Topic: Shamir's Secret Sharing based Wallet - Cypherock X1 (Read 455 times)
After careful scrutiny, Cypherock X1 has been listed on the official Bitcoin.org website - https://bitcoin.org/en/wallets/hardware/?platform=hardware&step=5
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Thank you for the above explanations, but I still need clarification about how the executor can help a nominee in the estate recovery process.
Think of the executor as someone who has technical know hows but does not have have financial skin in the same. This is could be your family friend. Again it is optional and you can completely choose against nominating someone here.
After careful scrutiny, Cypherock X1 has been listed on the official Bitcoin.org website - https://bitcoin.org/en/wallets/hardware/?platform=hardware&step=5
Its a little different. Unlike the nominee, the helper won't know upfront that he is a helper. It is again optional.
Thank you for the above explanations, but I still need clarification about how the executor can help a nominee in the estate recovery process.- Despite not getting the whole picture yet, I think it'd be better to assign someone willing to act as the helper than assigning someone who might end up not helping the nominee at all.
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Besides it is more cost effective. In my estimation it requires 3 flash drives/SDcards ( two of them as a backup just for the case) ~ $8-10 to keep SSS blob and two pgp HW key (again one for backup, ~$60) and of this for all period, let's take 25 years. Your solution for the same period will cost $25 x 25 + cost of hardware (silver plan) or $100 x 25 + cost of hardware (gold plan) 
You should add the legal costs to this.
Adding the legal will cost nothing to users who already have their wills. To include into the will just an envelope with SSS blob will cost nothing.
Here you are the cost for hardware needed.
2GB Flash Drive - $5.68 . And you can get even cheaper if buy such things in pack. Just do a search.
Security Key C NFC (for setting up pgp key) - $29.00
Looks much cheaper than your hardware, isn't it.
And besides, no 3rd party.
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Besides it is more cost effective. In my estimation it requires 3 flash drives/SDcards ( two of them as a backup just for the case) ~ $8-10 to keep SSS blob and two pgp HW key (again one for backup, ~$60) and of this for all period, let's take 25 years. Your solution for the same period will cost $25 x 25 + cost of hardware (silver plan) or $100 x 25 + cost of hardware (gold plan)
You should add the legal costs to this.
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Cypherock Cover, the scheme that makes the simple stuff unfeasibly large and bulky.
Speaking of inheritance itself. Split SEED phrase into SSS blobs using 2 of 3 scheme. Encrypt each blob with your hardware based pgp key (How the setup such keys is described here). Give one of the encrypted blobs and HW security key to your nominee. Include one of the remaining encrypted blobs into you legal will with assigned nominee as the lawful beneficiary under will. Instruct lawyer to hand over this will to nominee after your passing.As simple as that. A simple and reliable inheritance plan that doesn't require Cypherock Cover.
Speaking of inheritance itself. Split SEED phrase into SSS blobs using 2 of 3 scheme. Encrypt each blob with your hardware based pgp key (How the setup such keys is described here). Give one of the encrypted blobs and HW security key to your nominee. Include one of the remaining encrypted blobs into you legal will with assigned nominee as the lawful beneficiary under will. Instruct lawyer to hand over this will to nominee after your passing.As simple as that. A simple and reliable inheritance plan that doesn't require Cypherock Cover.
You don't know how difficult that is for 99% of the people to do what you just described. So many ways you can screw things up and prevent the assets from being inheritable. Not to forget how expensive it can be to update this setup over time relative to our solution.
Time is flying and who knows what will happen with Cypherock (and as consequence with all its so called inheritance scheme) let's say in 25 years
Solution I have proposed is in the hands of people rather than of 3rd company .
Besides it is more cost effective. In my estimation it requires 3 flash drives/SDcards ( two of them as a backup just for the case) ~ $8-10 to keep SSS blob and two pgp HW key (again one for backup, ~$60) and of this for all period, let's take 25 years. Your solution for the same period will cost $25 x 25 + cost of hardware (silver plan) or $100 x 25 + cost of hardware (gold plan)
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Would you mind sharing the rough estimates of the costs for both of the plans?
We are going with $25/wallet/year for silver plan which includes just PIN recovery and $100/wallet/year for gold plan which includes estate recovery also.
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Am I correct in assuming that there aren't any inactivity checks for nominee #1?
Yes
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- Not sure if I'm just being pessimistic, but I do have mixed feelings about the second nominee option.
You can choose not to have nominee #2. Its optional.
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Does the executor have a similar set of requirements to the nominees?
Its a little different. Unlike the nominee, the helper won't know upfront that he is a helper. It is again optional.
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Cypherock Cover, the scheme that makes the simple stuff unfeasibly large and bulky.
Speaking of inheritance itself. Split SEED phrase into SSS blobs using 2 of 3 scheme. Encrypt each blob with your hardware based pgp key (How the setup such keys is described here). Give one of the encrypted blobs and HW security key to your nominee. Include one of the remaining encrypted blobs into you legal will with assigned nominee as the lawful beneficiary under will. Instruct lawyer to hand over this will to nominee after your passing.As simple as that. A simple and reliable inheritance plan that doesn't require Cypherock Cover.
Speaking of inheritance itself. Split SEED phrase into SSS blobs using 2 of 3 scheme. Encrypt each blob with your hardware based pgp key (How the setup such keys is described here). Give one of the encrypted blobs and HW security key to your nominee. Include one of the remaining encrypted blobs into you legal will with assigned nominee as the lawful beneficiary under will. Instruct lawyer to hand over this will to nominee after your passing.As simple as that. A simple and reliable inheritance plan that doesn't require Cypherock Cover.
You don't know how difficult that is for 99% of the people to do what you just described. So many ways you can screw things up and prevent the assets from being inheritable. Not to forget how expensive it can be to update this setup over time relative to our solution.
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Do people really use hardware wallets for long term? Most of the people I know use them for more security in their hot storage and use other methods for long term cold storage.
Yes, you would be surprised at how many actually.
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Admittedly Dave and the people he discusses crypto with is a very small sample size. Has there been any real research done into what / how people are using hardware wallets for.
Long term? Short term? Both?
Long term? Short term? Both?
Very hard data to gather to be honest. But if you manage to find it, please do share it here.
We just announced Cypherock Cover, a non-custodial & non-KYC inheritance-style recovery service for all your Crypto - https://twitter.com/rohanagarwal94/status/1782504675620655176
Would you mind sharing the rough estimates of the costs for both of the plans?Quote from: https://www.cypherock.com/blogs/cypherock-cover
Nominee #2 receives the encrypted message 3 months after nominee #1 receives it, which allows nominee #1 to take precedence in estate recovery but still ensures recovery in case nominee #1 is also deceased.
Am I correct in assuming that there aren't any inactivity checks for nominee #1?- Not sure if I'm just being pessimistic, but I do have mixed feelings about the second nominee option.
Quote from: https://www.cypherock.com/blogs/cypherock-cover
Additionally, the user can also define an executor as part of the setup who does not have any financial stake but can be assigned as a helper by the user in the estate recovery process for the nominee.
Does the executor have a similar set of requirements to the nominees? We just announced Cypherock Cover, a non-custodial & non-KYC inheritance-style recovery service for all your Crypto - https://twitter.com/rohanagarwal94/status/1782504675620655176
Cypherock Cover,the scheme that makes the simple stuff unfeasibly large and bulky.
Speaking of inheritance itself. Split SEED phrase into SSS blobs using 2 of 3 scheme. Encrypt each blob with your hardware based pgp key (How the setup such keys is described here). Give one of the encrypted blobs and HW security key to your nominee. Include one of the remaining encrypted blobs into you legal will with assigned nominee as the lawful beneficiary under will. Instruct lawyer to hand over this will to nominee after your passing.As simple as that. A simple and reliable inheritance plan that doesn't require Cypherock Cover.
From: https://www.cypherock.com/blogs/cypherock-cover
Do people really use hardware wallets for long term? Most of the people I know use them for more security in their hot storage and use other methods for long term cold storage.
Admittedly Dave and the people he discusses crypto with is a very small sample size. Has there been any real research done into what / how people are using hardware wallets for.
Long term? Short term? Both?
-Dave
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As discussed, most people buy a hardware wallet to hold Crypto assets for the long term
Do people really use hardware wallets for long term? Most of the people I know use them for more security in their hot storage and use other methods for long term cold storage.
Admittedly Dave and the people he discusses crypto with is a very small sample size. Has there been any real research done into what / how people are using hardware wallets for.
Long term? Short term? Both?
-Dave
We just announced Cypherock Cover, a non-custodial & non-KYC inheritance-style recovery service for all your Crypto - https://twitter.com/rohanagarwal94/status/1782504675620655176
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No offence to you or your product since I have never had the chance to try one or read much about it, but I wouldn't trust CoinBureu to be a neutral source of information. I have seen many of his videos and have no complaints regarding the quality, but many of his content is sponsored and even paid-for-promotion.
I completely understand your concern and we know a lot of wallets that paid them for a review. However as written in the review itself, we did not pay them anything upfront at all. All we gave them are a couple of devices and an affiliate commission for every sale which is standard for every reviewer.
Cypherock X1 became the highest rated hardware wallet by Coinbureau - https://www.coinbureau.com/review/cypherock-review
No offence to you or your product since I have never had the chance to try one or read much about it, but I wouldn't trust CoinBureu to be a neutral source of information. I have seen many of his videos and have no complaints regarding the quality, but many of his content is sponsored and even paid-for-promotion.
Cypherock X1 became the highest rated hardware wallet by Coinbureau - https://www.coinbureau.com/review/cypherock-review
Cypherock X1 now ships with a Hard Case - https://twitter.com/CypherockWallet/status/1719697106984972728
- Comes FREE as part of the packaging
- Is a Faraday Cage to protect against unintended EM waves
- Use it to keep other hardware wallets along with your Cypherock X1 safe against scratches
- It is Dust & Water Resistant
We got reviewed by Athena Alpha - https://www.athena-alpha.com/cypherock-x1-review/
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OK, got it. The positive thing is that users have an option to view their seed phrases and could make offline backups of them if they wanted. If I forget the PIN to my cards, is there a way to reset it? Or, will I have to order a brand new set of cards?
There is no way to reset it. Instead of deleting the wallet which could be more catastrophic if the user forgets the PIN, we decided to implement a time exponential function instead. After 3 wrong attempts, the timer to enter a new PIN attempt increases exponentially upto 100 years. You can as you mentioned can order new cards.
For people who think they can forget the PIN, we advise the user to backup the PIN somewhere which is still exponentially more secure than backing up a seed phrase. We will as mentioned also launch a no-KYC inheritance service soon that will allow users to recover the forgotten PIN also apart from passing on the assets to their loved ones.
It is actually the same. There are still only 4 cards. The thing you are getting confused is that one of the shards is also stored on the device. Hence you need 1 device + 1 card or 2 cards (along with PIN if set) to view the seed phrase or make a transaction.
OK, got it. The positive thing is that users have an option to view their seed phrases and could make offline backups of them if they wanted. If I forget the PIN to my cards, is there a way to reset it? Or, will I have to order a brand new set of cards? Jump to: