I chose to divide this post in two because some people might feel unmotivated to read big texts and for organization matters.
Ok, so knowing we must excel as there are no half measures for us (it's all or nothing), we need to work hard.
I believe the first thing we must do is analyse all other coins and get all their good and useful features. Some might argue "we wouldn't be original by doing that". Hell, competition is at its finest and we must not lose. We must reach their point first.
Other thing we must do, not in order (whatever happens first is ok, don't wait for one another), is to not only be equal to other coins but be better than them. Create features they do not have. Qora went ahead and made the first asset/asset coin. This is unique as far as I know. We need more of these
We need to have non-leecher and motivated stakeholders. Every stakeholder should know you are not holding shares in a company. In a company there are people being paid to make your stock price rise. A lot. No such thing here. You're your own boss and employee. Qora NEEDS you. Anything at all you do to improve Qora will be useful. Please do not stand still watching other people do the job alone as they will feel unmotivated and stop working. Most importantly, Qora will be missing your effort.
I cannot tell you what to do with your private property but if you are a leecher and expect Qora or other people to do all work please consider selling your coins now at a profit. Both of us will be happier.
I'm far from being rich but I donated 1/3 of all my Qora. That's more than 8 BTC or 40m qora. I already sent them to Qora and Pondsea and soon you'll have more information regarding bounties. I gave a lot of thought before and after doing so. Sometimes I thought if I was going to be stupid to throw so much money on this. Just FYI that's more than 2 months sallary for me. I know that by doing so my other 2/3 will be more valuable, and I plan to buy more Qora should the opportunity arise again. I wish I could donate more, but unfortunately I cannot. Luckly there are other 9.960 billion coin to be put at good use. I know and trust its holders to make it happen.
I want this coin to succeed. Qora once said this may become his sole job on chat. It's clear he's a very busy man and having him solely working on this would be wonderful. This won't happen if we don't succeed and Qora doesn't reach a much higher market cap.
We must create a flawless, stable and beautiful wallet. Easy to use for the masses. Not even Bitcoin is easy enough for the masses yet.
We need a beautiful and very useful website.
We need a dedicated and motivated community.
We need brainstorm. A lot of it.
We need ideas.
We need developers.
We need bounties and donations
We need to bring in new useful people (we can start with other coins' developers and collaborators)
We need to have unique features
We need to get all other coins' features
We need to market heavily and get Qora to actually be used/transacted on websites, stores etc (this is highly important)
In short, this is it. It's really late and here am I talking so much. I wish I could say so much more. I want this coin to succeed and I believe it can. That's up to us. Each and every one of us.
Topic: Qora | 100% POS | Assets | Names | Voting | Open Source - page 53. (Read 113804 times)
This is how I view things. Excuse me for not being a native english speaker.
As Qora wrote, this project isn't just meant to survive. We need to excel and thrive. I had been watching Qora for awhile and found a good oportunity to start buying coins when the price started to drop. What mainly attracted me to this coin was its founder. Not to flatter someone, but he's honest, highly intelligent coder, doesn't want to pump/talk out of his mouth and is rather concerned on working than talking nonsense. In fact he does so much and talks so little I - like many other people, most likely - have even though that he is a bad communicator. He is not.
I really like cryptocurrency. I see it as an opportunity to change the world and provide freedom to many people. I am interested on everything possible to improve myself and the world I live, because I know if I improve the world I'll benefit from it too. So I like to think I am very altruist due to selfish reasons.
There are many cryptocurrencies as of now. Some of them seem really nice and cool. It's hard to decide which one to pick. I chose Qora because I believe it's undervalued. At the time I started buying it was priced at 1/100 of another good java based coin that I believe Qora has potential to be better.
Truth of the matter is: I and anyone else who dared to purchase is taking a high risk. It might be priced at nothing next month. Governments worldwide might crackdown on cryptocurrencies and many other things may happen. The biggest risk I believe we face is improving slowly or to become satisfied. It's a highly competitive market and unfortunately some coins are way ahead of us.
Bitcoin has a huge network effect that we can't compare to us. Nxt has a bigger network effect and more features. There are other coins too but I won't make a list as I don't think it's necessary. It will not be easy for us to excel. We need to put that in mind. The way I see it is we either become really rich or we lose nearly everything because I don't think Qora will be hanging stable at an "average" price. Seems it's all or nothing.
As of now Qora is priced at less than 1 million dolllar. Once it was priced at 6 million dollar and also at 150 thousand dollar once. We have Bitcoin being priced at 5 billion dollar. 5 billion. That's more than 5000 times what we are priced at. What does Bitcoin have that we do not? We can achieve everything it has and beyond! We are at a fragile position whereas in 2 years nobody will remember Qora's name or 100 million people will know what it stands for. In order for the latter to happen we must work hard. It will not be easy.
As Qora wrote, this project isn't just meant to survive. We need to excel and thrive. I had been watching Qora for awhile and found a good oportunity to start buying coins when the price started to drop. What mainly attracted me to this coin was its founder. Not to flatter someone, but he's honest, highly intelligent coder, doesn't want to pump/talk out of his mouth and is rather concerned on working than talking nonsense. In fact he does so much and talks so little I - like many other people, most likely - have even though that he is a bad communicator. He is not.
I really like cryptocurrency. I see it as an opportunity to change the world and provide freedom to many people. I am interested on everything possible to improve myself and the world I live, because I know if I improve the world I'll benefit from it too. So I like to think I am very altruist due to selfish reasons.
There are many cryptocurrencies as of now. Some of them seem really nice and cool. It's hard to decide which one to pick. I chose Qora because I believe it's undervalued. At the time I started buying it was priced at 1/100 of another good java based coin that I believe Qora has potential to be better.
Truth of the matter is: I and anyone else who dared to purchase is taking a high risk. It might be priced at nothing next month. Governments worldwide might crackdown on cryptocurrencies and many other things may happen. The biggest risk I believe we face is improving slowly or to become satisfied. It's a highly competitive market and unfortunately some coins are way ahead of us.
Bitcoin has a huge network effect that we can't compare to us. Nxt has a bigger network effect and more features. There are other coins too but I won't make a list as I don't think it's necessary. It will not be easy for us to excel. We need to put that in mind. The way I see it is we either become really rich or we lose nearly everything because I don't think Qora will be hanging stable at an "average" price. Seems it's all or nothing.
As of now Qora is priced at less than 1 million dolllar. Once it was priced at 6 million dollar and also at 150 thousand dollar once. We have Bitcoin being priced at 5 billion dollar. 5 billion. That's more than 5000 times what we are priced at. What does Bitcoin have that we do not? We can achieve everything it has and beyond! We are at a fragile position whereas in 2 years nobody will remember Qora's name or 100 million people will know what it stands for. In order for the latter to happen we must work hard. It will not be easy.
We want to introduce you to our service ( nxtex.net ) of direct exchange NXT to another currencies. We work since April 2014. Our service provides an opportunity to buy or sell NXTs for RUR, USD, FIMK, NHZ, Qora, but also for any other currencies you may have an interest to trade in. Our service is an intermediary between buyers and sellers of NXT (like localbitcoin). To make an exchange, you need to generate a valid NXT-token for the website nxtex.net.
Yesterday was first order with Qora: show
Let's try to trade!
Qora: QR3vGneuFk7ewma9GQdnb2sp6uqN9YmnZ8
Yesterday was first order with Qora: show
Let's try to trade!
Qora: QR3vGneuFk7ewma9GQdnb2sp6uqN9YmnZ8
Volume is too low so far to buy Qora (or any coin really). Side note, if volume increases, can I buy Qora with paypal?
Let the dumpers, dump. I was about to tell "Mr. Whale" that the surge from the release of the source is subsiding.
He's gatheres near 40m @ 20 sats. I think he could move his wall to 18 and pick up more.
These people would dump, regardless, because they were looking to profit from the way. However, it looks like a smarter-than-average whale is buyin in by continuously postin mini-buy walls.
If dumpers want to dump, I say don't give them more than you have to, and let the price ease as far south as 14-15 sats. That is still far better than a month ago.
agreed, the lower price we can get is better for us , He's gatheres near 40m @ 20 sats. I think he could move his wall to 18 and pick up more.
These people would dump, regardless, because they were looking to profit from the way. However, it looks like a smarter-than-average whale is buyin in by continuously postin mini-buy walls.
If dumpers want to dump, I say don't give them more than you have to, and let the price ease as far south as 14-15 sats. That is still far better than a month ago.
we will hold on and buy more, 100 sat is the small goal.
Qora can go as high as 500 satoshi, top 3 in market cap. For many reasons.
Several of us have had issues with Qora withdrawals from Poloniex in the past few weeks. Today after attempting again to withdraw my funds, they re-sent one small withdrawal and it was received. However, the transaction was never confirmed and still shows 0 confirmations. All transactions (from others) after this one have been confirmed without issue.
Does this mean Poloniex is on a fork?
Update 12/13 : After around 200 confirms on transactions past the Poloniex transfer, it has now been removed from my wallet.
Check out the sending address ... http://qora.co.in/?q=QPVknSmwDryB98Hh8xB7E6U75dGFYwNkJ4
Somethings not right at Poloniex. They are silent as far as I know. I've asked about this for weeks and no one has an answer, hell no one's even offered an answer other than they'll look into it or someone else will look into it.
In chat today OldMan said they'd have it fixed tonight. We shall see.
Does this mean Poloniex is on a fork?
Update 12/13 : After around 200 confirms on transactions past the Poloniex transfer, it has now been removed from my wallet.
Check out the sending address ... http://qora.co.in/?q=QPVknSmwDryB98Hh8xB7E6U75dGFYwNkJ4
Somethings not right at Poloniex. They are silent as far as I know. I've asked about this for weeks and no one has an answer, hell no one's even offered an answer other than they'll look into it or someone else will look into it.
In chat today OldMan said they'd have it fixed tonight. We shall see.
India thread: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/qora-100-pos-assets-names-voting-open-source-889021
Please update op with this info
It's in english because they mostly write english. If you want, can and find necessary you may create a hindi language one.
Please update op with this info
It's in english because they mostly write english. If you want, can and find necessary you may create a hindi language one.
If we can hover around 15, I hope/speculate that an AT release could break through the current sell tension and push us up to around 30 sats.
I'm dubious, partly because past experience suggests that features are not what raises the price, and partly because the AT won't be a unique feature anyway.What other coin has Automated Transactions?
It's BURST, look here: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.8272935
If we can hover around 15, I hope/speculate that an AT release could break through the current sell tension and push us up to around 30 sats.
I'm dubious, partly because past experience suggests that features are not what raises the price, and partly because the AT won't be a unique feature anyway.What other coin has Automated Transactions?
Well for Qora dev it would be AT then wallet upgrades. But since it is open source anyone can help by my hiring programmers or asking friends who are programmers to get into Qora .
We need someone that can write articles to submit to news sites after AT is done (1~2 weeks)
We need someone that can write articles to submit to news sites after AT is done (1~2 weeks)
Wizzard and I think its a good idea to have 2 meetings a week on the chat, so we can have constructive talks
Well for Qora dev it would be AT then wallet upgrades. But since it is open source anyone can help by my hiring programmers or asking friends who are programmers to get into Qora .
We need someone that can write articles to submit to news sites after AT is done (1~2 weeks)
We need someone that can write articles to submit to news sites after AT is done (1~2 weeks)
So who is doing what from here? Lynxxx want tod o Marketing.. Vrontis is also doing stuff.. Where is Dzarmush? Is Agran still involved? Q
Qora DEV what is roadmap from here?
Would be nice to have a roadmap...
It would be really good if thing get more CLEAR from here.
We need a leader who will manage stuff.. If we want to go to 100 satoshi and more, we have to work, not only talk..
I agree. I think the bounties are a good start..
What does the community think?
So who is doing what from here? Lynxxx want tod o Marketing.. Vrontis is also doing stuff.. Where is Dzarmush? Is Agran still involved? Q
Qora DEV what is roadmap from here?
Would be nice to have a roadmap...
It would be really good if thing get more CLEAR from here.
We need a leader who will manage stuff.. If we want to go to 100 satoshi and more, we have to work, not only talk..
Hi! I'm curious because I am not tech enough myself to determine.. Did someone do a review of the Qora source?
Yes rlh has. He's almost certain Qora is not a Nxt clone. His review is quoted below.
Ok, here are some quick notes on Qora v. Nxt (I've looked at both sets of code a little while this evening.)
Initial Impressions
I can not rule out, beyond certainty, that this wasn't cloned but I can easily verify that if this started from a Nxt fork, a TON of work has been put in modifying the code. Qora is organized completely differently than Nxt. From the application entry point, all initialization methods execute completely differently. If Qora took Nxt, he heavily modified it beyond recognition.
Personally, I've suspected that this wasn't a clone and I've never seen any reason not to trust Qora's claims. So far, this seems to be likely true-- this is not a fork and is "new source".
Cryptography Analysis
Nxt uses SHA-256 to hash passphrases and then Curve25519 and SHA-256 again to create public/private key. It signs it's data using, EC-KCDSA.
Qora is a bit of a different beast. I'm still digging into this section of code but if my quick-scan of DB, Crypto and Account files has produced an accurate understanding, your wallet seed is a random value, stored to a secure DB. Each time a new account is generated, a nonce is appended to the the seed, and a new address is calculated and stored in the DB.
Specifically, an address account is generated by taking the Nonce+seed+Nonce value and double-SHA-256 hashing it to produce a unique account seed.
Next, a Key pair is generated using Ed25519 key pair creation, from the account seed. To be clear, Ed25519 is slightly different than Curve25519 (which is what Nxt uses.) After the Pub/Privkey pair is generated,the application takes the RIPEMD160 of the SHA-256 hash of the pub-key. NExt, Qora prepends a version byte to this hash and then double, SHA-256 hashes the byte array and finally appends the first four bytes of the new hash, to the former. These last four bytes are used as an account checksum and are used for account ID validation.
This process of a account generation is significantly different than Nxt. Obviously, Qora makes use of a wallet, where Nxt does not. Still, the process of creating a payment address is far more robust than Nxt. In fact, this process is almost-exactly how BTC addresses are created, rather than Nxt. The only variation is that the version byte is likely different (which results in the "Q" at the beginning of the address) and Ed25519 keys are used by Qora where ECDSA keys are used by BTC and it's clones.
Forging
First, let me go ahead and say that forging is something that I've never looked into deeply. I understand the very high-level nature of it and I very much understand the big differences between traditional "1.0" coins and these new PoS "2.0" coins. My notes on forging will, therefore, be very basic sense I know so little about the nuts-and-bolts. Regardless, here are my observations.
The code is significantly organized in a different manner. At first glance, I think Nxt and Qora us a completely different approach to come up with similar results. Again, Qora is more succinct than Nxt. I'll have to take a while longer to dig into this but since I can't seem to figure out how to build and debug java code through eclipse (
yeah, pretty basic stuff, I know...) I can't run the code and step through this portion to clarify what's going on. All I can verify is that Nxt vs. Qora looks completely different. Also, Qora makes use of the global "Generating Balance" to determine the block Target. From my scan of the Nxt code, no such value is used. I think there is a bit more randomness to Nxt than their might be of Qora, but I won't stand by that. Qora basically looks at the time since the last block, the forgers personal balance and the total balance of forging accounts. It then uses a fairly straight forward process to test if a block has been forged.
I haven't been able to figure out what Nxt does. This isn't because of poor Nxt coding. It's because I don't have the time to look into it. If a Nxt guru is around, please comment.
Final Thoughts
My vote is, no, this is not a clone. If Qora was inspired by Nxt, I would make the guess that he read up a lot on it, possibly read through the source and thought "I can do that" and gave it a go at writing his own application. Qora uses mostly different libraries and is structured significantly different.
I also assume that Qora is a professional day-time coder, who works with a team of devs at a software firm or possibly large company. Nxt feels like good, solid code, but it doesn't adhere to strict practices that big-team developers tend to follow since they are use to having to organize and share code with co-workers. I know that open source projects are often shared across devs, but having worked in both environments I can attest that "good" developers, in both areas of software engineering tend to have different coding approaches and styles because requirements differ. Qora feels like it's written by an experienced, professional business coder, while Nxt feels like a large, open source project.
One piece of software isn't necessarily better than the other but they look VERY different. This adds to strong evidence supporting that this is almost certainly NOT a clone.
Initial Impressions
I can not rule out, beyond certainty, that this wasn't cloned but I can easily verify that if this started from a Nxt fork, a TON of work has been put in modifying the code. Qora is organized completely differently than Nxt. From the application entry point, all initialization methods execute completely differently. If Qora took Nxt, he heavily modified it beyond recognition.
Personally, I've suspected that this wasn't a clone and I've never seen any reason not to trust Qora's claims. So far, this seems to be likely true-- this is not a fork and is "new source".
Cryptography Analysis
Nxt uses SHA-256 to hash passphrases and then Curve25519 and SHA-256 again to create public/private key. It signs it's data using, EC-KCDSA.
Qora is a bit of a different beast. I'm still digging into this section of code but if my quick-scan of DB, Crypto and Account files has produced an accurate understanding, your wallet seed is a random value, stored to a secure DB. Each time a new account is generated, a nonce is appended to the the seed, and a new address is calculated and stored in the DB.
Specifically, an address account is generated by taking the Nonce+seed+Nonce value and double-SHA-256 hashing it to produce a unique account seed.
Next, a Key pair is generated using Ed25519 key pair creation, from the account seed. To be clear, Ed25519 is slightly different than Curve25519 (which is what Nxt uses.) After the Pub/Privkey pair is generated,the application takes the RIPEMD160 of the SHA-256 hash of the pub-key. NExt, Qora prepends a version byte to this hash and then double, SHA-256 hashes the byte array and finally appends the first four bytes of the new hash, to the former. These last four bytes are used as an account checksum and are used for account ID validation.
This process of a account generation is significantly different than Nxt. Obviously, Qora makes use of a wallet, where Nxt does not. Still, the process of creating a payment address is far more robust than Nxt. In fact, this process is almost-exactly how BTC addresses are created, rather than Nxt. The only variation is that the version byte is likely different (which results in the "Q" at the beginning of the address) and Ed25519 keys are used by Qora where ECDSA keys are used by BTC and it's clones.
Forging
First, let me go ahead and say that forging is something that I've never looked into deeply. I understand the very high-level nature of it and I very much understand the big differences between traditional "1.0" coins and these new PoS "2.0" coins. My notes on forging will, therefore, be very basic sense I know so little about the nuts-and-bolts. Regardless, here are my observations.
The code is significantly organized in a different manner. At first glance, I think Nxt and Qora us a completely different approach to come up with similar results. Again, Qora is more succinct than Nxt. I'll have to take a while longer to dig into this but since I can't seem to figure out how to build and debug java code through eclipse (
yeah, pretty basic stuff, I know...) I can't run the code and step through this portion to clarify what's going on. All I can verify is that Nxt vs. Qora looks completely different. Also, Qora makes use of the global "Generating Balance" to determine the block Target. From my scan of the Nxt code, no such value is used. I think there is a bit more randomness to Nxt than their might be of Qora, but I won't stand by that. Qora basically looks at the time since the last block, the forgers personal balance and the total balance of forging accounts. It then uses a fairly straight forward process to test if a block has been forged.I haven't been able to figure out what Nxt does. This isn't because of poor Nxt coding. It's because I don't have the time to look into it. If a Nxt guru is around, please comment.
Final Thoughts
My vote is, no, this is not a clone. If Qora was inspired by Nxt, I would make the guess that he read up a lot on it, possibly read through the source and thought "I can do that" and gave it a go at writing his own application. Qora uses mostly different libraries and is structured significantly different.
I also assume that Qora is a professional day-time coder, who works with a team of devs at a software firm or possibly large company. Nxt feels like good, solid code, but it doesn't adhere to strict practices that big-team developers tend to follow since they are use to having to organize and share code with co-workers. I know that open source projects are often shared across devs, but having worked in both environments I can attest that "good" developers, in both areas of software engineering tend to have different coding approaches and styles because requirements differ. Qora feels like it's written by an experienced, professional business coder, while Nxt feels like a large, open source project.
One piece of software isn't necessarily better than the other but they look VERY different. This adds to strong evidence supporting that this is almost certainly NOT a clone.
Hi! I'm curious because I am not tech enough myself to determine.. Did someone do a review of the Qora source?
Let the dumpers, dump. I was about to tell "Mr. Whale" that the surge from the release of the source is subsiding.
He's gatheres near 40m @ 20 sats. I think he could move his wall to 18 and pick up more.
These people would dump, regardless, because they were looking to profit from the way. However, it looks like a smarter-than-average whale is buyin in by continuously postin mini-buy walls.
If dumpers want to dump, I say don't give them more than you have to, and let the price ease as far south as 14-15 sats. That is still far better than a month ago.
agreed, the lower price we can get is better for us , He's gatheres near 40m @ 20 sats. I think he could move his wall to 18 and pick up more.
These people would dump, regardless, because they were looking to profit from the way. However, it looks like a smarter-than-average whale is buyin in by continuously postin mini-buy walls.
If dumpers want to dump, I say don't give them more than you have to, and let the price ease as far south as 14-15 sats. That is still far better than a month ago.
we will hold on and buy more, 100 sat is the small goal.
Qora can go as high as 500 satoshi, top 3 in market cap. For many reasons.
+1
To gain popularity Qora needs a decent UI and an experience that works out of the box. If newcomers have problems and have to regenerate from a seed it will put some of them off. Also, the visual look of the wallet will put other newcomers off.
To gain popularity Qora needs a decent UI and an experience that works out of the box. If newcomers have problems and have to regenerate from a seed it will put some of them off. Also, the visual look of the wallet will put other newcomers off.
If we can hover around 15, I hope/speculate that an AT release could break through the current sell tension and push us up to around 30 sats.
I'm dubious, partly because past experience suggests that features are not what raises the price, and partly because the AT won't be a unique feature anyway.I think what will drive Qora's price is its longevity and what people build ontop of it. AT is just building the groundwork so people see Qora as a great platform to build on. We haven't even got a nice UI which for some is very important.
If we can hover around 15, I hope/speculate that an AT release could break through the current sell tension and push us up to around 30 sats.
I'm dubious, partly because past experience suggests that features are not what raises the price, and partly because the AT won't be a unique feature anyway. Let the dumpers, dump. I was about to tell "Mr. Whale" that the surge from the release of the source is subsiding.
He's gatheres near 40m @ 20 sats. I think he could move his wall to 18 and pick up more.
These people would dump, regardless, because they were looking to profit from the way. However, it looks like a smarter-than-average whale is buyin in by continuously postin mini-buy walls.
If dumpers want to dump, I say don't give them more than you have to, and let the price ease as far south as 14-15 sats. That is still far better than a month ago.
agreed, the lower price we can get is better for us , He's gatheres near 40m @ 20 sats. I think he could move his wall to 18 and pick up more.
These people would dump, regardless, because they were looking to profit from the way. However, it looks like a smarter-than-average whale is buyin in by continuously postin mini-buy walls.
If dumpers want to dump, I say don't give them more than you have to, and let the price ease as far south as 14-15 sats. That is still far better than a month ago.
we will hold on and buy more, 100 sat is the small goal.
IMHO, price can and should continue to trend up, so long as development takes place. This is what I hope.
However, every bit of really positive news always tends to facilitate a mini-pump and all pumps eventually deflate at least a little. We reached 25 sats really fast and, more importantly, we've kept excellent volume. For those of us who are interested in Qora, but also know how to profit from market movement, I say let it contract some so that we can push to newer heights when AT is released.
If we can hover around 15, I hope/speculate that an AT release could break through the current sell tension and push us up to around 30 sats. AT is great but it's a hard concept to grasp. If AT can get a killer implemention that shows what it's good for, I think we could really see Qora climb to unknown territory in price.
In the mean time, play smart and profit so you can increase your stake. My tiered sell-offs And buy backs have helped me increase my holdings by about 10%. Growth in price is good, but don't see the dip in price as a bad thing because the dips are where you can make your profits. Just don't get to emotional.
However, every bit of really positive news always tends to facilitate a mini-pump and all pumps eventually deflate at least a little. We reached 25 sats really fast and, more importantly, we've kept excellent volume. For those of us who are interested in Qora, but also know how to profit from market movement, I say let it contract some so that we can push to newer heights when AT is released.
If we can hover around 15, I hope/speculate that an AT release could break through the current sell tension and push us up to around 30 sats. AT is great but it's a hard concept to grasp. If AT can get a killer implemention that shows what it's good for, I think we could really see Qora climb to unknown territory in price.
In the mean time, play smart and profit so you can increase your stake. My tiered sell-offs And buy backs have helped me increase my holdings by about 10%. Growth in price is good, but don't see the dip in price as a bad thing because the dips are where you can make your profits. Just don't get to emotional.
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