Topic: Relationship between transaction confirmations and miners (Read 1190 times)
DannyHamilton, wish we could all be as patient like you
DannyHamilton, please post yout BTC address, Your post deserves some donations.
Not necessary. Instead, just do me a favor: The next time you come across a newbie that is struggling to understand something that you're able to explain, take a few minutes to help them out as patiently as you can. That way we all become better informed, and the entire bitcoin system becomes stronger.
Also, Can I use your post explaining the mining, translate it and publish it? I myself know how mining works, but your explanation is best I've ever seen.
Certainly. It doesn't matter to me. Use it however you like.
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How DannyHamilton has the patience to keep writing the same answers repeatedly to noobs I cannot fathom.
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How DannyHamilton has the patience to keep writing the same answers repeatedly to noobs I cannot fathom.
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As long as they're demonstrating an interest, I really don't mind. None of us was born with this knowledge. We all had to learn it from someone somewhere. Some of us have enough curiosity and patience to hunt down the information we seek on our own. Other's need an interactive conversation to help them grasp the concepts.
Another issue... there is a ton of explanations of how the bitcoin system works. But they are all very simple and not very technical. Google is flooded with simple to intermediate guides that give a very good picture to how it all works, but there are no details. It's hard to find "good" results (or ask the correct question) in google to more technical questions since google ranks on top all the simple explanations (since they get the most hits and are most popular) and the problems is that all questions i ask google have the simple answer.
To really know how it works, you have to be a programmer, and read the source code of some mining software, since there are no guides that I found that explain, for example, on what data hashing is performed or some of the other questions I asked in the beginning...
To really know how it works, you have to be a programmer, and read the source code of some mining software, since there are no guides that I found that explain, for example, on what data hashing is performed or some of the other questions I asked in the beginning...
so what you are basicly saying is: im stupid!!!
i take 0.25 btc/hour to teach you about bitcoin if you like.
i take 0.25 btc/hour to teach you about bitcoin if you like.
kokjo, no, that's not what I am saying (and I would never pay a teacher who calls his students "stupid"). I am saying that the bitcoin system is not a simple system. The concept it very well understood but the details are very complex. The questions I asked helped a lot of other users (who are maybe ashamed to ask?) to understand.
I am sure you can find much dumber questions on this forum. And I don't think the reply is that the asker is stupid.
DannyHamilton, thank you for all your answers! Things are a lot clearer now.
I wrote a concise answer that if understood allows one to comprehend the technology of Bitcoin. How DannyHamilton has the patience to keep writing the same answers repeatedly to noobs I cannot fathom.
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1670263
http://we.lovebitco.in/how-bitcoin-works/
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1670263
http://we.lovebitco.in/how-bitcoin-works/
When you send a transaction you broadcast it to any peers you are connected to. Those peers validate the transaction and then re-broadcast it to any peers they are connected to. Those peers validate the transaction and re-broadcast it, and so on. Every peer that hears about the transaction keeps track of it in a memory pool so they can transmit it to any new peers that haven't heard about it yet.
Wow, your post is a great answer! It's a good concise writeup of how it works. There's a lot of misinformation out there, and this helps to clear it up. Wish I had read this in a FAQ somewhere first, it would have saved me from asking some silly questions!
Josh
DannyHamilton, please post yout BTC address, Your post deserves some donations.
Also, Can I use your post explaining the mining, translate it and publish it? I myself know how mining works, but your explanation is best I've ever seen.
Also, Can I use your post explaining the mining, translate it and publish it? I myself know how mining works, but your explanation is best I've ever seen.
we are not your brain. go search the fucking web.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SHA-2
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Main_Page
http://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
kokjo, thank you for the fucking links http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SHA-2
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Main_Page
http://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
I did read those, but I am a slow learner i.e., a NEWBIE!i take 0.25 btc/hour to teach you about bitcoin if you like.
Does anyone have a good (Concise) explanation of the BTC and/or LTC hashing algorithms and how confirmations work... I would like to explain this to a sceptic but cant find succinct resources...
I'd suggest you not waste your time on a skeptic. If they aren't curious or interested, then they aren't going to accept anything you say about it.
On the other hand if they are curious or interested, then I'd send them here to bitcointalk.org where any questions or concerns they may have can be addressed.
As far as I know there isn't a "concise" explanation of the SHA-256 hashing process. It is a rather complex algorithm. About the best I've seen is the wikipedia page:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sha-256
As for how confirmations work, your best bet is to make sure that you understand the process well enough to explain it yourself. That way when the skeptic responds with questions, you'll be ready to answer, and you'll be able to adjust your presentation to their particular level of understanding. Is there something in this thread that isn't clear? This post from earlier in this discussion thread is about as concise as I can get it:
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The computer selects a set of unconfirmed transactions.
A block header for that set of transactions is created
A double SHA-256 hash of the block header is calculated.
If the hash value is less than the target difficulty required by the protocol, the header and set of transactions are considered a valid block.
If the hash value is not less than the target difficulty, a number in the header called a "nonce" is incremented.
A double SHA-256 hash of the block header is calculated.
If the hash value is less than the target difficulty required by the protocol, the header and set of transactions are considered a valid block.
The nonce increment, double hash, and compare steps are repeated as fast as possible until either:
In either case the valid block (received or created) is added to the local copy of the blockchain and broadcast to all connected peers.
The process then begins all over again with a new set of unconfirmed transactions.
The computer selects a set of unconfirmed transactions.
A block header for that set of transactions is created
A double SHA-256 hash of the block header is calculated.
If the hash value is less than the target difficulty required by the protocol, the header and set of transactions are considered a valid block.
If the hash value is not less than the target difficulty, a number in the header called a "nonce" is incremented.
A double SHA-256 hash of the block header is calculated.
If the hash value is less than the target difficulty required by the protocol, the header and set of transactions are considered a valid block.
The nonce increment, double hash, and compare steps are repeated as fast as possible until either:
- A hash value less than the target difficulty is found
- A valid block is received from a peer
In either case the valid block (received or created) is added to the local copy of the blockchain and broadcast to all connected peers.
The process then begins all over again with a new set of unconfirmed transactions.
The block that contains a transaction is the first confirmation for that transaction. After that every new block added to the blockchain is another confirmation.
we are not your brain. go search the fucking web.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SHA-2
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Main_Page
http://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SHA-2
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Main_Page
http://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
kokjo, thank you for the fucking links
I did read those, but I am a slow learner i.e., a NEWBIE!
Does anyone have a good (Concise) explanation of the BTC and/or LTC hashing algorithms and how confirmations work... I would like to explain this to a sceptic but cant find succinct resources...
What exactly is the input to the SHA256 hashing algorithm?
I'm pretty sure I already explained that the input is the header of the block.
Is it something constant in size?
I don't remember if there is any variability to the size of a block header, but if there is it isn't more than a few bytes.
Does the hash rate have any correlation to the algorithm e.g., the rare will be twice lower if SHA512 was used?
The current protocol specifies that SHA-256 is to be used. If SHA-512 were used, no peers would accept the blocks as valid. It is impossible to predict what the current difficulty would be, since we don't know how much hashing power the network would be providing today under those altered circumstances. Regardless, the protocol would adjust the difficulty to ensure an average of ten minutes per block no matter how fast (or slow) the hashes are generated.
Why the size of a transaction is not a predefined size?
Transactions can have multiple inputs and multiple outputs. The size of the transaction is largely dependent upon the number of each.
Isn't a transaction's content is a pair of wallets and the sum transferred?
No. That isn't how Bitcoin transactions work at all. It would probably be a really good idea for you to take a look at the bitcoin white paper written by Satoshi Nakamoto. Many of your questions are explained there.
Another question. The SHA256 hash can run on any size of data since it divids the data into 512 byte blocks.
What exactly is the input to the SHA256 hashing algorithm? Is it something constant in size? Does the hash rate have any correlation to the algorithm e.g., the rare will be twice lower if SHA512 was used?
we are not your brain. go search the fucking web. What exactly is the input to the SHA256 hashing algorithm? Is it something constant in size? Does the hash rate have any correlation to the algorithm e.g., the rare will be twice lower if SHA512 was used?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SHA-2
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Main_Page
http://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
Another question. The SHA256 hash can run on any size of data since it divids the data into 512 byte blocks.
What exactly is the input to the SHA256 hashing algorithm? Is it something constant in size? Does the hash rate have any correlation to the algorithm e.g., the rare will be twice lower if SHA512 was used?
What exactly is the input to the SHA256 hashing algorithm? Is it something constant in size? Does the hash rate have any correlation to the algorithm e.g., the rare will be twice lower if SHA512 was used?
Why the size of a transaction is not a predefined size? Isn't a transaction's content is a pair of wallets and the sum transferred?
So in some layman's terms, the transactions of coin that occur are verified and driven by mining/transaction verification activity and for that a reward is offered, so in this respect both the creation of the coin currency and it's verification in transactions are the coin more so than "what is a coin". Rather than being an expense of doing business in bitcoin, the transaction verification, the mining, is the profitable part of interacting with bitcoin/litecoin, etc ..., thus being a miner, is "being a bitcoin".
Yes very interesting and I am bookmarking it as well.
I'm bookmarking this! This was a really useful explanation of the way mining works! Better even than the bitcoin wiki!
anyone "mining" is confirming transactions
mining is a misnomer
mining is a misnomer
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