Topic: Scam alert : Do NOT INVEST in Genesis Mining - page 23. (Read 257815 times)

Of course...I see S3's selling for $30 all over the place...so lets equal out the "maintenance fee" with electricity.  for someone new to BTC who wants to understand the working and movement etc....while not getting entangled in hardware that's a pain in the ass to use and keep mining.

I think this is a great entry level investment.  again, outside of them disappearing the risk is pretty much the same in all of crypto......people can think for themselves....but disgruntled users who invested $30 and expect a return just to bash on a forum seems a bit unfair.  of course i will now go in search of people who have lost a SUBSTANTIAL amount of BTC and are not paid trolls.

Dear Newbie, you're forgetting to mention that the "maintenance fee" is ~$0.12 per kWh and if you plug it into any Bitcoin calculator you have 400+ days to "ROI" if diff stays constant, and you would barely get half of your "investment" back if diff goes up at 2% on average. SO... you may want to visit an eye doctor if you can't see that "scenario".

Real hardware at least has a resale value.

IT will be interesting to watch this progression also as i have a good bit of capacity at GM.
however i am in the 4%+ affiliate range and work with a group of affiliates to always get the maximum discount.

if you buy in quantity (5Th/s+) and get a good referral you can get as low as $130 per TH/s buys.....

the S9s on the market run $150-$170 per Th/s before PSU+ Electricity and man hours.

SO the only scenario i can see losing here is if GM goes under....especially if you have a means to invest from a corporate expense situation.

So i will be following this.  (just my 2cents)

Are you still buying hashpower at Genesis? Even after we warned you that it will not pay out?

Review and Update.

I agree with most posters.  What I buy in Bitcoin for investments "hedging" etc. Is irrelevant. I will simply post honest results as often as I can.

Payout Review.

Payouts   Date               Amount   
1         1/26/2017       0.13164235     
2         1/27/2017       0.13349527       
3         1/28/2017       0.19443563     
4         1/29/2017       0.19397465    
5         1/30/2017       0.19443563       
6         1/31/2017       0.19888446   
7         2/1/2017        0.27526162   
8         2/2/2017        0.27994034   
9         2/3/2017        0.28272900
10         2/4/2017        0.25410926   


At this point I upgraded 400Th.  Burn baby Burn!      Total Mined BTC to date = 2.917686019


11         2/5/2017        0.39032759   
12         2/6/2017        0.38845505   

Total Invested.

   Investments   Hashpower (Th) Total Hashpower = 1120Th  Total $$$ = $141,382
1   $25,250.00                   200
2   $25,250.00                 200
3   $12,610.00                   100
4   $2,522.00                   20
5   $25,250.00                   200
6   $25,250.00                   200
7   $25,250.00                   200
 

https://imageshack.com/i/pnLd3YWSj

https://imageshack.com/i/pnxbbm1fj

Sounds more like "double down" than "hedge" but whatever. It appears that BTCDream might be trying to downplay the risk. Not nice. Same with "ROI" numbers earlier in this thread. If you're holding BTC a 1% rise in Bitcoin value would mean 101% ROI since you still have the principal. GM paying back 1% over the same period of time is 1.01% ROI, since you can't cash out the principal at will. Big difference.

I think what he meant by hedge was "to hedge the fiat $/T fluctuation" in reference to buy-and-hold btc against dollar value. Otherwise you are absolutely right that "if it goes to shit you lose 100 BTC no matter what the exchange rate is."

Amnesia aside, I'm not following how this is a "hedge". Both actions are long on Bitcoin.

Besides - can one sell the GM hash/PNGs/whatever they're called? Last time I checked that wasn't possible so hedge all you want... if it goes to shit you lose 100 BTC no matter what the exchange rate is.

I think BTCDream is dreaming, to put it mildly.

I kind of agree. Let's see what happens. (btw, the fact Zeta is back here posting on this thread make me think it even more. He is the one and only satisfied GM customer lol).

If you are going to set yourself up as some sort of definitive recorder of fact, then I suggest you start posting screenshots. Credibility and all that.

You could start with this transaction

When you wrote the above, you forgot to mention that


Did you buy another $88,000 worth of bitcoin between making those two posts, or had it just slipped your mind when you wrote the first one?

Why not buy Bitcoin and wait instead of loaning money to miners? If you need 5 or more years to get ROI with Genesis you're much better off buying now and holding for 5 years. At least you will have control over your coins and should the big boom happen earlier you'll be able to sell.


I feel like this post was written by a GM employee. You are so polite and nice and want to help everyone, and you don't want to promote or prove anything, BUT... you will tell us how much you have invested and how big your returns are, just to help us see the light, right?

Bitcoin will be 10.000 Dollars one day, You will see :-)

Glucose. I appreciate your comments. But this is just an experiment/gamble for me. I'll have fun either way. I realize that odds are I wont come out ahead. But in the end I hope not to lose most of my money. You might have another opinion and that's cool.

I appreciate how long you've been keeping this thread up.  But look at it this way. I'm giving you honest results in extreme and probably optimal purchases with GM. Granted its alot of $$$.  But at least you'll have more proof. If it goes bad then it should reinforce the validity of your thread. (with all due respect).

Numbers wont lie and if or when I lose we will all see a true account of what happens.

2 Notes.

  -  I believe that bitcoin will eventually go up in value significantly. So as kind of a hedge I did buy and hold the equivalent in bitcoin to what I invested in GM

  - I probably wont stop at 720 Th. I'd like to be at .5 to a full 1 BTC yield per day from mining. That's a true gamble. We'll see.

Update day #9

 Payout = .28272 BTC

Total to date = 1.88478 BTC

I'm not sure how I should feel about your post. That's a lot of money and I'm 100% sure you will lose quite a big part of your investment (but if you really read the thread you should already know). Good luck.

Hello All.

Continuing with my updates here.

First let me thank all that have replied to my posts. You all make very good points and I appreciate the feedback.

It is fair to compare the investment I've made to actually holding the bitcoin and hoping the price goes up.

It is true at the time I started with GM the Bitcoin I used was purchased for $920 each. So based on what I bought on GM, that equated to 97.92 BTC.

Given that the value of the bitcoin now would be approx. $98,900 Giving me an ROI of just over 12%.

I will keep track of this as well as the days goes buy.

.
As far as today. Payout  #8 amount for the 720Th was .27994 BTC.

This bring the total BTC mined so far to 1.60206. ROI = 1.8%

Holding the bitcoin would have obviously yielded more at this point. 

Again, thanks for all the strong insight.

More posts to come.

It's not everyday that a newbie comes along stating that he invested tens of thousands of dollars into an entity base on only reading this thread in the Scam section FOR MONTHS, given that if he had read other threads, he'd be well-versed in posting etiquette, having no need to apologize.

Wow! But it will not pay you out in full unless BTC price keeps jumping 10% a month (in which case you could easily earn XX% just by holding bitcoins).

In 7 days you got 1.5% of your deposit, so it will require 467 days to break even. But when mining is profitable difficulty in the Bitcoin world increases by 10-20% per month. So to keep your profit at a rate of 1.5% per week you need 10-20% increase in BTC price which is unlikely to happen. Genesis Mining charges $0.3 of maintenance per TH. I'm not sure what miners they are using, but Antminers S9 at Hashnest consume only $0.21 per day per TH and maintenance ratio there is 35-40%, so at Genesis it is 50-60% then. If difference between difficulty increase and BTC price increase will be about 10% montly, then Genesis Mining will stop paying in just 8 months, because the contract is not profitable. So you will recover only about 30% of your investments (again, unless BTC price keeps increasing 10-15% a month in which case just holding bitcoins is very profitable on its own).

I'm also new to cryptocurrencies and my first thought was like: oh, cool, invest your money in Genesis Mining and get 80% annual return. Then I thought like "wait, I need to find a cloud mining with least THs price and minimum expenses to maximize my ROI". Then I found out that Genesis is not the only cloud mining site and came to conclusion that Hashnest offer is just better. But I was still dreaming about a fortune earned with 134% of annual return on S9 miners at Hashnest. Last week I found out what Bitcoin difficulty is when the maintenance ratio for my S9 miners unexpectedly soared from 25-30% to 35-40%. Now I understand that it is much harder to earn something here, but at Hashnest it is possible to buy and sell hashpower. There are a lot of newcomers who think "oh! I will earn a fortune by buying hashpower!" and I can sell my hashpower to them (when I believe it won't pay me out) and increase my ROI.

Good luck on your adventure.
One thing I think is important is to not delude yourself (or others) about your actual profitability, which you seem to do here by mixing your fiat capital investment with your BTC payout.
The actual days on which you bought your contracts are not clear, but it seems you made the bulk of your purchase when the BTC price was around $915 (which it averaged from the 27/1 to the early hours of 31st).
Had you invested your $88k in bitcoin itself, then against your $1000 conversion, your ROI would be $8187 or 9.29%.
Of course, had bitcoin stayed at $915 then your Genesis contract would have been the better investment at the moment, returning 1.37%.

This is the crux of investing money in the Bitcoin environment: do you buy coin or buy cloud mining?
It's difficult to understand the reasoning behind buying a contract to mine something about which the investor is price bearish and if ROI payments are also made in a coin with declining fiat value, then the investment will suffer.
So if you're bullish about Bitcoin and its price, just buy it: cloudmining seems an unnecessary step.
Also, of course, your purchased bitcoin are instantly convertible back to fiat, your Genesis contract isn't, it's a cost and you're locked in.
Its ROI is purely dependent on Genesis and their calculations, their T&C's and their clear practice of reducing repayments over the contract period until dust or outright "unprofitable" voiding of it, which is what this thread is about.

Anyway good luck as I said, will look forward to seeing how it progresses.
 

Wow, 720Th that is a whole wall whit Antminers S9! 

Thanks for sharing :-) Hope to see you in The https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=602022.4620 topic

I'm doing this for 2 reasons. I believe in bitcoins future and I am somewhat of a gambler. I don't have the time to run my own rigs. Especially for the amount of hashpower I want. I'm putting my money where my mouth is...so to speak. So lets see what happens.

First thing you have to understand is that investing in GM in small amounts will hurt you. GM charges $150 per Th for the initial low buy ins. You don't get a significant discount until you buy $1400 for 10Th which is now $140 per Th.  But it isn't until you buy $1950 or above that you get that same Th at $130 per. I think that sucks. Most people don't have that.

I do NOT advocate anyone do what I'm doing. Invest within your means.

____________________________________________________________________________

I started my adventure on 1/26/17 w/ a few large deposits.  Totaling a little over 60k.  My hashrate on Genesis started at 520Th. I'm currently at 720Th

Total Cost to me =$88,136.14

My payout this morning was  0.27526162 BTC (Payout #7 BTW)

As of this morning my total payouts add up to 1.32212961 BTC

Based on a $1000 Bitcoin (I know this will change up and/or down) Dollar value is $1,322.12

So after 7 days I've received about 1.5% back in bitcoin. At least I haven't lost all my money 

More info to come.

http://imageshack.com/a/img922/1244/aRMK0X.jpg

http://imageshack.com/a/img922/1168/PMGti9.jpg