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Topic: Quantum computers: possible menace to Bitcoin? - page 3. (Read 3046 times)

sr. member
Activity: 364
Merit: 253
Anyway, by the time quantum computers are available for the public, all bitcoins have already been mined...

Do you think quantum's will be ready for the next 5-15 years? no way...

Eth.

The next question would be. How would quantum computers do if they can make it next year(Economically)? Spend million bucks for a handful of BTC? And then what? One could gain BTC efficiently by buying it. Using Quantum Computers doesn't seem logical.
legendary
Activity: 2674
Merit: 2965
Terminated.
The same questions being asked over and over by newbies.
No, relax, nothing will kill bitcoin.
sr. member
Activity: 338
Merit: 255
Anyway, by the time quantum computers are available for the public, all bitcoins have already been mined...

Do you think quantum's will be ready for the next 5-15 years? no way...

Eth.
hero member
Activity: 546
Merit: 500
LOL what you looking at?
What a waste of words.

It took less than 10 seconds with a Google search engine to turn up the following:

That is not true.  Quantum Computers need an efficient quantum algorithm.  Shor's algorithm is very effective at brute forcing public key systems (RSA, DSA, ECDSA).  They don't significantly reduce the security of symmetric (AES) cryptography or hashing algorithms (SHA-256).

Hashing functions are effectively immune to the potential of quantum computing.  Shor's algorithm can not be used against hashing functions or symetric cryptography.  

To say quantum computing is "advancing rapidly" is an overstatement.  In 2001 the largest number to be factored by a general purpose quantum computer using Shor's algorithm was 15.  By 2011 the largest number to be factored was 143.   That is from 4 bits to 8 bits in the span of a decade.   We are a long way from factoring even 256 bit numbers and 256 bit ECDSA keys are even harder (~3,072 RSA key = integer factorization).  

Nobody said 256 bit encryption will be secure forever.  It is infeasible to brute force a 256 bit key using classical computing.   Quantum computing may someday break it but it may not, quantum decoherence is a bitch.  It is possible ECDSA has some flaw and cryptanalysis will someday weakened it to a point it is economical to attack it.  That could be next year or not in the next century.  

Did you put any effort at all into figuring out if your FUD had any merit before you came running to the forum to declare a "menace" that has already been discussed dozens of times over the past 5 years?

Cool down, kid.
I didn't declare anything, you may have missed the question mark in the very title.
You want to say I don't know stuff: that's right.
You want to say I didn't search: that's right too. I wrote I didn't imagine somebody thought about this already. My fault.
But forums are here to spread info, also.
Now if you are annoyed of spreading info, just don't do it.
hero member
Activity: 546
Merit: 500
LOL what you looking at?
This has been addressed a number of times.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/quantum-computers-and-bitcoin-133425

As I understand, if the threat ever emerged, the devs would have enough time to hard-fork to SHA512d as the hashing algo in a worst-case scenario.  Hashing itself isn't effected, but the infrastructure supporting the network could be.  The quantum CPU would also have to have enough scalable RAM to perform the computations necessary to bruteforce the entire network, the tech for which is 50+ years away.  Plus the cost would become insurmountable, especially once mining chips reach the 10nm architectures and beyond, which is expected to happen in the next decade.

So no, not really a threat AKAIK.

Doh I didn't expect somebody would have thinked of this already, sorry  Lips sealed

But I can't understand one thing: you hard fork to SHA512 and difficulty increases for everybody, where's the solution?

Thanks for the link, I'll read that.
legendary
Activity: 3472
Merit: 4801
What a waste of words.

It took less than 10 seconds with a Google search engine to turn up the following:

That is not true.  Quantum Computers need an efficient quantum algorithm.  Shor's algorithm is very effective at brute forcing public key systems (RSA, DSA, ECDSA).  They don't significantly reduce the security of symmetric (AES) cryptography or hashing algorithms (SHA-256).

Hashing functions are effectively immune to the potential of quantum computing.  Shor's algorithm can not be used against hashing functions or symetric cryptography.  

To say quantum computing is "advancing rapidly" is an overstatement.  In 2001 the largest number to be factored by a general purpose quantum computer using Shor's algorithm was 15.  By 2011 the largest number to be factored was 143.   That is from 4 bits to 8 bits in the span of a decade.   We are a long way from factoring even 256 bit numbers and 256 bit ECDSA keys are even harder (~3,072 RSA key = integer factorization).  

Nobody said 256 bit encryption will be secure forever.  It is infeasible to brute force a 256 bit key using classical computing.   Quantum computing may someday break it but it may not, quantum decoherence is a bitch.  It is possible ECDSA has some flaw and cryptanalysis will someday weakened it to a point it is economical to attack it.  That could be next year or not in the next century.  

Did you put any effort at all into figuring out if your FUD had any merit before you came running to the forum to declare a "menace" that has already been discussed dozens of times over the past 5 years?
hero member
Activity: 938
Merit: 502
This has been addressed a number of times.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/quantum-computers-and-bitcoin-133425

As I understand, if the threat ever emerged, the devs would have enough time to hard-fork to SHA512d as the hashing algo in a worst-case scenario.  Hashing itself isn't effected, but the infrastructure supporting the network could be.  The quantum CPU would also have to have enough scalable RAM to perform the computations necessary to bruteforce the entire network, the tech for which is 50+ years away.  Plus the cost would become insurmountable, especially once mining chips reach the 10nm architectures and beyond, which is expected to happen in the next decade.

So no, not really a threat AKAIK.
hero member
Activity: 546
Merit: 500
LOL what you looking at?
Imagine somebody buys one of these and turn it on mining.

This would bring the next increase in difficulty to hell, so much that the cost for mining would disrupt any income for anybody.
Nobody would mine anymore, apart maybe the owner of the quantum cpu.
That brings us straight into the 51% danger, right?

A quantum cpu may not be economically cunning AT THE MOMENT, but when the Bitcoin value will grow, the cost of a quantum cpu could be well worth the cost.
Or imagine a central bank that wants to destroy Bitcoin: just buy one of these and fuck up everything in one week.
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