Topic: Satoshi's lesson - page 2. (Read 22857 times)

I would have to agree that it is possible that the finacial crash was indeed anticipated not necicerily by satoshi alone but by many of the ideas that came before were born out of the knowledge that the never ending of printed fiat and debt would only lead one direction, being there was no solution to this problem if the system were to go down I think was the driving force behind many of the ideas that we see in bitcoin today.

One other interesting part of the math behind bitcoin is the fact that people miss or have never even known about bitcoin is the following.

Quote "Hal Finney"

"As an amusing thought experiment, imagine that Bitcoin is successful and
becomes the dominant payment system in use throughout the world.  Then the
total value of the currency should be equal to the total value of all
the wealth in the world. Current estimates of total worldwide household
wealth that I have found range from $100 trillion to $300 trillion. With
20 million coins, that gives each coin a value of about $10 million.

So the possibility of generating coins today with a few cents of compute
time may be quite a good bet, with a payoff of something like 100 million
to 1! Even if the odds of Bitcoin succeeding to this degree are slim,
are they really 100 million to one against? Something to think about..."


From this statement it shows that indeed there was research done into the total household wealth of the world and it was calculated into the total figure for bitcoin to me this shows there was a some thought to there being a total global crisis that would effect the total household wealth of the world.

Missing the point as usual, but okay.  What I'm saying is that while it's fairly safe to make the assumption that, because bad things were happening in that period, it could easily be the motivation behind Bitcoin's creation, it's still not quite definitive proof.  I know a lack of empirical evidence has never been a problem for you before, because we all know how much you love to tell fantastical stories, but some of us prefer facts over speculation.  And there are many facts we're likely never going to possess. 

Or is this the part where you tell us that you met Satoshi in person and they told you exactly what their motivations were?  Definitely sounds like the kind of thing you'd say.

I see.
Market capitalization is the most tricky term in crypto.
Even experienced experts/ investors have still misunderstood it.
In my minds, I think of it as pseudo-capitalization, because it totally depends upon one dominant factor. You know what I meant, right?
For now, I agree with you.

It might be popular, but the information on Market Capitalization is commonly misunderstood and people compare coins based on confusing data that they do not understand. 

There are also people saying that the information on there are being manipulated, but I have no proof of that and I think those are just wrong rumors being spread by their competition. 

Why not?
Coinmarketcap.com is one of the most famous site in crypto world, or the most famous, I think.

crisis began in 2007. ..
it wasnt until 2008-9 before it got concluded with bailouts

i remember in 2007 that bad things were happening. so dont try alluding that the crisis didnt happen until 2008-9
might help if you done research that there were financial issues in 2007. in regards to how banks were over creating 'bad money'
hint: sub prime loans

Understanding the root problem in our society, having to trust banks and other corporate institutions lead to this. I think it's also smart to have him stay anonymous knowing that if he'd identified, it could develop an outrage, currently having created Bitcoin and people acknowledging it only when it has already a significant price, especially in the media today, he could be branded by anything and we know that the news is fast. That prevented himself to have a conflict of interest which is good. If you are human, I think some point in your life, and you want to be recognized, whether or not you are an introvert or extrovert. Personal struggles are what I could think of when it comes to this.

The thought of creating such technology such as Bitcoin has lots of ups and downs. Probably there was a lot of discouragement and we are thankful that he didn't stop. It has come a long way and with that great effort, has brought birth to a new era.

True enough about the genesis block, but I'll have to stay on the fence with this one.  Clearly some of the work was already done before that particular headline was written.  As theymos alluded to, Satoshi was working on the idea in 2007 (i.e. before it actually became the 2008 crisis).  If the text embedded in that first block had contained a headline from 2007, then we could definitely point to that beyond all doubt as the true source of inspiration.  But it didn't.  It appears as though Satoshi deliberately launched the network upon reading that article, so it does support the notion that the financial crisis was undeniably a factor in their motivations.  But we can't know for certain if the article was merely something that reinforced Satoshi's general outlook on the problems with modern economic practices, or if it was specifically the global financial crisis that prompted their decision to create Bitcoin. 

It may have been that Satoshi was sufficiently economically astute to see the shit en route to the fan before it actually hit.  Or it may have been that Satoshi thought the banking system had some flaws in general and referenced that article in a "see, this is the kind of thing I'm talking about" kind of way.  I'd like to believe it was the former, but sadly, we may never find out for sure.

Programming on the whole are inter-dependent and inter-connected to each other. Understanding one is equivalent to getting a grasp on almost all the programming languages and it's flows. Also, programming alone won't help one in learning about bitcoin or any other cryptocurrency. They need to have knowledge in cryptography to understand how algorithm functions, how keys are created, how the hashing target is achieved etc. If neither one of them are known, we should better start learning everything from the beginning.

True. As you have said we are not in the early stages of bitcoin to read the code and understand everything. Almost everything has been detailed in the developer docs and there are many books/references for one to have a better understanding on the network without reading the code. Summing it up, If one needs to become a bitcoin developer, he needs to read the code else documentation is enough.

A great takeaway.  It would be interesting to know the details of all the things satoshi had to overcome.  Surely people were wondering what was taking up so much time and if the outcome would be worth the effort.  I'm sure there was lots of discouragement.

I wish everyone who has questions about bitcoin would start here with your post Theymos (Thank you)
and then read the whitepaper

I also known another guy who spent considerable time to learn about crypto and achieved significant sweety results months later the day he/ she joined the crypto world.
iasenko (a Self-made Senior Member for now), and his/ her inspring post

The sentence insprires me a lot.
I am almost a newbie in the crypto world, based on my knowledge, skills, and experience I have had till now; but I will definitely improve myself to survive in the crypto world, and to contribute some days later when I have enough experience to do it.

Another inspriring case study is hal Finney and his last topic in the forum,    
Bitcoin and me (Hal Finney)

---

To celebrate the 10th birthday of bitcoin, I think that the most meaningful way is spending a couple of minutes to remember who dedicated their time to develop bitcoin and bring cryptography into real life usages; and reading their topics again.

i don't know why people think C++ as soon as it comes to understanding bitcoin. you really don't have to know C++, any other programming language works. obviously because there are a lot of libraries that are "translation" of bitcoin core which you can read in your own "language" like python, but also if you know any programming language you are familiar with programming and you would still understand C++ too to some extent.
on top of all that bitcoin has a very good documentation in form of a wiki (bitcoin.it/wiki) developers reference (https://bitcoin.org/en/developer-reference) and the BIPs which means you sometimes don't even have to look at code to understand how certain areas of bitcoin work.

...speaking from experience (i only know c#)

Satoshi not a genius? Yeah, whatever. Things always seem simpler in retrospect including Relativity. Try working in the opposite direction of time - connections are not so "obvious" as they should be.

Great point of view theymos.

I consider him as genius, great things after it piles up of what he did, he may not be known but at least he give us something we will never forget in this century. If he's known I think he'll get Nobel Prize in many aspects or a new Nobel Prize to be known in human history.

I guess we Jr. Members shouldn't be left out with Satoshis signature, I come up with it base on Heisenberg_Hunter sig codes.

Thank you theymos for this post. Maybe Satoshi aren't Einstein, but for me it's unbeleavable what one very smart guy without huge team of well paid developpers can do. No one else didn't even tried to make something similar as he did. And we can see how Satoshi believed in Bitcoin - he spent over 2 years of work to create what we have today. There was no guarantees that Bitcoin will be supported and accepted by other people. Maybe Bitcoin isn't perfect, but considering that only one person worked in creation of Bitcoin, it's almost perfect. Satoshi considered so many aspects which wouldn't came to head of many developpers and these few downsides which Bitcoin have aren't that significant in general.
In first years Bitcoin was used by only small number of geeks. Now, after just 10 years it's used by millions in all corners of world and big part of earth's population at least heard name of Bitcoin. So many things happened in these 10 years, but there are still huge, maybe unlimited potential that Bitcoin have.
Happy birthday, Bitcoin!

This 10 years anniversary can turn out to be an epic one. Right now the financial market seems to be ready to melt down once again, just like it did 10 years ago.
Bitcoin now have a chance to prove itself as a reliable store of wealth and as a secure payment system no failing empires can control.
The next 10 years Bitcoin can go from something most people just talks about, to something people going to use in their daily life.

It might not have been in the whitepaper but it 100% made it's way into the blockchain.



https://sourceforge.net/p/bitcoin/code/133/tree/trunk/main.cpp#l1643

   

I think now as we are in a time of heightened world tension and financial turmoil it's fitting to see bitcoin still here standing strong,   price and markets don't determine bitcoins success. a point highlighted by theymos regarding hard work, determination and a desire to create change are the key factors behind bitcoin.

Thank you theymos, thank you for this thread and your opening post!
I love the chapter above especially the "small flash of brilliance" its
just how most great inventions go i suspect, like the post-it note, not
complicated, everything already in existence but they need to be
combined into a single product.

I really hope Satoshi is lurking on the forum and can realise the
gratitude we all owe the Satoshi entity.

A simple statement from my country >

"A lot done, more to do"

If you have read Bitcoin's whitepaper you will see no mention about it being created because of the 2008 financial crisis, my guesses are someone just have assumed (and it became popular) their is a connection between the timing of both Bitcoin's creation and the financial crisis last 10 years ago. It was created as a P2P payment solution without any 3rd party involvement (financial institutions). Nevertheless the 2008 financial crisis might just be a motivating factor for Bitcoin to start.