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Topic: Should we enable the Crypti owners to trade their holdings right now? - page 2. (Read 3810 times)

hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 502
Stick to the schedule and stop changing opinions all the time !  We had enough when you changed IPO rules !

Stick to the plan and release at the original schedule and meanwhile work on your product !

Please point me to any pre-sale rule that was "changed" after the pre-sale started, other then the max cap, which was only introduced after a wide community request.
This poll was born after same multiple requests, both in public and in private, to us and to Bter. Thanks to the ledger, we already know exactly how much Crypti Bter will get, and if early trading enabled, Bter will simply send these Crypti to the withdrawing accounts.

The work on Crypti is proceeding as scheduled, with the ledger being updated today with all remaining issues fixed, and the new PoS being tested. We will post soon the first dev post in the blog, outlining the ongoing work in progress.
hero member
Activity: 700
Merit: 500
Member of the Crypti Foundation Board of Directors
Think there is consensus to start trading CRSALE. Please start asap otherwise it's useless because launch is near.
nod~~~~

Yeah, might as well rush this, so they can do a pre-sale really quickly, seeing as the actual sale is right around the corner anyway. So let's change the rules of the ipo. It's crazy.

And as stated, it messes up the sell-back terms as stated in the ipo to begin with. I also wonder how many that are so eager for this early pre-sale simply want to dump so they can buy into the Ether IPO? It may be a coincidence, but the max coin offer for Ether ends in around 12 days, which may explain why people can't wait a measly 16 or so days for this to hit a marketplace normally.

Yes, many will sell just enough CXX shares to get back their original investment and let the profit ride for awhile.  Then either sit on the BTC and wait for the price of CXX to drop and then buy, or invest in Etherium.

Sounds bad, but it will allow the investment by those that were waiting for the last few days of the 30 day sale to invest in the coin now.

hero member
Activity: 1204
Merit: 509
Think there is consensus to start trading CRSALE. Please start asap otherwise it's useless because launch is near.
nod~~~~

Yeah, might as well rush this, so they can do a pre-sale really quickly, seeing as the actual sale is right around the corner anyway. So let's change the rules of the ipo. It's crazy.

And as stated, it messes up the sell-back terms as stated in the ipo to begin with. I also wonder how many that are so eager for this early pre-sale simply want to dump so they can buy into the Ether IPO? It may be a coincidence, but the max coin offer for Ether ends in around 12 days, which may explain why people can't wait a measly 16 or so days for this to hit a marketplace normally.
hero member
Activity: 700
Merit: 500
Member of the Crypti Foundation Board of Directors
ONE IMPORTANT DETAIL has been overlooked:

Once trading starts for per-coins, the ability to get a refund on your pre-sale investment ends.

SOOOOOOO...... if the price goes down, tough luck

Looks like the average price in the pre-sale comes to 1140 satoshi per CXX
legendary
Activity: 3836
Merit: 4969
Doomed to see the future and unable to prevent it
I don't think a simple majority vote should suffice as many investors will not even check back until the agreed on launch date and have no clue this poll is up. It is impossible to check on every investment continuously and when a date is set it should be adhered to. If not then the trust is already eroded. Especially with big investors that will no longer trust future announcements. This really should not even be a discussion.
full member
Activity: 840
Merit: 100
Oikos.cash | Decentralized Finance on Tron
Think there is consensus to start trading CRSALE. Please start asap otherwise it's useless because launch is near.
nod~~~~
legendary
Activity: 2898
Merit: 1017
нeт!

Stick to the schedule and stop changing opinions all the time !  We had enough when you changed IPO rules !

Stick to the plan and release at the original schedule and meanwhile work on your product !

sr. member
Activity: 364
Merit: 250
Think there is consensus to start trading CRSALE. Please start asap otherwise it's useless because launch is near.
U
full member
Activity: 503
Merit: 106
The presale should have been hosted on Nxt platform.
over
legendary
Activity: 938
Merit: 1000
The presale should have been hosted on Nxt platform.
member
Activity: 84
Merit: 10
It is a good idea.Because that the IPO of ETH has made people  revaluate the value of crypti.Some people complain themself no to join the ipo of crypti on time .so,I think there are some request to re-join the pre-sale of crypti in the marketing and it is also helpful to relocation the value of crypti ipo. The pre-sale of pre-coin is also a promotion activity before the lanuch of real coins and useful to improve the marketing cap of the coin.
sr. member
Activity: 458
Merit: 250
Genesis investors knew the rules when they invested. They were put to their election and bought shares, knowing full well that the IPO shares/coins would not be publicly tradable until 10 August 2014.

Although early trading may benefit some, this is my feeling. Seems unprofessional or even opportunistic to change the plan. Some genesis investors may be relying on the rules as originally stated.
hero member
Activity: 518
Merit: 500
So how will the bonus % work if CRSALE is being traded? The bonus % will be attached to the bter account opposed to the CRSALE stake?

The CRSALE will be converted to a new token that will be the amount you purchased (including the bonus %) that would be trade-able on BTER. The only difference from that and a normal currency at that point is that you cannot withdraw the coins and you aren't yet paying transaction fees on the network (as it doesn't exist). The ability to withdraw the funds and the introduction of transaction fees would occur when the blockchain becomes active on the 10th.
hero member
Activity: 700
Merit: 500
Member of the Crypti Foundation Board of Directors
So how will the bonus % work if CRSALE is being traded? The bonus % will be attached to the bter account opposed to the CRSALE stake?

They are converting the CRShares to pre-coins
hero member
Activity: 1204
Merit: 509

Also, a marketplace has to be flexible for changing conditions.  The 30 day investment period was ended after 5 days.  This left many out of the market.  

To buy BTC from Coinbase, there is a 4 day escrow wait from purchase to delivery.  Some investors were still in the 4 day escrow when the sale ended.

Thing is, allowing trading now doesn't mean those who missed the IPO can get in at IPO prices during an early sale. They missed it... which is sort of the point to investing in an IPO to begin with, take a risk, or wait until the coin hits the markets. There supposedly was also this cap/waiting list stuff too, so those who want out during the wait period until release can still sell back and get their funds. And those on the waiting list could still, however unlikely it may be, get coins at ipo prices.

I expect the majority of those who want this are simply impatient investors, those who want constant action, or see their btc tied up in crypti for two weeks, wanting to put it somewhere else. But they knew the rules beforehand, so I don't see how the fact that the ipo sold out quickly really changes any of those rules.... or why it should.

Again, just seems so unnecessary to me.
legendary
Activity: 1146
Merit: 1000
So how will the bonus % work if CRSALE is being traded? The bonus % will be attached to the bter account opposed to the CRSALE stake?
hero member
Activity: 700
Merit: 500
Member of the Crypti Foundation Board of Directors
Two measly weeks. NEM will be like 8-9 months of delay... Ether will be like 6 months or so. For them, I could understand it. But people can't wait two weeks here? Again, more trouble than its worth in my opinion.

While I certainly understand your concerns, both us (the launch team) and Bter were contacted multiple times with the requests to allow early trading, as there apparently quite some sellers who willing to divest early, and quite some buyers who missed the pre-sale window and now looking to purchase a stake.

Giving trading experience earlier then planned (rather then forcing people escrow and swap their Bter accounts arround) seems the most reasonable solution, hence we are looking for the community opinion on this now.

If they need funds so badly, can't they just sell their stakes back? I mean, wasn't that sort of the point of the entire cap limit/waiting list thing? Those on the waiting list may also feel a bit cheated, as instead of letting people sell back, you are opening up trading early.

And people will most likely vote yes, because many strangely have such short attention spans, and trade like they are sitting at a table at Vegas. But it doesn't mean it's really the right way to go with this. If a coin has rules before the IPO is run, it should use those same rules afterwards.



Also, a marketplace has to be flexible for changing conditions.  The 30 day investment period was ended after 5 days.  This left many out of the market. 

To buy BTC from Coinbase, there is a 4 day escrow wait from purchase to delivery.  Some investors were still in the 4 day escrow when the sale ended.
hero member
Activity: 700
Merit: 500
Member of the Crypti Foundation Board of Directors
No.

Arguments in favour of allowing early trading are as follows:

(1) Impatient and/or low attention span investors (or investors who could not afford to invest in the ipo and need their money back) should be encouraged to get out.

(2) Ridding the IPO of impatient investors will enable more rapid stabilisation of the market price and will allow the many investors who missed out on the IPO to gain a foothold.

Nevertheless, I vote no. Genesis investors knew the rules when they invested. They were put to their election and bought shares, knowing full well that the IPO shares/coins would not be publicly tradable until 10 August 2014.

I do not care whether or not impatient investors enjoy moving goalposts.

Let them wait until 10 August (by which point the devs and bter will be even better prepared for the launch of a potentially major global currency. The 'instant feedback' twitter/facebook generation could do worse than learn some patience (instead of limiting their education to learning increasingly bizarre methods of taking selfies). Make the non-sentient creatures wait. Its good for them to be deprived of instant gratification.

So I vote no...but shall willingly defer to the majority if most here present prefer to rid themselves now of the impatient so as to give new investors (who missed out on the IPO) a chance to buy shares.



Genesis investors knew the rules when they invested. They were put to their election and bought shares, knowing full well that the IPO shares/coins would not be publicly tradable until 10 August 2014.

Yes, Quantum, but what they did not know is that the pre-sale would end after 4 or 5 days.  Ordinarily, the big money comes in at the end.  But they were encouraged to buy in early by the declining bonus awards. 

Usually a 30 day sale would have a lot of purchases in the beginning, a slow down through the middle, then a surge at the end.

But since the pre-sale ended so quickly, the investment is seen as a sleeper.  Sleeping capital does not earn a return.

hero member
Activity: 1204
Merit: 509
Two measly weeks. NEM will be like 8-9 months of delay... Ether will be like 6 months or so. For them, I could understand it. But people can't wait two weeks here? Again, more trouble than its worth in my opinion.

While I certainly understand your concerns, both us (the launch team) and Bter were contacted multiple times with the requests to allow early trading, as there apparently quite some sellers who willing to divest early, and quite some buyers who missed the pre-sale window and now looking to purchase a stake.

Giving trading experience earlier then planned (rather then forcing people escrow and swap their Bter accounts arround) seems the most reasonable solution, hence we are looking for the community opinion on this now.

If they need funds so badly, can't they just sell their stakes back? I mean, wasn't that sort of the point of the entire cap limit/waiting list thing? Those on the waiting list may also feel a bit cheated, as instead of letting people sell back, you are opening up trading early.

And people will most likely vote yes, because many strangely have such short attention spans, and trade like they are sitting at a table at Vegas. But it doesn't mean it's really the right way to go with this. If a coin has rules before the IPO is run, it should use those same rules afterwards.

hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 502
Two measly weeks. NEM will be like 8-9 months of delay... Ether will be like 6 months or so. For them, I could understand it. But people can't wait two weeks here? Again, more trouble than its worth in my opinion.

While I certainly understand your concerns, both us (the launch team) and Bter were contacted multiple times with the requests to allow early trading, as there apparently quite some sellers who willing to divest early, and quite some buyers who missed the pre-sale window and now looking to purchase a stake.

Giving trading experience earlier then planned (rather then forcing people escrow and swap their Bter accounts arround) seems the most reasonable solution, hence we are looking for the community opinion on this now.
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