Russia Prepares To Buy Up To $10 Billion In Bitcoin To Evade US Sanctions - page 2.

stompix

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Quote from: Hydrogen on February 19, 2019, 05:54:24 AM

This news story published in january 2019 claimed russia would buy $10 billion in bitcoin as early as february 2019.

I see the price of bitcoin is up. Did the rumors turn out to be true? Shocked

No way! Nooooo way! Grin

We would have seen it in the volume and there is simply no indication of such movement.
Besides, an injection of even 1 billion would mean 250 000 coins acquired and moved away from the market into some cold storage, but again there is no spike in the average transactions either by number or by value.

It's just that BTC got tired of getting poked and asked to do something and finally moved.

Also, I've seen theories that this is because of JPMorgan, the legal status in Indonesia, and many others.
I doubt it was any of them and more a move that had to happen sooner or later in this neverending bear market.

whiteblue

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Quote from: Hydrogen on February 19, 2019, 05:54:24 AM

This news story published in january 2019 claimed russia would buy $10 billion in bitcoin as early as february 2019.

I see the price of bitcoin is up. Did the rumors turn out to be true? Shocked

if in January Russia buys that much bitcoin then it seems that the graph that occurred at the bitcoin price in January should show an increase in price or flash pump, but maybe the purpose of that statement might be that Russia starts buying bitcoin in January and so on with capital money as much as $10 billion so the price increase is slow step by step.

Hydrogen

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This news story published in january 2019 claimed russia would buy $10 billion in bitcoin as early as february 2019.

I see the price of bitcoin is up. Did the rumors turn out to be true? Shocked

jademaxsuy

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Quote from: Osayo on January 25, 2019, 04:22:39 AM

It might sound as a very great news that is capable of exciting everyone in crypto space. But I still have my worries. What if the US now decides to pull down bitcoin and cryptocurrency by imposing sanctions on its usage? It means everything might come to an abrupt end.

Do not get too carried away because all are just assumptions and there could be a possibility that it will not going to happen. Just see the bitcoin market price nowadays. It was being speculated that bull run will going to come for bitcoin yet it was not happening. The problem with people is that they will be able to believe that easily without validating the news. Let us just make some confirmations before jumping into conclusions.

deisik

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Quote from: jseverson on January 25, 2019, 03:53:15 AM

Quote from: deisik on January 25, 2019, 02:08:35 AM

In fact, you said that gold is the superior option short-term

But that's a minor transgression, really. The much bigger one is that gold is not good even for long-term investment or holding (call it what you like) for nation states unless you control the world gold trade (read, can set prices as you see fit). And it is definitely not Russia which controls it. Buying gold is a poor man's choice, only at a national level. Russia is freezing their resources in gold which means losing time and opportunity

Okay, let me reclarify my position. I never once mentioned anything about gold or Bitcoin as an investment

It is six of one and half a dozen of the other

You can call it as you please (investments, reserves, holdings, possessions, diversifications, etc), it doesn't matter. Gold is just bad for the purposes mentioned simply because your overhead costs involving short-term diversifying will outweigh any potential benefits. And I'm not even sure that actual ordering, processing documents and physical delivery of all these tonnes of gold won't take longer than the timelines you keep in mind ("in the span of less than a year")

All in all, the whole comparison is meaningless since no one buys gold to hold it for less than a year. There are gold derivatives created exactly for that purpose (i.e. options and futures)

Osayo

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It might sound as a very great news that is capable of exciting everyone in crypto space. But I still have my worries. What if the US now decides to pull down bitcoin and cryptocurrency by imposing sanctions on its usage? It means everything might come to an abrupt end.

raidarksword

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This is a great news for us crypto enthusiasts and supporters because it could open a great deal of opportunities that could boost the bitcoin's price even greater that we wanted since last December. With the support from Russia for sure this could shake the tides in the market and hoping to see green once again.

jseverson

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Quote from: deisik on January 25, 2019, 02:08:35 AM

In fact, you said that gold is the superior option short-term

But that's a minor transgression, really. The much bigger one is that gold is not good even for long-term investment or holding (call it what you like) for nation states unless you control the world gold trade (read, can set prices as you see fit). And it is definitely not Russia which controls it. Buying gold is a poor man's choice, only at a national level. Russia is freezing their resources in gold which means losing time and opportunity

Okay, let me reclarify my position. I never once mentioned anything about gold or Bitcoin as an investment. I was talking strictly within the context of Russia diversifying from the USD, keeping their money's value given the choice of gold vs Bitcoin. In this case, I said, gold would be much better than Bitcoin short-term because it is less prone to tanking -- something which may concern Russia in Bitcoin's case because they aren't exactly doing well. When their shit hits the fan, which may happen soon, they'd probably want to hold the more reputable asset as far as the global economy goes. I concede that it may not be actually good like you're saying, but at the very least, I'd say it's less bad than Bitcoin. Either way, I agree to disagree.

Quote from: deisik on January 25, 2019, 02:08:35 AM

If anything, they should invest these resources in their economic development instead. But the latter seems to be beyond their "capacity", and all they can do now is buy gold and a basket of foreign currencies with the dollars they receive from selling mineral resources such as crude oil, metals, natural gas, etc

I completely agree.

pieppiep

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it seems like a very good step to be able to make the price of bitcoin become expensive because bitcoin only has a supply of 21 million bitcoins, whereas if Russia wants to buy bitcoin with that much amount of money it certainly will make the price expensive because the supply will be more limited , so hopefully this statement is genuine and can be implemented properly.

deisik

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Quote from: jseverson on January 25, 2019, 01:15:35 AM

Quote from: deisik on January 23, 2019, 05:40:42 AM

Gold is good for private investors (and not so much for nation states)

And only as a store of value, i.e. if you are looking to earn money with it, it is definitely not the best (or even second best) choice and option. People buy gold to store their wealth in it, but you should have already acquired that wealth in the first place and not be looking to multiply it. And physical gold is definitely a long-term investment, with investment horizons possibly exceeding decades. If you want to use gold as a short-term investment (for whatever reason), you'd better look into gold derivatives as you will save yourself a lot of overhead expenses that possessing physical gold invariably involves (buying it, storing it, and then selling it)

You may have misunderstood my point. I wasn't saying it's better as an investment short-term, just that it's one of the best options for them if they want to diversify i.e. keep their money's value. They're not turning away from the USD to make money after all

In fact, you said that gold is the superior option short-term

But that's a minor transgression, really. The much bigger one is that gold is not good even for long-term investment or holding (call it what you like) for nation states unless you control the world gold trade (read, can set prices as you see fit). And it is definitely not Russia which controls it. Buying gold is a poor man's choice, only at a national level. Russia is freezing their resources in gold which means losing time and opportunity

If anything, they should invest these resources in their economic development instead. But the latter seems to be beyond their "capacity", and all they can do now is buy gold and a basket of foreign currencies with the dollars they receive from selling mineral resources such as crude oil, metals, natural gas, etc

jseverson

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Quote from: deisik on January 23, 2019, 05:40:42 AM

Gold is good for private investors (and not so much for nation states)

And only as a store of value, i.e. if you are looking to earn money with it, it is definitely not the best (or even second best) choice and option. People buy gold to store their wealth in it, but you should have already acquired that wealth in the first place and not be looking to multiply it. And physical gold is definitely a long-term investment, with investment horizons possibly exceeding decades. If you want to use gold as a short-term investment (for whatever reason), you'd better look into gold derivatives as you will save yourself a lot of overhead expenses that possessing physical gold invariably involves (buying it, storing it, and then selling it)

You may have misunderstood my point. I wasn't saying it's better as an investment short-term, just that it's one of the best options for them if they want to diversify i.e. keep their money's value. They're not turning away from the USD to make money after all.

Ucy

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Bisq is a Bitcoin Fiat Dex. Use responsibly

This would be interesting considering that Bitcoin has become fairly stable for quite some time now. Will it affect the price positively or negatively.

Well, I guess more governments coming into the scene could further strengthen the stability.

guoyu78

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I guess the idea was believable so that is why it got picked up but I doubt Russia is that much technological place to think about it. Using bitcoin to evade sanctions is a short term solution and wouldn't really solve a long term ally problem to begin with, USA and Russia needs to get along well, more for Russia then USA because Russia keeps having economical problems whenever Oil prices go down and it all depends on USA oil companies to jointly drop the price to kill off all Russian economy.

However, whenever these countries go head to head the world takes a step back in history which means sanctions are a problem that needs to be solved and not evaded. People probably took a look at the news and the tweet and said this could be a way but it is far from a solution.

deisik

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Quote from: jseverson on January 23, 2019, 03:55:12 AM

Quote from: deisik on January 22, 2019, 07:48:17 AM

-snip-

That's a fair point. I never looked at it that way. I still think gold is the (much) superior option short-term though, as you don't risk it losing ~80% of its value in the span of less than a year. Either way, there's really no way for us to know what these people are doing behind the scenes lol

Gold is good for private investors (and not so much for nation states)

And only as a store of value, i.e. if you are looking to earn money with it, it is definitely not the best (or even second best) choice and option. People buy gold to store their wealth in it, but you should have already acquired that wealth in the first place and not be looking to multiply it. And physical gold is definitely a long-term investment, with investment horizons possibly exceeding decades. If you want to use gold as a short-term investment (for whatever reason), you'd better look into gold derivatives as you will save yourself a lot of overhead expenses that possessing physical gold invariably involves (buying it, storing it, and then selling it)

jseverson

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Quote from: deisik on January 22, 2019, 07:48:17 AM

-snip-

That's a fair point. I never looked at it that way. I still think gold is the (much) superior option short-term though, as you don't risk it losing ~80% of its value in the span of less than a year. Either way, there's really no way for us to know what these people are doing behind the scenes lol.

Quote from: exstasie on January 22, 2019, 06:00:57 AM

That's not even a sure thing. I think we all got bamboozled. Nobody has been able to verify whether Ginko really works for RANEPA. All of this speculation was built on a few Twitter posts and zero fact-checking.

Yeah lol it's not as much a "report" as an out of nowhere claim. It did get him a small spotlight though, so good for him.

deisik

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Quote from: jseverson on January 22, 2019, 02:19:46 AM

Quote from: deisik on January 21, 2019, 05:09:07 AM

As I get it, no one is actually believing in Bitcoin here

And all that noise that people were making nonstop 24/7 about Bitcoin being "digital gold", "the best store of value ever", "world money", it was all thorough bullshit and elaborate lie, right? So is there a soothing light at the end of the tunnel or is it just the freight train coming our way? On the other hand, Russia not doing well financially (with that freight train coming their way) may be desperately looking for a way out ("wunderwaffe"), and in that case we can expect many strange decisions not quite in line with sound reasoning and logic, bordering on insane

I don't think it's a lack of belief, it's more of believing that Russia will not be able to afford to risk that amount for long-term gains. A lot of believers here are in for the long haul so they couldn't care less about how well Bitcoin is doing in the short term -- something that Russia should probably be very concerned about

But the same question may be asked why they are buying gold then

Russia has been actively buying gold for over a decade by now, since 2006 to be exact:

And given that the gold market is not every elastic overall, i.e. you can't sell industrial-scale amounts of gold without crashing the prices (as something like that had probably happened in 2008), so it is not something that Russia should care about in the short term. Personally, I'm inclined to think that it is just a waste of money anyway as gold won't help the Russian government even in the long-term either. But from this perspective, Bitcoin is not much different from gold (likely just as useless)

exstasie

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Quote from: jseverson on January 22, 2019, 02:19:46 AM

It wasn't even a news outlet. The reports apparently came from one Russian economist, and everyone just picked up on it. He does have ties to the Russian Government though, which is why he was taken seriously.

That's not even a sure thing. I think we all got bamboozled. Nobody has been able to verify whether Ginko really works for RANEPA. All of this speculation was built on a few Twitter posts and zero fact-checking.

nur rochid

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Quote from: creeps on January 21, 2019, 06:28:52 PM

Quote from: cahbagus555 on January 20, 2019, 09:11:10 PM

If Rusia government buying bitcoin worth $10billion in market, i think its good news for bitcoin holder. People will think bitcoin can be government reserve and if this step followed by others country, i think bitcoin will be profitable in the future

This mean there’s another whales who can control the market and its the Government. Well, its good since the price will go up high again but hopefully this market should not be the place for a one government to evade something, this market is offering good service and if Russia push that one maybe the US will make move to regulate more the cryptocurrency.

of course if it becomes real, it will be an encouragement for countries that first legalize bitcoin. with the many races in positive news it will drive the progress of bitcoin and of course it will increase the price

jseverson

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Quote from: deisik on January 21, 2019, 05:09:07 AM

As I get it, no one is actually believing in Bitcoin here

And all that noise that people were making nonstop 24/7 about Bitcoin being "digital gold", "the best store of value ever", "world money", it was all thorough bullshit and elaborate lie, right? So is there a soothing light at the end of the tunnel or is it just the freight train coming our way? On the other hand, Russia not doing well financially (with that freight train coming their way) may be desperately looking for a way out ("wunderwaffe"), and in that case we can expect many strange decisions not quite in line with sound reasoning and logic, bordering on insane

I don't think it's a lack of belief, it's more of believing that Russia will not be able to afford to risk that amount for long-term gains. A lot of believers here are in for the long haul so they couldn't care less about how well Bitcoin is doing in the short term -- something that Russia should probably be very concerned about.

Quote from: BitHodler on January 21, 2019, 04:13:37 PM

Large entities usually tend to stock up on whatever they plan to buy in, then have news outlets start with what seems to be an empty rumor, where after that the entities themselves confirm the rumors.

It wasn't even a news outlet. The reports apparently came from one Russian economist, and everyone just picked up on it. He does have ties to the Russian Government though, which is why he was taken seriously.

But yeah, same dude also speculated that Bitcoin will reach $2m by the end of 2019. He could very well be a sitting on a good amount and wants to make some cash. We won't know for sure though, I guess.

creeps

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Quote from: cahbagus555 on January 20, 2019, 09:11:10 PM

If Rusia government buying bitcoin worth $10billion in market, i think its good news for bitcoin holder. People will think bitcoin can be government reserve and if this step followed by others country, i think bitcoin will be profitable in the future

This mean there’s another whales who can control the market and its the Government. Well, its good since the price will go up high again but hopefully this market should not be the place for a one government to evade something, this market is offering good service and if Russia push that one maybe the US will make move to regulate more the cryptocurrency.

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