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Topic: Referral bonuses are waste of time - page 38. (Read 8057 times)

legendary
Activity: 2240
Merit: 1993
A Bitcoiner chooses. A slave obeys.
May 10, 2023, 12:30:52 PM
I tried not to write in this thread. But I can't stop myself from writing some words!

This is a bullshit topic. What did we get from this topic? Do we need to discuss whether a referral bonus is a waste? Everyone is free to work for their referral. Big companies are working with just Referral income. What is the point of this thread? The title triggered a lot of people, and we saw useless signature spam replies. The discussion is still going. What new answers have we got? Pretty much the same responses from everyone. I suggest OP lock this thread.
The dude stated his mind and what he thinks about referral bonuses, don't call it bullshit, because when ever you create a thread, you do So on the emphasis of what you think concerning the topic you are or want to discuss, and can I tell you something?, not everyone will like your topic or subject of discussion, but that does not really mean  it's bullshit.

Would have been better if you held yourself from writing here, the report button is there, would have been better if you used it rather than say what you say here, I am a believer of, "if you have nothing good to say or contribute to someone else's efforts, ignore and keep quiet".

By the way, if you think comments from other users are useless signature spam replies, what exactly do you think yours is? It's an honest question.

Ironically, his entire rant about "useless signature spam replies" is a useless signature spam reply in itself. So I am guessing he had nothing to add to the discussion so he decided to write something unhelpful and toxic. Whether his bounty manager thinks that that is a pay-worthy post is questionable...

Just because not everyone is a genius who knows how to maximize their profits with referral bonuses does not mean that the entire topic is not worth talking about in the first place...

I think referrals are important to talk about. The discussion could help someone with a low income earn more money. Or they could learn something new. Its obviously not a waste of time, as the previous poster claims... Roll Eyes
legendary
Activity: 2422
Merit: 1083
Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform
May 10, 2023, 12:12:50 PM
I tried not to write in this thread. But I can't stop myself from writing some words!

This is a bullshit topic. What did we get from this topic? Do we need to discuss whether a referral bonus is a waste? Everyone is free to work for their referral. Big companies are working with just Referral income. What is the point of this thread? The title triggered a lot of people, and we saw useless signature spam replies. The discussion is still going. What new answers have we got? Pretty much the same responses from everyone. I suggest OP lock this thread.
The dude stated his mind and what he thinks about referral bonuses, don't call it bullshit, because when ever you create a thread, you do So on the emphasis of what you think concerning the topic you are or want to discuss, and can I tell you something?, not everyone will like your topic or subject of discussion, but that does not really mean  it's bullshit.

Would have been better if you held yourself from writing here, the report button is there, would have been better if you used it rather than say what you say here, I am a believer of, "if you have nothing good to say or contribute to someone else's efforts, ignore and keep quiet".

By the way, if you think comments from other users are useless signature spam replies, what exactly do you think yours is? It's an honest question.
legendary
Activity: 3500
Merit: 1354
May 10, 2023, 11:58:35 AM
I didn't say it was impossible to do, but indeed finding and getting active playing referrals is definitely not an easy thing at all like I said before. I'm clearly not confident about this, and as I said earlier it's better for me not to do it, because it would be disappointing for me to expect too much of the bonuses offered if there are gamblers who register and play using the references we share.
And also I see that this is not a despair, because indeed I see what is happening in the field.

This is the one you should remove from your mindset, do not expect too much no matter you are an influencer or not.
I do believe that influencers are also not expecting too much from referral program because there is no guarantee.
We will never know if we never try it and there is nothing wrong to try it since it does not cost you anything as what you need to do is just to share your referral link.
Who knows if you will be lucky enough to get a huge whale without hard effort? 

hero member
Activity: 1708
Merit: 566
Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform
May 10, 2023, 11:06:24 AM
Referral bonuses aren't really meant to give you a steady stream of income. It's called a bonus for a reason, because that is something you'll only get because the casino offers it. If you're someone who has a huge following and has command over a large group of people, your influence could easily make you some money. Then again, whatever income stream you'll get from this is highly dependent on your referrals. They might register under your link, but the choice of them actually depositing on that account is still entirely up to them. You can persuade them by introducing complementary deposit bonuses, but it will only appeal to those who are really into gambling and not the casuals.
That is the reason why I prefer not to touch at all the bonuses offered by casinos regarding referral bonuses, because that is not an easy task at all. Moreover, I am an ordinary person who doesn't have many followers on social media, and also offering it to our close friends is not a solution at all. Referral bonuses can be made by people who are trusted and have many followers, which we often refer to as influencers. For an influencer it might be easier compared to us.
You don't need to be an influecer to be able to get referrals unless you are too lazy since it obviously requires more work if you don't already have a large circle of people that you can refer to a specific platform to earn commission when they make deposits or maybe do some wagering, it is difficult but it is not impossible.

Finding and gaining active referrals is definitely a challenge and it is even a challenge for someone who has a lot of followers since most people who sign up under you will basically never use their account or just don't make any deposits.
I didn't say it was impossible to do, but indeed finding and getting active playing referrals is definitely not an easy thing at all like I said before. I'm clearly not confident about this, and as I said earlier it's better for me not to do it, because it would be disappointing for me to expect too much of the bonuses offered if there are gamblers who register and play using the references we share.
And also I see that this is not a despair, because indeed I see what is happening in the field.
sr. member
Activity: 2660
Merit: 339
May 09, 2023, 10:30:04 AM
Referral bonuses aren't really meant to give you a steady stream of income. It's called a bonus for a reason, because that is something you'll only get because the casino offers it. If you're someone who has a huge following and has command over a large group of people, your influence could easily make you some money. Then again, whatever income stream you'll get from this is highly dependent on your referrals. They might register under your link, but the choice of them actually depositing on that account is still entirely up to them. You can persuade them by introducing complementary deposit bonuses, but it will only appeal to those who are really into gambling and not the casuals.
That is the reason why I prefer not to touch at all the bonuses offered by casinos regarding referral bonuses, because that is not an easy task at all. Moreover, I am an ordinary person who doesn't have many followers on social media, and also offering it to our close friends is not a solution at all. Referral bonuses can be made by people who are trusted and have many followers, which we often refer to as influencers. For an influencer it might be easier compared to us.
You don't need to be an influecer to be able to get referrals unless you are too lazy since it obviously requires more work if you don't already have a large circle of people that you can refer to a specific platform to earn commission when they make deposits or maybe do some wagering, it is difficult but it is not impossible.

Finding and gaining active referrals is definitely a challenge and it is even a challenge for someone who has a lot of followers since most people who sign up under you will basically never use their account or just don't make any deposits.
legendary
Activity: 1708
Merit: 1280
Top Crypto Casino
May 08, 2023, 06:16:32 PM
Referral bonuses aren't really meant to give you a steady stream of income. It's called a bonus for a reason, because that is something you'll only get because the casino offers it. If you're someone who has a huge following and has command over a large group of people, your influence could easily make you some money. Then again, whatever income stream you'll get from this is highly dependent on your referrals. They might register under your link, but the choice of them actually depositing on that account is still entirely up to them. You can persuade them by introducing complementary deposit bonuses, but it will only appeal to those who are really into gambling and not the casuals.

Referral system is part of their marketing strategy to gain more number of players for their platform and yeah it's a fact that this could be not a possible source of income for daily. or monthly basis unless you are a known person on different social media platforms that could promote those rewards of the casino. If you are just a regular gambler with few friends or already invited friends this comes to your referral now becomes limited unless the referral system you got is base on their deposit and not as a one-time reward.
member
Activity: 812
Merit: 13
Crypto bookmaker and casino
May 08, 2023, 05:41:21 PM
I tried not to write in this thread. But I can't stop myself from writing some words!

This is a bullshit topic. What did we get from this topic? Do we need to discuss whether a referral bonus is a waste? Everyone is free to work for their referral. Big companies are working with just Referral income. What is the point of this thread? The title triggered a lot of people, and we saw useless signature spam replies. The discussion is still going. What new answers have we got? Pretty much the same responses from everyone. I suggest OP lock this thread.
If you don't like this topic or you find it offensive, you can kindly take yourself to other posts and complete your daily posts. You don't have to come here and write whatever things you like because you don't like the topic. You can also create your own topic that you may find interesting for us to see how relevant you may be here. Bring something new to us and  we shall embrace it.
hero member
Activity: 462
Merit: 767
Instant cryptocurrency exchange with own reserves!
May 08, 2023, 12:32:47 PM
I tried not to write in this thread. But I can't stop myself from writing some words!

This is a bullshit topic. What did we get from this topic? Do we need to discuss whether a referral bonus is a waste? Everyone is free to work for their referral. Big companies are working with just Referral income. What is the point of this thread? The title triggered a lot of people, and we saw useless signature spam replies. The discussion is still going. What new answers have we got? Pretty much the same responses from everyone. I suggest OP lock this thread.
hero member
Activity: 1708
Merit: 566
Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform
May 08, 2023, 12:27:19 PM
Referral bonuses aren't really meant to give you a steady stream of income. It's called a bonus for a reason, because that is something you'll only get because the casino offers it. If you're someone who has a huge following and has command over a large group of people, your influence could easily make you some money. Then again, whatever income stream you'll get from this is highly dependent on your referrals. They might register under your link, but the choice of them actually depositing on that account is still entirely up to them. You can persuade them by introducing complementary deposit bonuses, but it will only appeal to those who are really into gambling and not the casuals.
That is the reason why I prefer not to touch at all the bonuses offered by casinos regarding referral bonuses, because that is not an easy task at all. Moreover, I am an ordinary person who doesn't have many followers on social media, and also offering it to our close friends is not a solution at all. Referral bonuses can be made by people who are trusted and have many followers, which we often refer to as influencers. For an influencer it might be easier compared to us.
sr. member
Activity: 602
Merit: 442
I buy all valid country Gift cards swiftly.
May 08, 2023, 02:14:58 AM
In my opinion, I think referral bonuses are typically waste of one's time because of its processes that seems so impossible to claim and recently I came across a thread
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/looking-for-paying-online-casinos-for-refer-5437603 seeking for Casinos with paid referral bonuses and I tool out time to read most of the responses there and they all seem impossible to claim referral bonuses.
I wish to know if anyone has successfully claimed referral bonuses and how easy was the process and what Casino did you claim those bonuses
I think you must be using the wrong gambling sites or expecting too much from the reward of referring someone if this is how you're feeling. Refer a friend schemes on a low level are reasonably generous, mainly because word of mouth and a referral by a trusted friend is probably more likely to convert into a decent paying customer. However when you're looking more towards affiliate programs and mass referring users from different sources, then you may struggle to find decent payouts. Simply because you are competing directly with the advertising programs that casinos are already running, it can be hard to find a good stream of quality paying signups and that's all that casinos are interested in extracting from referrals.
Or maybe he is referring the wrong people? Those people who don't have an interest in gambling even at a tiny percent. He won't obviously get anything from them. Our friend might be trusted but it does not mean that they will now play gambling. Trusted people are usually kind and don't have bad habits such as gambling but each of us do always have that friend who are the opposite of the nice friend.

This is the one that we must encourage because for sure they will easily sign up on the link that we have given and they will also beg for guidance. I think there are still places where the casino didn't reached in terms of marketing and we might be the first to promote our links there. We must only pray or hope that we can gather active players for us to earn decent income thru referrals.
Yeah you guys are right and moat times I think out friends makes this things more difficult  for us than mere strangers as it us always very difficult to convince a close one than convincing total stranger. After a recent  incidence at home when both of my cousins came visiting, I tried talking to them about using my referral links but my cousin bro never gave a positive consent to it but my cousin sister who I never expected was fully interested  but she only was interested  in making a $5 deposit when converted from my local currency.

I've also been on the opinion  that for one to enjoy referral bonuses, one must have a huge community and that person doesn't necessarily  need to be a gambler but since there is already a very large community  ready to listen  to him, then there are greater chances of making decent earnings from referral bonuses.
sr. member
Activity: 1008
Merit: 262
Vave.com - Crypto Casino
May 04, 2023, 06:07:54 PM
And even for someone with millions of followers it is not going to be easy to keep any kind of stable income out of referrals, and this is because regardless of how many people they can actually convince to follow their link, register at the casino and make a deposit, then what? They do not have more followers to try to convince to join a gambling platform, and the people they convince to try that casino will stop gambling there at some point, so no matter how much you think about it the amount of money you can get out of referrals is limited and it will not last for a long time.

I don't think that's a big deal for these people who are on the tier of "stardom" status already.

For someone that has lots of referrals, it's obvious that they were already aware that most of their referrals won't give them a long-term incentive. It's known right from the very start. That's why the goal is to just market and spread their link no matter what.

Besides, it's not that they are relying much on incentives. Honestly, it's just an added bonus to their usual gambling funds.

More referrals, more incentives, and no need to fully push their own pocket at risk. If no incentives came, not a big deal too since they will just continue their usual gambling activity but now using more of their own funds at risk.
Getting incentives from referrals is as good and impressive as betting without having to fund your account. Those that know how to pave ways for themselves will not bother of what other gamblers who think they can achieve the same results by just pasting the link anywhere they think will have some people clicking on it.

 There are people that are very good at getting referrals becau6they knownhaie to play there game very well. We don't need to depend on that especially for us that enjoys playing bets without going through some rigorous process that could earn them some bonuses. Everyone with different perspectives of what they like doing and what they don't care about.
legendary
Activity: 2590
Merit: 1882
Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform
May 04, 2023, 04:53:34 PM
-snip-
It's not easy to attract whales and it's just the luck factor that can help us to have whales join through our affiliate link. But it's best if those who spread the affiliate link don't take it too seriously and just keep trying to spread the link to many sites because maybe among those people, there are whales that join later. If so, it's like hitting the jackpot in gambling because as whales, they can play with a lot of money, which means we can get a little commission from them. This is where we must try to provide honest reviews for everyone so that they want to join voluntarily and not for other reasons.
If you want whales to be able to voluntarily join using the referrals we provide, then you have to be with a big and trusted casino.
If we only rely on honest reviews but we promote casinos that are still said to be small and new on the way to eligibility then it is impossible for whales to join voluntarily without any reason.
Whales gamble using large amounts of money, so the thing that Pope prioritizes the most is a large, trusted casino with a good reputation so that the money he deposits for betting can get a guarantee of security.
After all I'm sure the whales already have casinos that they rely on and trust i so to get whales when doing affiliate is quite difficult and almost impossible.
Using big and trusted casinos to spread referral links is recommended because it will make whales believe we are in the right casino. Providing honest reviews and maybe also live videos while we are playing will provide an understanding to the people who see that we are trying to be honest in providing information. Even though they haven't joined us yet, at least they have gotten some information from us. And it is true that the whales must have had their own favorite casino where they used to gamble.
Yes, because I myself believe and believe that to be able to gain the trust of whales so that they want to use our referrals is not as easy as they say because I have also tried it, let alone whales, even to be able to get ordinary gamblers is quite difficult.
If we can't seem to be able to affiliate by sharing referrals so we can claim referral bonuses, it's better to learn first and gain more experience in gambling so that at least we can take advantage of the loopholes that exist to get gamblers who want to use our referrals.
There are lots of affiliates out there and we can learn a lot from them from small things to success.

When it comes to doing this type of work it is something very delicate, because mainly a whale knows these sites, even before us, it is very Difficult for them not to realize that the site exists, however if we have friends who they are whales because it is a way to win, although I would say that it is often very difficult to get this type of facility to be Able to do something, I personally consider it the most difficult job to do, but when I think about the Possibilities that exist winning in casinos,this becomes a win-win.
legendary
Activity: 2548
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Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform
May 04, 2023, 04:34:30 PM
Referral bonuses aren't really meant to give you a steady stream of income. It's called a bonus for a reason, because that is something you'll only get because the casino offers it. If you're someone who has a huge following and has command over a large group of people, your influence could easily make you some money. Then again, whatever income stream you'll get from this is highly dependent on your referrals. They might register under your link, but the choice of them actually depositing on that account is still entirely up to them. You can persuade them by introducing complementary deposit bonuses, but it will only appeal to those who are really into gambling and not the casuals.

Yes, referral bonuses are not meant to give us a steady income. in fact, every casino provides options for those gamblers who are interested in becoming affiliated. specifically, someone who has a large following. that means, not all gamblers can take advantage of the referral feature to generate profitable income. at least as you said, someone who has a lot of followers either on social media, or on other platforms can take the opportunity or be affiliated to bring additional profits. even then, a technique or method is needed to invite attraction so that many of them register from the referrals we have.

Related to the profit problem is another matter, at least someone who is serious about making a profit from referrals must have lots of ideas so that the people who register on our referrals continue to grow. Well, actually there are many ways, we can even imitate creator content on social networks or maybe YouTube as material for finding ideas. but the point is, it takes real intention. plus, willing to work hard so that what we plan goes according to plan. related to profit issues is another matter, because the most important thing is the process. if no interest at all, then as the title in this thread, it would be a waste of time.
legendary
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May 04, 2023, 03:53:47 PM
And even for someone with millions of followers it is not going to be easy to keep any kind of stable income out of referrals, and this is because regardless of how many people they can actually convince to follow their link, register at the casino and make a deposit, then what? They do not have more followers to try to convince to join a gambling platform, and the people they convince to try that casino will stop gambling there at some point, so no matter how much you think about it the amount of money you can get out of referrals is limited and it will not last for a long time.

I don't think that's a big deal for these people who are on the tier of "stardom" status already.

For someone that has lots of referrals, it's obvious that they were already aware that most of their referrals won't give them a long-term incentive. It's known right from the very start. That's why the goal is to just market and spread their link no matter what.

Besides, it's not that they are relying much on incentives. Honestly, it's just an added bonus to their usual gambling funds.

More referrals, more incentives, and no need to fully push their own pocket at risk. If no incentives came, not a big deal too since they will just continue their usual gambling activity but now using more of their own funds at risk.
sr. member
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May 04, 2023, 03:52:07 PM
Referral bonuses aren't really meant to give you a steady stream of income. It's called a bonus for a reason, because that is something you'll only get because the casino offers it. If you're someone who has a huge following and has command over a large group of people, your influence could easily make you some money. Then again, whatever income stream you'll get from this is highly dependent on your referrals. They might register under your link, but the choice of them actually depositing on that account is still entirely up to them. You can persuade them by introducing complementary deposit bonuses, but it will only appeal to those who are really into gambling and not the casuals.
And even for someone with millions of followers it is not going to be easy to keep any kind of stable income out of referrals, and this is because regardless of how many people they can actually convince to follow their link, register at the casino and make a deposit, then what? They do not have more followers to try to convince to join a gambling platform, and the people they convince to try that casino will stop gambling there at some point, so no matter how much you think about it the amount of money you can get out of referrals is limited and it will not last for a long time.
It's not certain, but when someone gets a referral for a heavy gambler with big money. it can be an advantage for the referral owner.
it probably won't be a consistent source. because more of these kinds of profit givers are new casinos and are looking for a lot of users. whereas those who are trying their luck with a new casino are not going to put large sums of money in. Most are only after the bonuses given. and then they will return to their favorite casino.
hero member
Activity: 2884
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I am terrible at Fantasy Football!!!
May 04, 2023, 03:33:02 PM
Referral bonuses aren't really meant to give you a steady stream of income. It's called a bonus for a reason, because that is something you'll only get because the casino offers it. If you're someone who has a huge following and has command over a large group of people, your influence could easily make you some money. Then again, whatever income stream you'll get from this is highly dependent on your referrals. They might register under your link, but the choice of them actually depositing on that account is still entirely up to them. You can persuade them by introducing complementary deposit bonuses, but it will only appeal to those who are really into gambling and not the casuals.
And even for someone with millions of followers it is not going to be easy to keep any kind of stable income out of referrals, and this is because regardless of how many people they can actually convince to follow their link, register at the casino and make a deposit, then what? They do not have more followers to try to convince to join a gambling platform, and the people they convince to try that casino will stop gambling there at some point, so no matter how much you think about it the amount of money you can get out of referrals is limited and it will not last for a long time.
legendary
Activity: 2464
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Bitcoin Trader
May 04, 2023, 05:24:58 AM
Referral bonuses aren't really meant to give you a steady stream of income. It's called a bonus for a reason, because that is something you'll only get because the casino offers it. If you're someone who has a huge following and has command over a large group of people, your influence could easily make you some money. Then again, whatever income stream you'll get from this is highly dependent on your referrals. They might register under your link, but the choice of them actually depositing on that account is still entirely up to them. You can persuade them by introducing complementary deposit bonuses, but it will only appeal to those who are really into gambling and not the casuals.
yes, maybe because to get maximum results every referral must be taught how to play and make a deposit, because if they register but don't do anything, well of course the work will only be a waste of time, but if they register then make a deposit it is a great advantage good where every time he gambles you get a bonus every time.

No one wastes time if each of your referrals is led and given a guide or practice to convince them to want to register then play and make a deposit, even though it's a little misleading and risky, but don't forget that you are also responsible for the addiction of the referrals you give to someone . so if i had to choose i would not use a referral link to invite people to gamble.
legendary
Activity: 1946
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Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform
May 04, 2023, 03:54:36 AM

Unless if you are really able to hook up some whales which it could sustain for a long time on playing then that would be considered to be lucky but finding one isn't really that
simple as it looks.


The thing with the referral programme is that your downlines must remain active in other for the referee to keep earning from them as they keep playing in the casino, so this makes the referral program a hard thing to do as long as you want to keep generating income from it, and another thing is that, since you can't rely on the current downlines to keep playing on the casino, there is a need for the referee to keep recruiting new downlines as much as possible and that is were the work is.
So altogether, the referral program is only profitable to those who have a large network of passive players who are constantly wagering high amount, but also if your downline stay motivated, it could be a good way to earn a lot of income even though it's not easy to achieve.
When it comes to sustaining then it would really be needed for your referrals to continue on playing and keeps on wagering for you to earn from those even on small peanuts but once it would be that
accumulated then it would be still a huge amount if ever you would be able to have a good number of referral under but if not then it wont really be that significant.If you are that a fan on inviting people
then this wont really be an issue but if you want to at least spending your time on inviting people then just let them be.We do have our own time and on how we should be moving on.
Most of the time i dont really care out when it comes to referral because i do just simply play out without minding about some side income.
All in when it comes to playing gambling, im not really that expecting that much.
Oh, you mean referral programs. Their memories continue to torment me. I, for one, am a big fan of earning money with minimal effort. Now, folks, let's get real. Keeping up the recommendations? Huge waste of time. Recruiting new members? This is merely the beginning. How can I keep my present downline excited and invested? That's the serious difficulty level, major league. Unfortunately, not even perfection ensures a prosperous outcome. There's always the chance that your downline will abandon you. Is it worth the effort? The choice is yours. A lucrative source of income for some is word-of-mouth advertising. Others? This is just a headache, nothing more. That depends on your goals, priorities, and willingness to take risks
legendary
Activity: 3094
Merit: 1127
May 03, 2023, 08:56:24 PM

Unless if you are really able to hook up some whales which it could sustain for a long time on playing then that would be considered to be lucky but finding one isn't really that
simple as it looks.


The thing with the referral programme is that your downlines must remain active in other for the referee to keep earning from them as they keep playing in the casino, so this makes the referral program a hard thing to do as long as you want to keep generating income from it, and another thing is that, since you can't rely on the current downlines to keep playing on the casino, there is a need for the referee to keep recruiting new downlines as much as possible and that is were the work is.
So altogether, the referral program is only profitable to those who have a large network of passive players who are constantly wagering high amount, but also if your downline stay motivated, it could be a good way to earn a lot of income even though it's not easy to achieve.
When it comes to sustaining then it would really be needed for your referrals to continue on playing and keeps on wagering for you to earn from those even on small peanuts but once it would be that
accumulated then it would be still a huge amount if ever you would be able to have a good number of referral under but if not then it wont really be that significant.If you are that a fan on inviting people
then this wont really be an issue but if you want to at least spending your time on inviting people then just let them be.We do have our own time and on how we should be moving on.
Most of the time i dont really care out when it comes to referral because i do just simply play out without minding about some side income.
All in when it comes to playing gambling, im not really that expecting that much.
legendary
Activity: 3542
Merit: 1352
Cashback 15%
May 03, 2023, 06:03:39 PM
Referral bonuses aren't really meant to give you a steady stream of income. It's called a bonus for a reason, because that is something you'll only get because the casino offers it. If you're someone who has a huge following and has command over a large group of people, your influence could easily make you some money. Then again, whatever income stream you'll get from this is highly dependent on your referrals. They might register under your link, but the choice of them actually depositing on that account is still entirely up to them. You can persuade them by introducing complementary deposit bonuses, but it will only appeal to those who are really into gambling and not the casuals.
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