at least 2 games with 0% house edge, the PvP on Primedice and the PvP raffle game on Peerbet. The downside is that there are not many players and it is hard for you to find a good match.

A dice with 0% house edge would still make profit so i dont know why no one made it, it would atract a lot of players

I don't quite get it. By definition, "0% house edge" means the game has a expected value of zero to both the players and the house.
So how would a 0% house edge game bring profit to the house?  Huh


It doesn't in itself.

But the house hopes players will play other house games that do have a house edge.

It's a marketing strategy.
Minnlo
hero member
Activity: 868
Merit: 1000
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 10:48:31 AM
#25
Quote from: Bardman on March 14, 2015, 10:27:55 AM
Quote from: Minnlo on March 14, 2015, 10:26:30 AM
Quote from: GannickusX on March 14, 2015, 05:14:27 AM
I thought there were casinos with 0% house edge around here, correct me if im wrong

AFAIK there are at least 2 games with 0% house edge, the PvP on Primedice and the PvP raffle game on Peerbet. The downside is that there are not many players and it is hard for you to find a good match.

A dice with 0% house edge would still make profit so i dont know why no one made it, it would atract a lot of players

I don't quite get it. By definition, "0% house edge" means the game has a expected value of zero to both the players and the house.
So how would a 0% house edge game bring profit to the house?  Huh
Bardman
hero member
Activity: 952
Merit: 516
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 10:27:55 AM
#24
Quote from: Minnlo on March 14, 2015, 10:26:30 AM
Quote from: GannickusX on March 14, 2015, 05:14:27 AM
I thought there were casinos with 0% house edge around here, correct me if im wrong

AFAIK there are at least 2 games with 0% house edge, the PvP on Primedice and the PvP raffle game on Peerbet. The downside is that there are not many players and it is hard for you to find a good match.

A dice with 0% house edge would still make profit so i dont know why no one made it, it would atract a lot of players
Minnlo
hero member
Activity: 868
Merit: 1000
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 10:26:30 AM
#23
Quote from: GannickusX on March 14, 2015, 05:14:27 AM
I thought there were casinos with 0% house edge around here, correct me if im wrong

AFAIK there are at least 2 games with 0% house edge, the PvP on Primedice and the PvP raffle game on Peerbet. The downside is that there are not many players and it is hard for you to find a good match.
Minnlo
hero member
Activity: 868
Merit: 1000
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 10:18:32 AM
#22
Quote from: waterpile on March 14, 2015, 12:46:41 AM
Quote from: ABCbits on March 14, 2015, 12:43:43 AM
Quote from: MichaelSicili on March 14, 2015, 12:05:33 AM
Quote from: alani123 on March 13, 2015, 10:43:24 PM
moneypot.com

primedice.com

satoshidice.com

luckyb.it

Just-dice.com

they're all provably fair, but their house edge varies from 0.5% to 1.9%. The house always wins anyway.

which one the most little house edge?
house edge take effect on our game?

Primedice have 0.9% house edge
And lucky.bit have about 1% house edge

If you need dice site with low house edge, then try SafeDice
They only have 0.5% House edge

Correct me if im wrong but I think luckyb.ithas no house edge coz its not a dice site, its a plinko..

Primedice has a house edge of 1%. When PD3 was released, it came with a jackpot feature making the house edge 0.91%. But the feature has been removed now.

LB has a house edge of roughly 1.66% - 1.76%, depending on which line you are playing.
GannickusX
hero member
Activity: 490
Merit: 500
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 05:14:27 AM
#21
I thought there were casinos with 0% house edge around here, correct me if im wrong
boopy265420
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Activity: 1876
Merit: 1005
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 03:07:25 AM
#20
Quote from: fox19891989 on March 14, 2015, 01:48:38 AM
dadice(click my signature link to register Wink Cheesy)
Primedice
justdice
fortunejack


About Provably fair conception. I have my explanation, but this one is better than mine, so I just show you this passage.

http://dicesites.com/provably-fair

What is "provably fair"?
Players always fear to be cheated on an online casino. This is understandable because it is technically very easy for an online casino to just make you lose. In the Bitcoin gambling community we have a solution for this called "provably fair". Provably fair is a tool that enables you (the player) to verify each roll result and make sure you are not being cheated!

The easy way is to just use our provably fair verifiers, fill in the information the website is providing you and check the roll results.
Well explained the meaning of word '' provably fair ''. So players can play there without any worry or doubt as these are pf.
fox19891989
hero member
Activity: 840
Merit: 1000
Re: Provably fair gambling sites
March 14, 2015, 01:48:38 AM
#19
dadice(click my signature link to register Wink Cheesy)
Primedice
justdice
fortunejack


About Provably fair conception. I have my explanation, but this one is better than mine, so I just show you this passage.

http://dicesites.com/provably-fair

What is "provably fair"?
Players always fear to be cheated on an online casino. This is understandable because it is technically very easy for an online casino to just make you lose. In the Bitcoin gambling community we have a solution for this called "provably fair". Provably fair is a tool that enables you (the player) to verify each roll result and make sure you are not being cheated!

The easy way is to just use our provably fair verifiers, fill in the information the website is providing you and check the roll results.
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