Topic: Satoshi talks about BU (Read 2133 times)
In my opinion, both Core and Unlimited do not preserve the original Bitcoin because they both intend to add too many things to it to satisfy a different need.
If you don't like bitcoin, then create an altcoin and people will naturally dump bitcoin for your altcoin if your altcoin is so good, but don't force it on people's throats.
That's exactly how human in power works.
Someone please post a pretty graph with Bitcoin inflation curve, inflation stops in, was it 2100 year something, until then inflation rate is NON-ZERO by Satoshi's design.
Which means you break satoshi's design in 2100 when it will be 21 million coins + some (otherwise BU's EC will collapse).
The thought that incompetent BU devs would be able to maintain bitcoin until 2100 before a fatal bug kills the network is laughable tho.
Though I think when bitcoins ran out and there is nothing else to be mined, bitcoins will die and probably Bitcoin Unlimited will be king by then. Though I don't think anyone here right now would even care about it because that is practically 80 years from now and most likely every one who cared right now will be dead anyway.
Bitcoin Unlimited has the same 21 million cap as Core. Stop falling in to propaganda. There is no proposal to remove the 21 million cap in BU, not even close.
Someone please post a pretty graph with Bitcoin inflation curve, inflation stops in, was it 2100 year something, until then inflation rate is NON-ZERO by Satoshi's design.
Which means you break satoshi's design in 2100 when it will be 21 million coins + some (otherwise BU's EC will collapse).
The thought that incompetent BU devs would be able to maintain bitcoin until 2100 before a fatal bug kills the network is laughable tho.
Though I think when bitcoins ran out and there is nothing else to be mined, bitcoins will die and probably Bitcoin Unlimited will be king by then. Though I don't think anyone here right now would even care about it because that is practically 80 years from now and most likely every one who cared right now will be dead anyway.
Someone please post a pretty graph with Bitcoin inflation curve, inflation stops in, was it 2100 year something, until then inflation rate is NON-ZERO by Satoshi's design.
Which means you break satoshi's design in 2100 when it will be 21 million coins + some (otherwise BU's EC will collapse).
The thought that incompetent BU devs would be able to maintain bitcoin until 2100 before a fatal bug kills the network is laughable tho.
BUggy is dead. If the miners go with their attack, they will get fired via PoW change, and it will prove that they didn't care to cause havok on the network they were direct attackers since they KNOW going through with this kills bitcoin network effect and price.
I don't think so that BU is dead, in fact it is already on a exchanger (correct me if I'm wrong), it is just Bitcoin is still the number one amongst all the Altcoins here in the cryptocurrency world, that is why this BU is not that popular or in demand. Most of us are still supporting bitcoin, our hopes are still on bitcoin, because we know that Bitcoin is the only one that will lead us to success in the near future.
Especially those people who are saving bitcoin everyday, keeps on holding it and waiting for the right time to convert it to have a huge profit from it.
Satoshi also decided that this network would give dominance to whatever implementation gets consensus. So we should respect the outcome no
matter what. If the mining pools gets consensus and other nodes are in a minority, then that is what Satoshi intended, but he did hope that
whomever had the majority consensus would also put the interest of Bitcoin first. Is this the case with BU? I do not think so...
matter what. If the mining pools gets consensus and other nodes are in a minority, then that is what Satoshi intended, but he did hope that
whomever had the majority consensus would also put the interest of Bitcoin first. Is this the case with BU? I do not think so...
The Question here, Are we really ready for BU? and bitcoin is emerging as the biggest value right now is because of the low supply for it I think we are not really ready for it looking the way people think right now in buying and exchanging bitcoin with other Altcoins I think it is better to say that we are not up against the impending unlimited kind of thing because just like other currency that only have limited we should have the same.
Like us, everyone here, who is aware of the greed of the miners and the harms of BU, everyone is opposed to Bu form. BU is a copy altcoin and it is not allowed to mock bitcoin. Their greed is too wicked, they are not aware of the consequences. They can destroy bitcoins if they go in that direction. The fork is created and it resents everyone. Too bad, the miners are so bad. Satoshi is the creator of bitcoin, he understands everything about it, and of course, he will not accept something that affects bitcoin. The fork is set and it certainly must have results, either bitcoin core, or segwit, I look forward to winning from it.
"BU which changes one parameter"
BU changes a fundamental feature of bitcoin (limited 21 million coins) because EC (emergent consensus) mechanism requires non-zero inflation, yet you say segwit changes bitcoin. Are you some kind of troll?
BU changes a fundamental feature of bitcoin (limited 21 million coins) because EC (emergent consensus) mechanism requires non-zero inflation, yet you say segwit changes bitcoin. Are you some kind of troll?
No, BU doesn't do that. BU increases block size limit (space to process more transactions). BU doesn't touch the 21-million coin cap. Are you some kind of brain washed or plain uneducated on how Bitcoin works?
I went to /r/bitcoin subreddit and saw this blatant lie.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/627qio/many_bu_supporters_seem_completely_unaware_that/
BU does not remove the 21 million cap. This is getting desperate with you guys. You're parroting lies and look really stupid.
I'll say it again, BU does not remove the 21 million cap.
Now, I don't really care for BU or Core, but I care that lies do not spread. And this one re 21 million cap is so blatant, it stinks. It can't possibly be ignorance, it's too idiotic to be ignorance.
Quote
Peter Rizun (head BU dev):
"To have a fee market with no block size limit you need Bitcoin's inflation rate to be nonzero"
"To have a fee market with no block size limit you need Bitcoin's inflation rate to be nonzero"
I don't know what he meant by that but inflation rate of Bitcoin has always been nonzero. Miners issue new coins into circulation every 10 minutes. Hello? Anybody here who took an economy 101 course? I thought so.
Someone please post a pretty graph with Bitcoin inflation curve, inflation stops in, was it 2100 year something, until then inflation rate is NON-ZERO by Satoshi's design.
You seem pretty low IQ (no disrespect).
What he meant is exactly that: The final design of bitcoin is disrupted by the fact that sooner or later bitcoin's total supply will not be 21 million. People buy bitcoin because they have the CERTAINTY that the 21 million limit is set in stone. BU definitely KILLS this certainty in the design and therefore the investor's psychology is no longer the same when approaching bitcoin.
You should stop promoting the abortion by the name Bitcoin Unlimited immediately.
Nowhere in BU design there is a proposal to remove the 21 million cap.
You should stop spreading lies immediately.
Satoshi would have been against BU (which will change the 21 million coin supply limit so the "Emergent Consensus" has any chance to work) or any other secondary implementation of the software that pretends to fork it in such a violent way.
We are looking at a couple of miners with massive centralized power against the majority of nodes:
This is insane.
If you don't like bitcoin, then create an altcoin and people will naturally dump bitcoin for your altcoin if your altcoin is so good, but don't force it on people's throats.
If those statement really came from Satoshi then let us not change the bitcoin protocol but rather just continue where Satoshi left off and dont make any changes to the original version. As to the hardfork if the system is not yet ready to use it since the continued result of hardfork will result to more bugs in the system. Hardfork is to early for bitcoin but in the future possibly we can run a hardfork that is compatible to the system since at that time HF is no longer incompatible bitcoin.
"BU which changes one parameter"
BU changes a fundamental feature of bitcoin (limited 21 million coins) because EC (emergent consensus) mechanism requires non-zero inflation, yet you say segwit changes bitcoin. Are you some kind of troll?
BU changes a fundamental feature of bitcoin (limited 21 million coins) because EC (emergent consensus) mechanism requires non-zero inflation, yet you say segwit changes bitcoin. Are you some kind of troll?
No, BU doesn't do that. BU increases block size limit (space to process more transactions). BU doesn't touch the 21-million coin cap. Are you some kind of brain washed or plain uneducated on how Bitcoin works?
I went to /r/bitcoin subreddit and saw this blatant lie.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/627qio/many_bu_supporters_seem_completely_unaware_that/
BU does not remove the 21 million cap. This is getting desperate with you guys. You're parroting lies and look really stupid.
I'll say it again, BU does not remove the 21 million cap.
Now, I don't really care for BU or Core, but I care that lies do not spread. And this one re 21 million cap is so blatant, it stinks. It can't possibly be ignorance, it's too idiotic to be ignorance.
Quote
Peter Rizun (head BU dev):
"To have a fee market with no block size limit you need Bitcoin's inflation rate to be nonzero"
"To have a fee market with no block size limit you need Bitcoin's inflation rate to be nonzero"
I don't know what he meant by that but inflation rate of Bitcoin has always been nonzero. Miners issue new coins into circulation every 10 minutes. Hello? Anybody here who took an economy 101 course? I thought so.
Someone please post a pretty graph with Bitcoin inflation curve, inflation stops in, was it 2100 year something, until then inflation rate is NON-ZERO by Satoshi's design.
You seem pretty low IQ (no disrespect).
What he meant is exactly that: The final design of bitcoin is disrupted by the fact that sooner or later bitcoin's total supply will not be 21 million. People buy bitcoin because they have the CERTAINTY that the 21 million limit is set in stone. BU definitely KILLS this certainty in the design and therefore the investor's psychology is no longer the same when approaching bitcoin.
You should stop promoting the abortion by the name Bitcoin Unlimited immediately.
but the vast majority rejected BU
Where do you get this from? Don't listen to propaganda. The vast majority wants their transactions to be processed quickly and with low fees, the vast majority doesn't care about BU, Core and other fancy names. They want to do their business with as little friction as possible.
they should at least care about the fate of their coins, because you know fee is onyl a small problem if the entire system is compromised
but the vast majority rejected BU
Where do you get this from? Don't listen to propaganda. The vast majority wants their transactions to be processed quickly and with low fees, the vast majority doesn't care about BU, Core and other fancy names. They want to do their business with as little friction as possible.
If this is true then the vast majority can go to alt coins.
many people already use altcoin, monero is used in the deep web, but the altscene doesn't have the same number of merchants that bitcoin have, otherwise the competition would be fierce
The idea was that as bandwidth and technology capabilities increased, so would blocksize. Bigger blocks does not mean centralization.
To a point, yes. Truly massive blocks would lead to centralization.
everythigng is leading to centralization at this point, bitcoin was more decentralized at launch
but the vast majority rejected BU
Where do you get this from? Don't listen to propaganda. The vast majority wants their transactions to be processed quickly and with low fees, the vast majority doesn't care about BU, Core and other fancy names. They want to do their business with as little friction as possible.
If this is true then the vast majority can go to alt coins.
They are, and this movement has been accelerating in the past months.
The reason why Bitcoin because more mainstream is the fast transaction times and cheap fees. This way Bitcoin was able to compete with traditional forms of payment processing like Paypal and Payza, Take that away and you get the MAJORITY of users, merchants and customers, to leave Bitcoin and find another alternative. Then it will be relegated to only store of wealth, speculation and mining sectors of the Community. That's not going to be good for Bitcoin is it?
You already got disproved by other user but anyway, from Bitcoin whitepaper:
Yet you are supporting Peter R's fantastic idea to attack the network which has all the nodes. See how that plays out.
Quote
satoshi:
The network timestamps transactions by hashing them into an ongoing chain of hash-based proof-of-work, forming a record that cannot be changed without redoing the proof-of-work. The longest chain not only serves as proof of the sequence of events witnessed, but proof that it came from the largest pool of CPU power. As long as a majority of CPU power is controlled by nodes that are not cooperating to attack the network, they'll generate the longest chain and outpace attackers.
The network timestamps transactions by hashing them into an ongoing chain of hash-based proof-of-work, forming a record that cannot be changed without redoing the proof-of-work. The longest chain not only serves as proof of the sequence of events witnessed, but proof that it came from the largest pool of CPU power. As long as a majority of CPU power is controlled by nodes that are not cooperating to attack the network, they'll generate the longest chain and outpace attackers.
Yet you are supporting Peter R's fantastic idea to attack the network which has all the nodes. See how that plays out.
I wasn't disproved by anyone.
With CPU power Satoshi meant mining nodes, nodes that produce blocks, not any random node which simply relays blocks.
What makes you think that mining nodes running BU cooperate to attack the network any more than miners cooperate to attack today? Mining centralization has already happened, most of the mining power is in one country. It happened before BU became a thing. It can't get any worse, apart from outright blacklisting of transactions which is possible under BU or Core regardless because all miners are subject to the rules of one country.
"BU which changes one parameter"
BU changes a fundamental feature of bitcoin (limited 21 million coins) because EC (emergent consensus) mechanism requires non-zero inflation, yet you say segwit changes bitcoin. Are you some kind of troll?
BU changes a fundamental feature of bitcoin (limited 21 million coins) because EC (emergent consensus) mechanism requires non-zero inflation, yet you say segwit changes bitcoin. Are you some kind of troll?
No, BU doesn't do that. BU increases block size limit (space to process more transactions). BU doesn't touch the 21-million coin cap. Are you some kind of brain washed or plain uneducated on how Bitcoin works?
I went to /r/bitcoin subreddit and saw this blatant lie.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/627qio/many_bu_supporters_seem_completely_unaware_that/
BU does not remove the 21 million cap. This is getting desperate with you guys. You're parroting lies and look really stupid.
I'll say it again, BU does not remove the 21 million cap.
Now, I don't really care for BU or Core, but I care that lies do not spread. And this one re 21 million cap is so blatant, it stinks. It can't possibly be ignorance, it's too idiotic to be ignorance.
Quote
Peter Rizun (head BU dev):
"To have a fee market with no block size limit you need Bitcoin's inflation rate to be nonzero"
"To have a fee market with no block size limit you need Bitcoin's inflation rate to be nonzero"
I don't know what he meant by that but inflation rate of Bitcoin has always been nonzero. Miners issue new coins into circulation every 10 minutes. Hello? Anybody here who took an economy 101 course? I thought so.
Someone please post a pretty graph with Bitcoin inflation curve, inflation stops in, was it 2100 year something, until then inflation rate is NON-ZERO by Satoshi's design.
BUggy is dead. If the miners go with their attack, they will get fired via PoW change, and it will prove that they didn't care to cause havok on the network they were direct attackers since they KNOW going through with this kills bitcoin network effect and price.
BUggy is full of bad speculators and scumbags, like Roger(Doger) Ver, Chinese greedy miners.
Bitcoin is designed to be resistant to bad speculators. Greed is actually a driving force which helps to maintain the network integrity... So let's see how these forces work in bitcoin.
Remember, what doesn't kill you makes you stronger...
good posting
bu supporters are looking for straws to keep pushing his agenda
First of all those BU buggy group doesn't have an scheduled agenda then how come they'll push. Now they might have understood the resistance of bitcoin and soon they too will include into it accepting core. bu supporters are looking for straws to keep pushing his agenda
BUggy is dead. If the miners go with their attack, they will get fired via PoW change, and it will prove that they didn't care to cause havok on the network they were direct attackers since they KNOW going through with this kills bitcoin network effect and price.
BUggy is full of bad speculators and scumbags, like Roger(Doger) Ver, Chinese greedy miners.
Segwit at least brings some improvemts to BTC while BU what ? Blocksize unlock ?
What do you think about this? https://www.bitcoinunlimited.info/
Is this fucking innovation ? We can hire coincreator that will change you to anyblocksize for only 0.1 BTC.
You can't be forked it without following the rules. Whole BU stuff i pathetic and bugged. Try win with it with Etherum tech over time.
Yes, i know it. No one devs are feeling happy to see his software is getting forked. About the BU bug, looks like the Roger ver has made a lot of joke everytime. https://twitter.com/rogerkver/status/841797182017622016
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