Should Online Casinos Publish Their Bankroll? Your Thoughts? - page 2.

JackpotRacer

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Quote from: Wapfika on March 15, 2024, 06:00:32 AM

Quote from: JackpotRacer on March 14, 2024, 07:04:01 AM

Let's start a discussion and delve into the pros and cons of this proposal. Your insights and opinions are greatly appreciated!

This kind of bankroll proof is always a request since before to the casino way back when online casino is still new since they often come and go when someone win big to avoid paying big time. But right now most of the casino has a license and backed by private company that fund their bankroll.

I personally like the proof of bankroll but I’m not sure if they will accept this proposal because casino operators usually doesn’t want to disclose an information like this if they are already paying a lot of their whale players withdrawal request.

Quote

Please refrain from personal attacks and insulting me or any other member as this is a serious issue and should be discussed accordingly.

Using blue color is not good in the eyes to read. Please use the regular black text. Not an attack. Cheesy

first of all thank you for your comment to this interesting discussion!

regarding Blue text please understand that this forum gives users many text format options and I use it. I can change the color to green but then users might say they don't like green Wink

so if you don't like Blue I will change to Green. also not meant as an attack or offense Cheesy

the color problem should not be a problem but as I don't want to go off topic I might open another thread with a poll with color usage or not.

thanks again and hope to get more interesting views on or main Subject

Ruttoshi

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I will say that there is no need to casino to show the public what they have in their bankroll, because that is not what a gambler is after but to gamble and win big. Bankroll can be used to deceive gamblers, and this can be done by borrowing money from whoever, and showcase that money as theirs. Who will be able to know that the funds is not for the casino. I think that the casino reputation is better than the casino showing their bankroll.

One thing that makes me not to buy the idea of showing bankroll is that scammers can use this pattern to scam gamblers of their funds after a short time by not allowing winners to withdraw or even come up with different excuses to make sure that people continue gambling, whereas the casino is planning to go on exit, and nobody will sense it is same because you are seeing their bankroll. It is also risky as the casino will be vulnerable to attack

aioc

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I don't think casinos will do that, it will become a battle of bankroll the higher the bankroll the chances that the gamblers will pick them to play and some casinos will try to manipulate their bankroll to inflate it to make it appear that they are bigger.

The gambling platform needs to protect itself and it will expose itself if its flow of cash is available online, there are other ways to know if the casino is big, and it is based on how it markets its platform and how transparent and reputable they are, big casinos will not scam players for a few thousands.

PX-Z

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Quote from: Jawhead999 on March 15, 2024, 05:44:01 AM

because whenever I see a casino site, it must be a site that has a lot money in there, especially if they have many advertisement.

The questions is how much is this "a lot money". Plus not all casinos have ads, while some have smaller and other have huge budget. No one knows to be exact.

Those info are confidential/private because it can be manipulated by other casinos by public perception comparing that X casinos is better because X casino have this and that. Also, even it is shared publicly if its not audited by third party to proved that those numbers are correct, it's useless. Security reason because it can attract malicious actors by any means.

Wapfika

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Quote from: JackpotRacer on March 14, 2024, 07:04:01 AM

Let's start a discussion and delve into the pros and cons of this proposal. Your insights and opinions are greatly appreciated!

This kind of bankroll proof is always a request since before to the casino way back when online casino is still new since they often come and go when someone win big to avoid paying big time. But right now most of the casino has a license and backed by private company that fund their bankroll.

I personally like the proof of bankroll but I’m not sure if they will accept this proposal because casino operators usually doesn’t want to disclose an information like this if they are already paying a lot of their whale players withdrawal request.

Quote

Please refrain from personal attacks and insulting me or any other member as this is a serious issue and should be discussed accordingly.

Using blue color is not good in the eyes to read. Please use the regular black text. Not an attack. Cheesy

Jawhead999

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They don't want to report their bankroll in order to prevent from paying high tax, most businessmen will try to find a way to pay tax as low as possible.

Since there's no company, entity and a lot gamblers force a casino to publish their bankroll to public, the casino won't need to publish their bankroll.

Quote from: PX-Z on March 14, 2024, 06:28:37 PM

But i don't think all casinos should do that for security and privacy reasons.

I'm not sure if security and privacy reasons are matters because whenever I see a casino site, it must be a site that has a lot money in there, especially if they have many advertisement.

JackpotRacer

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Quote from: Davidvictorson on March 14, 2024, 01:11:05 PM

Whati think would have captured the overall view of the community would be if you had created a poll. It would have been interesting to see their votes and them read their views.

Thanks for the comment. I thought about adding a poll, but then I was afraid that many spammers will just vote and not comment.
I don't think I can add a poll now, even if I want to, because I didn't find the option.

I would like to thank all the members who gave their opinion in such a great and productive way. Interesting that there are so many different pros and cons and really gives more food for thought if there is a fair way to solve this.

I hope we can agree that today's players prefer to play only Provably Fair games, and will check casinos to see if they offer Provably Fair games.

Casinos also have rules for Minimum and Maximum wagers of each game. Means that their Maximum wager should be adjusted to their Bank Roll.

The following comments jumped out at me, not saying it is the holy grail, but IMHO there should be a holy grail for the bank roll and that players cannot be cheated out of their deposits. I agree that the license providers should play a bigger role in validating the bank roll of the casino.

Quote from: OgNasty on March 14, 2024, 12:38:11 PM

On one hand it is their money and if they are privately owned it is nobody’s business. However, gamblers should be entitled to know their deposits are accounted for and that there is money to be won. Not to mention Bitcoin makes it possible to do easily, so it makes a lot of sense for casinos to prove a portion of their reserves on the blockchain.

Quote from: yahoo62278 on March 14, 2024, 03:18:54 PM

I can see arguments for both sides and I feel like OgNasty said it pretty good.

Players should know that their money is safe and if they win a casino has the funds to pay them out. I'm not sure casinos would agree to disclose their funds though, they might be open to disclosing to a private company or to their licensing provider and they get a seal showing they have proved they have x amount of funds.

Quote from: Potato Chips on March 14, 2024, 05:19:25 PM

That would certainly give a boost to players confidence but their sheets has to be audited by a reliable third party otherwise the concept is fragile and may even create a false sense of security.

SeaCoinCollector.

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I agree with most players that disclosing an online casinos bankroll can get positive impact to players, especially those who are seeking transparency, trust, and high roller. But still, there are pros and cons. For example, online casinos may subject to manipulation or unfair practices with the transparency of their funds. Disclosing their funds can also lead to potential cyber threats, making them a target of hackers. And lastly, the fluctuations of online casino bankroll can affect the players that can lead to speculations and concerns about their stability.

passwordnow

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This is like asking exchanges for their proof of reserve. Well, we've got different thoughts about this but for me, once a casino is reputable I don't have to ask anything from them. They've already proven themselves to be trustworthy and have that huge bankroll for a very long time and you can see them spend a lot of money from sponsoring clubs and celebrities and I know that it is part of the marketing but the money that they've been producing by having those collaborations are more than enough the slice of the pie to prove that they have money.

Anyway, if a casino is being asked to do that, they're free to comply or not as there are no laws in the online world unless their local government tries to ask them for proof of that reserve for their operations. I think this is more applicable if the casino is starting out to show that they can sustain the operations and if ever some players win big against them. With that, they're attracting more users to come to them by showing that even they're just new, they've already prepared their bankroll and anyone can potentially win big and they'd give that profit to the lucky winners.

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Quote from: JackpotRacer on March 14, 2024, 07:04:01 AM

I'm aware that there are different perspectives on this issue, and I'm eager to hear what the community thinks. Do you think that online casinos should disclose their bankrolls? Why or why not? And if so, what measures could be implemented to ensure accuracy and reliability in reporting?

Much more than on exchanges, I believe that this balance can be highly manipulable.
Well, let's disregard the resources that are possibly in a cold-wallet that could be editable.
The "on-chain" feature will vary greatly from one day to the next, depending on the number of players, the promotions and bonuses offered and also the luck of the day between the house and its users.
At various times the "balance" will not be consistent, as the sites mostly operate with fictitious money (like any financial entity) and only count what actually leaves or enters their wallets.

What I mean is... Let's say a site has 1kk in balance and today it lost 5kk to some lucky players, would it be bankrupt? Obviously not, as this balance could be covered by profits from the following days, as withdrawals are also not immediate and lucky players may continue playing and even lose the amount they previously won.

PX-Z

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I knew someone (social media influencer) who own an online casino (local based) that always shows his casino and also its bankroll, the total deposit, withdrawals, and the total net profit on X month. It's not so huge casinos like Stake but it shows thousands of $ on monthly deposits and withdrawals.

But i don't think all casinos should do that for security and privacy reasons.

alani123

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So long as a casino has clear rules on how much you can win and actually doesn't let you bet more than reasonably expecting to hit above the multiplier then I think they are good. No need to publish the bankroll if they can afford to pay our.

The issue some have faced is the casino allowing them to bet an amount that lead them to win above the max win, which is an issue on the side of the casino's design in my view.

Potato Chips

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That would certainly give a boost to players confidence but their sheets has to be audited by a reliable third party otherwise the concept is fragile and may even create a false sense of security.

For starters, we would need to know their liabilities because this could put a dent on their cash flows/balance depending on how big it is. As others have mentioned, they could cheat their way on this by loaning as well.

danherbias07

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Transparency is cool but I don't think it should be mandated. For start-up gambling businesses, showing their bankroll will probably boost their number of clients, but for the oldies gambling sites like Stake.com and Sportsbet.io, I don't think they will need this anymore. They are both popular in the business and I have not seen any problem that can be considered to make them release their bankroll to be transparent if they can pay or not.
High-rollers will be the ones who can identify this and there's not been a case of a high-roller saying they are not paid by the gambling sites that I mentioned.

If I start a gambling site, I'd do this. Publish my bankroll. It's good for both ends. Let the gamblers know that you have the money and maybe that will be the spark of a good number of players in your business.

uneng

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Quote from: coolcoinz on March 14, 2024, 02:32:19 PM

P.
-Transparency. Showing an address with their bankroll and signing a message with it shows people the business is real and can be trusted. It of course can be faked because you can ask someone rich to vouch for you, while your real address is much smaller, but it's a step in the right direction and if any analysts prove that it was manipulated your company will take a PR hit.

It shows the business has the money, but it doesn't totally ensure the platform is trustful, as a replenished wallet can be used just as a bait to encourage gamblers into believing the service is legit, although their real intentions might be to scam gamblers at some point. In my opinion, to publish a bankroll doesn't mean anything. Scammers can have wallets full of money and still scam people. It takes more than a proof of funds to consolidate a business as a genuine and reputable one.

At same time, big platforms which move huge money in a daily basis might not feel comfortable sharing their numbers publicly for different reasons, which vary from triggering hackers attention to triggering criticisms from internet users, although they are still much more reputable than some random casinos publishing their bankroll sizes on the internet.

Sandra_hakeem

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Quote from: JackpotRacer on March 14, 2024, 07:04:01 AM

Do you think that online casinos should disclose their bankrolls? Why or why not? And if so, what measures could be implemented to ensure accuracy and reliability in reporting?

good question but I had to put out the blue ink as there was already too much of it on your post...

The casinos are to decide whether on not they'd wanna try convincing people with that avenue... It could be a way of improving on their privacy if they're not posting it...why would they choose to listen to anyone? To me, 'em bankrolls and payment receipts looks really fake when I get on a site and the first thing that gets my attention is a bar of gliding flyout, showing these receipts.

Sandra 🧑‍🦰

Casdinyard

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Quote from: JackpotRacer on March 14, 2024, 07:04:01 AM

I am starting this thread and question as in a recent discussion a member answered me to my posting:

>my opinion is that legit casinos should publish the bankroll amount as I think a big bankroll will attract big and small players and a small bankroll will only attract small players if at all.

His answer:
I don't think this is really that necessary though I do agree with you that this move will definitely attract really big players to the casino if their bankroll is large enough, and would also raise the casino's reputation and customer's trust for them to the roof tops, but still, making this information public is still in the casino's descretion, it's up to them to decide to do it

IMHO By making the bankroll publicly available, online casinos would demonstrate their commitment to accountability and fair play.

I'm aware that there are different perspectives on this issue, and I'm eager to hear what the community thinks. Do you think that online casinos should disclose their bankrolls? Why or why not? And if so, what measures could be implemented to ensure accuracy and reliability in reporting?

Let's start a discussion and delve into the pros and cons of this proposal. Your insights and opinions are greatly appreciated!

I look forward to hearing your thoughts.

PS
Please refrain from personal attacks and insulting me or any other member as this is a serious issue and should be discussed accordingly.

The confidence of a person on a casino doesn't lie on how much their bankroll is. It lies solely on whether they are fun to play in, are they accommodating, and/or are they reputable in the industry. once a casino reaches these three criterias it's always a surefire shot that they'd be successful already, no more need for them to be liquid or whatever.

Besides, a successful casino wouldn't have to prove to their players that they can pay them, after all the intent here is to show the players what they stand to win, not the other way around. By showing the players that they have the bankroll to support their winnings it may even come across as them compensating for a massive flaw, which may deter users from gambling since why in the hell are you telling your people that you can pay them, it's like a rapper flaunting benjamins on a music video.

There's no need for casinos to flaunt or to inspire confidence to their users by means of showing them they are liquid. It may even be a detriment to the casino in many instances, and it doesn't really inspire that much confidence amongst the users as much as first-hand experiences do.

darkangel11

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They should, but what they should do and what they will do are two different things. IMO all businesses should be transparent but we were in a traditional fiat system for so long that we're used to them hiding their assets behind bank secrecy acts and all that bullshit. What is there to protect the individual also protects the government, funds, asset managers and giants like google.
We could let them know that by doing so they will get more clients and become more trusted? If it became more competitive they'd have to do it to gain an edge over other casinos.

yahoo62278

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I can see arguments for both sides and I feel like OgNasty said it pretty good.

Quote from: OgNasty on March 14, 2024, 12:38:11 PM

On one hand it is their money and if they are privately owned it is nobody’s business. However, gamblers should be entitled to know their deposits are accounted for and that there is money to be won. Not to mention Bitcoin makes it possible to do easily, so it makes a lot of sense for casinos to prove a portion of their reserves on the blockchain.

Players should know that their money is safe and if they win a casino has the funds to pay them out. I'm not sure casinos would agree to disclose their funds though, they might be open to disclosing to a private company or to their licensing provider and they get a seal showing they have proved they have x amount of funds.

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Quote from: Findingnemo on March 14, 2024, 02:12:12 PM

Letting the bankroll for the public will create security concerns because if it's big amount then the hackers might target more attacks on specific casinos than they usually do and this may result in breach as well so let it be the casino's choice whether the bankroll is known for public or only for themselves.

Another possibility can be making it visible only for top tier players that can satisfy what you are asking and also mitigate the security concerns.

This is also my concern, transparency is not bad but if you are in crypto better to hide important details about your platform so you can avoid hackers from getting interested in your business, I don’t think big crypto casinos will ever do this, exposing bankrolls will always have a pros and cons, and casinos chooses the safest side as always.

Topic: Should Online Casinos Publish Their Bankroll? Your Thoughts? - page 2. (Read 502 times)