Selachii LLP Law Firm's Initial Gox Plan - page 2.

viajero

member

Activity: 110

Merit: 10

more about this:

http://www.reddit.com/r/MtGox/comments/1zn09i/selachii_trustworthy/

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1zyf1w/sellachi_llp_vs_mtgox_discussion_of_fee/

not so sure about the 2BTC anymore. i do understand, that claims have to be validated but therefore 0.25BTC or even less should be sufficient. since mtgox has bankruptcy protection and there is absolutely no way to know how this case will further develop i think WhatTheGox has a point:

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I really think you should hold off on charging 2 btc until we know more from Mtgox or another idea would be charge for an application admin fee & any any initial legal work up to this point. The negotiation cost could come later.

Money Raccoon

member

Activity: 67

Merit: 10

Quote from: prophetx on March 10, 2014, 05:35:10 PM

http://www.humint.is/goxcoin is another way

Thank you for posting. And more information here
http://letstalkbitcoin.com/e89-goxcoin-and-the-meta-lair/#.Ux-z0F7OVwQ

viajero

member

Activity: 110

Merit: 10

Quote from: bitcoinsolicitor on March 08, 2014, 04:51:07 PM

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1.) Approximately how much extra could be charged from selachii if the MtGox case goes further?

This is impossible to accurately answer. If there are enough validated claims from a certain jurisdiction then there may be enough funds to issue a claim if necessary. If further funds are required then a new proposal will be provided.

what does this mean? are there enough claimants from germany to have a good chance for getting the needed funds? since i lost a lot i'm willing to pay the 2BTC anyway but it would be good to know if there is a significant amount of claimants from my juristiction (germany)?

papamoi

sr. member

Activity: 378

Merit: 250

i would not be surprised if later on we ll know that these sollicitors are one of the sharks who have tried to take btc from desesperated mtgox customers

WhatTheGox

legendary

Activity: 812

Merit: 1000

Can we get also get this cleared up please selachii:

"I read the whole thread on http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?367574-payday-loan-taken-out-2-years-ago-now-capital-credit-management-Lasker-International-taking-my-money/page4 when the Selachii directors were (allegedly) involved in debt collection.

It appears Richard Howlett (Capital Credit Management) was working behind the scenes with Simon Taylor (Lasker Int) to get debts paid back but denying they knew about each other. They both are directors of Selachii now. "

source: http://www.reddit.com/user/Donutmuncher

prophetx

legendary

Activity: 1666

Merit: 1010

he who has the gold makes the rules

http://www.humint.is/goxcoin is another way

okashira

newbie

Activity: 45

Merit: 0

Nope. They have not been approved for civil rehabilitation. Also , any evidence of Fraud could get everything siezed and his personal assets could be at stake.
You guys need a warrant to search his personal property.

Massimo80

full member

Activity: 168

Merit: 100

I'm no legal expert, but due to Mt.Gox's bankruptcy protection filing, wouldn't any legal action be completely useless at this point?

Also, you're asking upfront for 2 BTC/user. As others have noted, even if this could be a reasonable price per user (which BTW I don't think it is), it totals quite a lot of money when multiplied by 500/800/1000 users.

okashira

newbie

Activity: 45

Merit: 0

It's about 95% certain that Karpeles stole the coins, or was involved in a market manip scam to sell them to cover his lawsuits and debts.

He has a history of jail time for financial crimes when he was younger:

http://johnbercow.tumblr.com/post/78352765925/mt-gox-guy-mark-karpeles-went-to-jail-before-for

He also scammed a French out of $30,000, which he used to purchase MtGox.
(the scammee took years to track him down and sue him in Japanese Court, which he won...)

" A €5,000 ($6,870 USD) down payment is placed. Mr. Karpelès returns several months later with bad news. His hired graphics artist failed to complete a subcontract on time, so the first stage of the three-step development process was stall...."

"That was a complete lie. According to court records, Mr. Karpelès could never provide any evidence that there was a subcontractor. By all appearances he had simply taken Mr. Dubois' money, done no work, and then invented a fantasy to cover himself."

http://www.dailytech.com/Bitcoin+King+Mt+Gox+CEO+Mark+Karpels+History+of+Arrests+Firings/article34442.htm
http://www.dailytech.com/Bitcoin+King+Pt+II+Mt+Goxs+Dictator+Karpels+Proves+Tragically+Flawed/article34452.htm

papamoi

sr. member

Activity: 378

Merit: 250

2btc x 1000=2000 btc

it s a bunch of money to start a case

i was thinking they ll be paid on no win no fees basis

WhatTheGox

legendary

Activity: 812

Merit: 1000

Dear Selachii,

Thank you for interaction on this forum, its one of the reasons i was drawn to you.

You must understand despite us bitcoiners beating the crap out of eachother on the forums we are a community who share the same overall values & who will look out for one another.

Those who got goxed are hurting. Mark K has fed us vague answers for many months & we need great reassuring, specifics + open debates at this time.

Ideally we need our priorities as #1 & law firm priorities as #2. Its not like there isnt a big pot of money waiting if Selachii were to win. Im sure many would be very happy to pay you more than 2 BTC each if you get all coins back. I know i would with 100% coins returned.

Also its not like you cant charge an application admin fee for anyone signing up now. Although i do think other legal processes are too early as do many others.

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1zyf1w/sellachi_llp_vs_mtgox_discussion_of_fee/

We are happy to hear why its not too early to progress now with legal action?

Make it impossible for us to not go with your firm. Join our community.

Kind regards

bitcoinsolicitor

member

Activity: 73

Merit: 10

Bitcoin Lawyer in Kensington, London

Names of Counsel are in the proposal.

The proposal should answer most of your questions if carefully read.

We are in advanced talks with a law firm in Japan.

Everybody is free to seek their own independent legal advice and can choose to contact law firms in Japan direct.

Nagle

legendary

Activity: 1204

Merit: 1002

I'm not sure what to make of this. This small firm doesn't have an office in Japan, do they? Their web site doesn't indicate that they have any experience litigating in Japan. Or even outside the UK. They don't list their attorneys and their qualifications.

Note that the 2BTC fee does not include litigation. It's just to get started.

bitcoinsolicitor

member

Activity: 73

Merit: 10

Bitcoin Lawyer in Kensington, London

Thank you for all your replies and suggestions.

I should hopefully be able to provide an update within 24/36 hours.

WhatTheGox

legendary

Activity: 812

Merit: 1000

Quote

For a fast answer to any questions please email info(at)selachii.co.uk

Open debate is more fruitful for impersonal generalized topics.

Quote

1.) Approximately how much extra could be charged from selachii if the MtGox case goes further?

This is impossible to accurately answer. If there are enough validated claims from a certain jurisdiction then there may be enough funds to issue a claim if necessary. If further funds are required then a new proposal will be provided.

Please note that the fee is not just for a potential group action and includes the following:

(i) The written Opinion from Counsel referred to above, with regular updates as your case progresses.
(ii) Management of your claim generally
(iii) Negotiation with Lawyers instructed by Mt. Gox (and others)
(iv) Engaging in the Bankruptcy proceedings
(v) Liaising with law firms in USA/Japan and any other relevant jurisdictions in respect of issuing class action proceedings.

Approximation based on past experience? accuracy not needed

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It would be brilliant news if everyone was paid back by Mt Gox in two weeks Smiley

Will you be taking payment of 2 BTC before 24th march?

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The 2 BTC is for:

(i) The written Opinion from Counsel referred to above, with regular updates as your case progresses.
(ii) Management of your claim generally
(iii) Negotiation with Lawyers instructed by Mt. Gox (and others)
(iv) Engaging in the Bankruptcy proceedings
(v) Liaising with law firms in USA/Japan and any other relevant jurisdictions in respect of issuing class action proceedings.

It is not possible to advise of individual success of claims until Counsel have reviewed full details. This is why we have asked for the 'Information Questionnaire' and any documentary evidence of losses.

Insurance will only become relevant if a claim is issued. If this needs to happen a quote will be provided. The cost will be shared between claimants. More claimants = less to pay

Im not sure we should be charging ahead on some of the above until we know more from MtGox should we?

Quote

What do you think is a fair fee?

If some payment is needed right now because we need to start this early as possible? I think it is fairer to charge for what is needed as we go - so take 2 or 3 installments on the 2 BTC etc.

I guess if we hear nothing from MtGox by the 1st of april it starts to look more ominous so that could be final installment.

First installment maybe charge for application & admin + initial legal ground work. So for anyone who wants to get application in now... first installment = 0.5 BTC - 0.66 BTC? < just a guess at cost.

Else, we are paying $1200 for application review + initial legal work with no refund possible & MtGox could reopen next week for all we know.

bitcoinsolicitor

member

Activity: 73

Merit: 10

Bitcoin Lawyer in Kensington, London

Re: Could you give any insight on why or why wouldn't you be willing to work for a percentage of what is recovered?

Please see proposal.

This is covered in the last paragraph:

''At that stage a further quotation will be provided (if necessary) for the costs relating to litigation, although consideration will also be given to proceeding on a contingency fee basis.''

It is not possible to offer a contingency fee at this stage as we need to validate clients claims.

A questionnaire has been prepared which will give sufficient information for every potential claim to be assessed quickly. Counsel will provide a full opinion on the merits and advice as to how matters should be taken forward by the 24th March 2014, or 7 days after receipt of the questionnaire, whichever is the later date.

Hawker

legendary

Activity: 1218

Merit: 1001

I don't understand why this is being taken seriously.

Mt. Gox is in Japan and in the local equivalent of liquidation. You can sue them in the UK and win a trillion pounds sterling but there is no way to collect a penny.

Loozik

sr. member

Activity: 378

Merit: 250

Born to chew bubble gum and kick ass

Quote from: Cubic Earth on March 08, 2014, 05:28:03 PM

Could you give any insight on why or why wouldn't you be willing to work for a percentage of what is recovered?

My thoughts exactly Grin

My questions are:

1. Did Selachii already determined with Japanese authorities (police, prosecutors) whether MtGox notified them (and when) of the theft of bitcoins from MtGox's system?

2. In case MtGox notified the authorities of the theft, what is the current status of this criminal investigation and have the suspects been identified?

Cubic Earth

legendary

Activity: 1176

Merit: 1020

I sent you an email last night about my interest in joining the suit.

As for what is a fair price for your legal services, that is a difficult question. $1200 is certainly not exorbitant, but I also don't exactly understand what I would be getting. When I think of the $1.2 million that your firm would be collecting, that is a lot of money. I would think it could easily employ three attorneys and three staff to work on the case full time for a year.

If it is $1.2 million to file some papers and make some phone calls, and do a few weeks worth of work... well that might feel a little different.

Could you give any insight on why or why wouldn't you be willing to work for a percentage of what is recovered?

Perhaps a hybrid model, everyone pays 1 BTC to participate at first. Beyond that initial payment, you are working for 10% of what is recovered.

That would give me more comfort because I have to pay out less initially and I would know our interests were aligned. There is a chance you would end up getting a big payout for your services, so it seems fair to your firm as well.

bitcoinsolicitor

member

Activity: 73

Merit: 10

Bitcoin Lawyer in Kensington, London

The pricing is 2 BTC for initial legal costs = $1200, if you get near 1k people that is over 1 million dollars before we get started. Fully aware this would cost huge amounts with individual cases.

Yes we have been contacted by approx 1000 people. We have people who have lost 1 BTC or less and others who have lost many thousand. For some people unfortunately our proposal will not be viable.

We may release a second proposal for smaller claims at a later date.

1.) Approximately how much extra could be charged from selachii if the MtGox case goes further?

This is impossible to accurately answer. If there are enough validated claims from a certain jurisdiction then there may be enough funds to issue a claim if necessary. If further funds are required then a new proposal will be provided.

Please note that the fee is not just for a potential group action and includes the following:

(i) The written Opinion from Counsel referred to above, with regular updates as your case progresses.
(ii) Management of your claim generally
(iii) Negotiation with Lawyers instructed by Mt. Gox (and others)
(iv) Engaging in the Bankruptcy proceedings
(v) Liaising with law firms in USA/Japan and any other relevant jurisdictions in respect of issuing class action proceedings.

2.) Is the 2 btc refunded if MtGox open for business in say a weeks time & have the ability to pay everyone back?

Please see above. If Counsel have started work on your matter and advice has been provided then no refund would be due. It would be brilliant news if everyone was paid back by Mt Gox in two weeks

3.) Why 2 btc? (Dont always have to round up to whole bitcoins if pricing things in bitcoins guys Smiley). There is no price break down for the 2 btc.

Why does no one query this with fiat currency pricing? Often services and products are for sale for £10 or £100 or £9.99 or £99.99. Rarely do you see fixed fixed service prices at £9.34 or £913.45 etc

Obviously we did have a choice here when pricing our service.

We could have said £749.41 GBP (which is an odd number ) and let people choose to pay with GBP or BTC.

FYI you can still pay the fee in GBP / Pound Sterling.

Note: I will personally find 2btc amazing value with some kind of result or guarantee btw

Thank you - we think so too. It is not cheap to retain the services of a QC and Barrister to work on these matters. However it is simply not possible to guarantee success in any type of litigation.

4.) Will selachii be waiting to see MtGox's plan for rehabilitation before charging any clients?

As per above

Please note proposal includes:

(iv) Engaging in the Bankruptcy proceedings
(v) Liaising with law firms in USA/Japan and any other relevant jurisdictions in respect of issuing class action proceedings.

5.) Will clients be asked to pay 2btc before knowing insurance policy details/potential success of any claims?

The 2 BTC is for:

(i) The written Opinion from Counsel referred to above, with regular updates as your case progresses.
(ii) Management of your claim generally
(iii) Negotiation with Lawyers instructed by Mt. Gox (and others)
(iv) Engaging in the Bankruptcy proceedings
(v) Liaising with law firms in USA/Japan and any other relevant jurisdictions in respect of issuing class action proceedings.

It is not possible to advise of individual success of claims until Counsel have reviewed full details. This is why we have asked for the 'Information Questionnaire' and any documentary evidence of losses.

Insurance will only become relevant if a claim is issued. If this needs to happen a quote will be provided. The cost will be shared between claimants. More claimants = less to pay

I really think you should hold off on charging 2 btc until we know more from Mtgox or another idea would be charge for an application admin fee & any any initial legal work up to this point. The negotiation cost could come later.

What do you think is a fair fee?

Thank you for your questions and comments.

For a fast answer to any questions please email info(at)selachii.co.uk

Topic: Selachii LLP Law Firm's Initial Gox Plan - page 2. (Read 14019 times)