Topic: Ripple XRP market is now "officially" tracked by Bitcoincharts.com (Read 6158 times)

Why I feel it's hard to read this charts...

I see it the other way around. Any crypto that doesn't integrate the ripple concept at some point will fail.
When we implement something equivalent for Freicoin, Bitcoin can just take it from github. At that point, if bitcoin devs are so blind as you are, the future of Bitcoin will be compromised.
But I think Ripple will be successful enough for them to want our commits.
I also predict that at some point someone will be able to mathematically demonstrate  that any economic model or system can be modeled with an equivalent abstract ripple network.
That's hard for me to explain, and probably for you to understand.
I suggest you to start here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graph_theory

Besides, even if you don't believe in credit money and haven't ever heard about LETS, xrp is cash just like btc.

If Ripple.com fails it will be because someone finds an attack vector in the ledger consensus algorithm. I cannot think of any attack that hasn't been refuted by Ripple devs.
If they manage the xrp distribution badly, Open coin Inc. may fail, but the network will be forked and the software will still succeed.

This cannot be overemphasized enough.

Any money you are not holding in your hand is money owed - whether it's dollars on mtgox or in your bank account.
If you trust bitstamp enough to wire money to them, then you can trust their IOU equally.

Honestly, ripple is stupid.  I know people are going crazy for all things crypto but ripple will fail. Period.

Typical use is not as complicated as some of the examples in this topic. Once setup, you typically just tell Ripple who you want to pay, the amount/currency you want to pay, and seconds letter it's done.

Imagine trying to explain to someone unfamiliar with it how you get your paycheck from your employer and turn it into groceries. Just as many, if not more, hoops (e.g. employer pays a paycheck printing company and a bank to transfer money to your bank that pays you interest and charges you fees; you use an ATM to get cash and give cash to a grocer that deposits it in their bank; etc, etc). It's just that we're all familiar with how that works and not familiar (yet) with using Ripple.

More equivalent to Ripple would be to explain to someone how they can use Paypal to receive payments for their goods/services vs. Ripple. Ripple might have one extra step (the ripple->gateway step) but the fees can be a lot less then Paypal.

Reading all of this makes my head hurt. X_x Why do you need to jump through so many hoops?

No. There is a lot wrong/confused in your post. Starting with, there is no "record kept via XRP".

If you pay someone X BTC on Ripple then balances get adjust so that your balance goes down by some amount (X BTC plus fees, Y USD via a trade offer, etc) and their balance goes up by exactly X BTC. Ripple also destroys 0.00001 XRP of your balance as a transaction fee.

If the payment goes through the Bitstamp gateway (e.g. you have none of the payee's BTC IOUs, you have no available credit in BTC with the payee, and there is no available credit in a trust line with lower fees), then they get X BTC in IOUs from Bitstamp, your balance will go down by X*1.002 BTC of Bitstamp IOUs (the extra is the 0.2% Bitstamp transfer fee that Bitstamp charges) and your balance will also go down by 0.00001 XRP, the Ripple transaction cost.

Your example had no loan. Only if the payee had previously entered a trust line to you of >X BTC would it be a "loan" and it would have been the payee "loaning" the payer (you) the amount.
In this case, the above payment of X BTC would result in the payee's balance going up by X BTC (all in your IOUs), your balance would go down by X BTC (showing up as a negative amount to the payee on the client's trust page; you'd keep any gateway or other issuer BTC IOUs you may have) and your balance would also go down by 0.00001 XRP.

The only way you get XRP is if you trade (i.e. SELL) BTC for XRP. Then it isn't a loan, it's a sale. If you later want BTC back for that XRP you'd have to make another unrelated trade offer (i.e. BUY BTC/XRP).

I don't think that is the point of ripple here, but your math is right,  it is just not that simple! Say that you trade someone $100 in BTC, and you do it through your BTC gateway on Ripple. That created an IOU situation and a record is kept via XRP. Now the coin that you loaned out is BTC/a, BTC/a does not come back to you at the scheduled time that the loan was suppose to be repaid, but you have the XRP for the loan. It is my understanding that since the loan was done through a gateway there is someone who will take that un-paid loan through a gateway....I think it is a way to attempt to add security to trading and if done correctly and implemented by the community it can provide a higher level of security when performing trades. I mean who hasn't been burnt at least once on a loan since BTC came out....? Wouldn't it be nice to eliminate this factor when trading? Imagine if BTC-E and Vircurex, Mt Gox and others implemented the ripple system, I think it would be wise.

It makes sense to me when I think about it like this....If my neighbor owes me money I can pay my landlord rent with the IOU based on the fact that we both know my neighbor, now the debt is where it belongs...Ripple however goes one step further and through gateways I could in theory have a completely different landlord than my neighbor, but still be able to use the IOU based on the XRP transaction...Because at one time I did have the money for rent I just lent it to my deadbeat neighbor. It's more of a way to keep debt where it belongs and can help people stop building such ridiculous debt. It's no secret that we all have a shit ton of debt in USD....This system is feared to be before it's time, it is a complex Idea to be dealing with people based on trust instead of faceless companies that don't give a shit if you spend money you don't have. I mean USD is just Debt Notes being passed around isn't it?? Most currencies are...Thanks for that you effin Rothschild's!

But anywho...Let me know if that helps with an understanding of the system. I know that every time I post about it I learn a little bit more!

Happy Coining!!

Is that a bit like how the currency pairs at each exchange are slightly different?

$100 owed does not equal $100

This is the major problem that Ripple faces and there is no easy solution to it.

I'm working on implementing something similar now. We call the feature auto-bridging. Ripple will create a synthetic order books for all currency pairs which do not include XRP. The book composites the orders from ABC/DEF with orders combining the order books ABC/XRP to XRP/DEF.
 

The low volatility USD/XRP chart is really nice

What I miss is implicit quotes (in the ripple.com/client order books).
For example when bid ask spread for bitstamp USD/XRP is 5% and for bitstamp BTC/bitstamp USD also 5%,
then the ripple exchange engine could automatically post bitstamp BTC/XRP quotes with 10% bid ask spread,
but this doesn't seem to work.

Yes it's confusing, but real confusion comes from having the most liquidity in the BTC/XRP pair inside ripple, while XRP price is managed by OpenCoin to gradually appreciate against USD, i.e. the price of XRP in Bitcoin is just an approximation of what it "should be" in USD.

This is of course because it's a lot easier to get BTC IOUs into Ripple than any other kind, but this might change with banks becoming Ripple gateways, it maybe eventually be possible to quickly withdraw and redeem regular fiat IOUs into and out of Ripple.

Cheers ...

P.S. Real action is of course inside Ripple's Advanced -> Trade tab not on these charting websites.

That site is also confusing as hell. It looks like I can get about 70 000 BTC for one XRP. I'm a theoretical multi-millionaire (in USD) if that were true. I have a little less than 50 000 XRP in my Ripple account, and I've spent a few on transactions.

Yes, that graph maybe possibly mislabeled ... Ripple's growing pains.

Ripple has its own as-hoc charting site https://ripplecharts.com

Wait a minute. Does the rippleUSD graph show how much BTCs are exchanged for USDs inside Ripple? Or what XRPs are exchanged for USDs?

I suppose it is the former, because the rippleXRP graph seems to show that one BTC costs about 90000 XRPs?

Distributed trading is built into Ripple. You should create a ripple wallet here https://ripple.com/ then request some XRPs in the Ripple Giveaway thread or from a friend.  Once your account is funded with at least 300 XRPs you can trade.  Most people sign up with Bitstamp.net to be able to "withdraw" BTC or USD IOUs into their ripple account, then those are traded inside ripple, BTC & USD IOUs can then be redeemed by "depositing" them from inside Bitstamp.net

Cheers ...

Sorry for noob question, but how do you actually trade XRP? Are there any gateways?

Great news! Thanck you!