Sin City vs Gambling Capital - page 2.

kotajikikox

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Quote from: danherbias07 on November 03, 2024, 09:37:20 AM

I thought you were going to say that the Internet is now the gambling capital of the world. Why? Because most gamblers now are just gambling online rather than paying for an expensive physical casino gambling place. If that's the case, then reputable gambling sites where they are licensed must have the most profits out of it.

Lol you are not wrong. But let us not discount physical casinos because it is not just the gambling that you are paying for but the atmosphere and the entire experience as well. I am sure that gambling in Las Vegas or in Macau is hardly the same as gambling in your pajamas at your own house. Sometimes we want to experience luxury as well and that includes gambling in these physical casinos.

It allows you to bond with your friends and families and even meet new people compared to just being stuck at home. I have no problem with gambling online but if you have the extra money, why not experience what's it's like to play in a physical casino.

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Anyway, I still believe Las Vegas is a well-known place when it comes to casinos. I think it had been drilled to the head of many people although the numbers would not say that anymore. Well, since the population is higher in Asia, Macau will definitely have the highest profits and I think that will keep on going for many years.

We'd have to see because tourists are also a huge part of their profits. Will Macau be able to keep their momentum? and will Vegas pale in comparison? Time can only tell, I guess.

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Quote from: kotajikikox on November 02, 2024, 08:20:34 AM

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Let us discuss!

Exactly!

The US may be more famous because Las Vegas casinos are more accessible to tourists and there is more marketing around it, but the real gambling capital is Macau.

Casinos are one of the biggest sources of income for the Chinese government, which is why Macau once made over 80% of its revenue from casinos alone, but this was only possible after they started investing in Chinese properties and competing for casino licenses, which was the reason behind this massive change as in the past there was only one company with a license to operate casinos.

Macau has also invested heavily in construction and land reclamation projects, since Macau was originally just a peninsula and a few islands. Macau has grown from 12 square kilometers to almost 30 square kilometers... so much so that new land connecting Taipa and Coloane accommodates large casino resorts.

Macau is definitely one of my travel destinations.

danherbias07

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I thought you were going to say that the Internet is now the gambling capital of the world. Why? Because most gamblers now are just gambling online rather than paying for an expensive physical casino gambling place. If that's the case, then reputable gambling sites where they are licensed must have the most profits out of it.

Anyway, I still believe Las Vegas is a well-known place when it comes to casinos. I think it had been drilled to the head of many people although the numbers would not say that anymore. Well, since the population is higher in Asia, Macau will definitely have the highest profits and I think that will keep on going for many years.

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Quote from: GxSTxV on November 03, 2024, 08:41:20 AM

Events are huge for Vegas numbers, like the great events they have drawing in many of tourists. If Macau could host some major events, like international poker tournaments or even big cultural festivals, it could really gain more popularity.

Where are you going to cram all that?
Macau is only 30 sqkm in total, just the city of Las Vegas is ten times larger, not counting the metro region.
Las Vegas is not just a casino, it has golf courses, tens of sports fields, racetracks, and of course the Sphere! Macau's only advantage is that China bans gambling in the rest of the country, if they would allow casinos elsewhere like the US does Macau will be dead in a year.

Quote from: Fiatless on November 02, 2024, 08:49:57 AM

Installing a democratically elected government in China will help in attracting more non-Chinese tourists/gamblers to Macau.

Yup good luck with that, now for a bit of Trivia, China has never had true elections in its entire history, do you think it will happen now or at least this century? I don't even know if Chinese people can even grasp the concept of actually electing their rulers.

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Quote from: Fiatless on November 02, 2024, 08:49:57 AM

Macau's location and political affiliations might limit the growth of the gambling business. The country is a special administrative region of China, and many people will not be comfortable there. The Chinese government's tight societal regulations might discourage foreign travellers from China. Tourists might also be discomforted by China's authoritarian government and abuse of human rights. Expanding its visa and tax-free policies might attract more gamblers. Installing a democratically elected government in China will help in attracting more non-Chinese tourists/gamblers to Macau.
~snip~

I don't know how you even imagine that a democratically elected government could happen in China - first you would have to get rid of the communist party, which controls practically every Chinese and which obviously doesn't mind if it continues like that. However, Macao as such obviously does not bother visitors from Asia and in my opinion there is no reason to make comparisons with Las Vegas, which is the destination of people who want to have fun, and they come from the West.

Even if China becomes a democratic country, does anyone think that people from Canada, UK or Europe would go to gamble in China instead of Las Vegas? Of course, most people who go to the US go to see a lot more than Las Vegas, so that should be taken into account.

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Quote from: kotajikikox on November 02, 2024, 08:20:34 AM

I do think that these events contribute a lot to Las Vegas' GGR since they attract a lot of tourists. For Macau to gain on Las Vegas, what events do you see in the future that should be held or strongly promoted in Macau so that they can continue this momentum of gaining on Vegas? and are there any cities you think can be a surprise to the gambling industry and could potentially threaten both Macau and Las Vegas?

Macau is already the most influent administrative region of the world in gambling matters, but they seem to not be too concerned about maintaining their position in the near future:

Macau, the casino capital of the world, wants to bet on a different economic future before it goes bust

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The local government and Ms Lei want Macau to bet on a different future before it goes bust.

"If another COVID hits, boom, we're gone," Ms Lei said.

Besides the pandemic factor, they also know the world is changing fastly with accessible internet and online betting, so the tendency is that gambling becomes more popular on the virtual environment, while the physical casinos lose traction inside the industry. Naturally, Macau can't put all their tickets on gambling thinking on the economical sustainability of their region.

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Meanwhile, the six multinational casino companies that dominate the economy agreed to invest billions into Macau as a condition of renewing their operating licences.

With such investments, Macau can invest in infrastructure in order to boost another sectors of the society to the next level, becoming less dependent on gambling along the following years. They claim to be focused on financial services, top notch technology, education and TCM, besides tourism.

GxSTxV

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Well, I recently talked about Macau with a friend, which is known to be a great place for casinos. I got pretty excited researching it and even checked out the visa process and turns out we have an open visitor visa, so I will most likely make time for a vacation there soon, especially if someone here tried it before and recommended it.
As for this topic, I totally agree with you, Macau often gets overshadowed by Vegas in people’s minds as they do for many famous placed over the world. Vegas has built up this wild reputation as the go to spot for a crazy time, which is why that what happens in Vegas… . But Macau has been the real deacent place in terms of gaming revenue. With its recent comeback, especially with that 20.5% rise in October’s GGR, it seems like they are on the right path to gaining back their status.

Events are huge for Vegas numbers, like the great events they have drawing in many of tourists. If Macau could host some major events, like international poker tournaments or even big cultural festivals, it could really gain more popularity. Also, I think places like Singapore and maybe Dubai, if they fix their gambling rules, they can become serious competitors.

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I have read a lot about Macau and dream of visiting it. It is truly a gambling mecca (if this comparison is correct).

Some members of the Bitcointalk forum compare Macau to Las Vegas (Sin City). However, this is like arguing about what came first - the chicken or the egg. Maybe Las Vegas imitates Macau (and not the other way around). The Chinese are probably the most gambling people on our planet.

Therefore, the casinos of Macau are amazing.

I dream of visiting casinos such as Oceanus, Legend Palace Hotel Casino, Sands on Largo de Monte Carlo, Rio on Rua de Luis Gonzaga Gomez, 33, Babylon, Casa Real Hotel & Casino Macau, Waldo Casino & Hotel on Avenue D'Amizade and many other legendary casinos of Macau.

I hope that in the future I will realize this dream of mine.

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There are no need to competes between one gambling city to another because they have different things. What they can do is just trying to attract more attentions from the gamblers by giving them exciting promotions.
Each gambler have their own reason why they visit Macau or Vegas and if they are a gambler, they can have a plan to visit on both. The important from the business industry is how the casino can give much promotions to their gambler so they will be back to the casino and spends their money.
Maybe sooner or later some country or city will announce their physical casino because that will depends on how gambling permission in their country. If the government allow gambling, they will push the promotion to invite many gamblers to comes to their country.

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Quote from: Findingnemo on November 03, 2024, 07:26:01 AM

Macau is in China and we all know it's not a country where people doesn't really like to visit compared to Last Vegas and Asia is more conservative towards gambling which might be another reason. Vegas is not only famous for Gambling but also tourism across the world and it's becoming a must visit place in everyone's life.

That is backed by data...

https://vegasprimer.com/las-vegas-visitor-numbers/

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Here are the visitor growth statistics over the past 9 years:

2023: 40,829,900 (+5.15%)
2022: 38,829,300 (+20.47%)
2021: 32,230,600 (69.36%)
2020: 19,031,003 (-55.25%)
2019: 42,524,000 (0.97%)
2018: 42,116,900 (-0.23%)
2017: 42,214,100 (-1.68%)
2016: 42,936,100 (1.47%)
2015: 42,312,216 (2.88%)
2014: 41,126,512

The significant drop in 2020 was likely due to COVID-19 restrictions, but now that those are lifted, things are back to normal, and numbers will keep rising year by year. While Macau does get over 30 million tourists, which is impressive, it still doesn’t surpass Las Vegas.

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Quote from: kotajikikox on November 02, 2024, 08:20:34 AM

and are there any cities you think can be a surprise to the gambling industry and could potentially threaten both Macau and Las Vegas?

In fact, gambling houses, if you look at history throughout time, are in Venice, Italy, the gambling houses there are the oldest gambling houses and to this day, were founded if I'm not mistaken in the 17th century or around 1638, Casinos in Venice are no less competitive with casinos in Macau and Las Vegas.

Casinos in Venice are also not inferior to their competitors, they also provide a variety of classic casino games that can amaze visitors, if I'm not mistaken there are more than 600 slot machines available at the casino.

Indeed, today's world is more popular in Macau and Las Vegas gambling circles, they are like Valentino Rossi vs. Max Biaggi competes with each other in the eyes of tourism, but if you talk about rivals, It is possible that the Casino in Venice can also beat the casinos in Macau and Las Vegas, just adding their best concepts for travelers or tourism.

Findingnemo

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Macau is in China and we all know it's not a country where people doesn't really like to visit compared to Last Vegas and Asia is more conservative towards gambling which might be another reason. Vegas is not only famous for Gambling but also tourism across the world and it's becoming a must visit place in everyone's life.

There are other countries which are also promoting gambling like Singapore but the land is already overwhelming so might not be enough room for further development.

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From a regular person point of view, isnt Las Vegas already gained so much popularity and is already such a cult place, that when someone mention gambling, Las Vegas is among first things that comes into mind? Like Venice is about canal and boats, France is about Eiffel tower and love, Italy is about pizza, Vegas is about gambling. It will be difficult to change that stereotype.

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Quote from: Cryptomultiplier on November 03, 2024, 05:49:12 AM

This is an old debate and for me, no conclusions can be drawn yet as regards the most dominant gambling capital in the world.

What OP shared are figures enough to conclude that Macau now is the gambling capital in the world.

Quote from: Cryptomultiplier on November 03, 2024, 05:49:12 AM

Gambling sure provides a good revenue for the state through taxes and commissions and I know of how Brazil allowed gambling winnings to be taxed until it currently banned gambling activities in the country despite the taxes and regulations.

They ban those that are not complying with the law, others that complied are operational.
So it's misleading to think that gambling is ban in Brazil.

Quote from: Cryptomultiplier on November 03, 2024, 05:49:12 AM

The success of a gambling capital is dependent on the laws and regulations that abide therein and I think one way las Vegas or Macau can retain the number one spot gambling capital is to incorporate the use of AI bots and integrations as well as acceptance of cryptocurrency for placing bets and as winning currency of choice.

40% of Macau's GDP is tied with gambling revenue, pretty much explains already how friendly the law to the gambling industry.

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Quote from: Z390 on November 03, 2024, 03:59:26 AM

Why should I care if Macau takes over Las Vegas? How will the United States of America benefits from Macau taking the lead?

They don’t really benefit from that since it means lower tax collection. But looking at the bigger picture, I think gambling taxes in the US are still significant, and it’s not like they’re losing gamblers to Macau. Macau’s growth is more about being a place dedicated to gambling.

OP might just be trying to educate us on the biggest gambling capital in the world, as many people may not realize there are places bigger than Vegas. Vegas gets highlighted in so many movies and gambling scenes, but Macau? I don’t think I’ve seen a gambling movie set there.

Cryptomultiplier

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This is an old debate and for me, no conclusions can be drawn yet as regards the most dominant gambling capital in the world. Gambling sure provides a good revenue for the state through taxes and commissions and I know of how Brazil allowed gambling winnings to be taxed until it currently banned gambling activities in the country despite the taxes and regulations.
The success of a gambling capital is dependent on the laws and regulations that abide therein and I think one way las Vegas or Macau can retain the number one spot gambling capital is to incorporate the use of AI bots and integrations as well as acceptance of cryptocurrency for placing bets and as winning currency of choice.

Z390

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Why should I care if Macau takes over Las Vegas? How will the United States of America benefits from Macau taking the lead? This discussion isn't benefitting in any way, Macau success is helpful for China, that place is always going to exists because of the taxes and other money benefits that it is pouring into the country and that's the same to Las Vegas for the USA, forget everything else it is not necessary.

There are other big gambling cities in the world today and believe they bring in more money than anything else in the countries, it is why they are allowed to exists side by side in a centralised country in the first place.

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Quote from: Saint-loup on November 02, 2024, 05:47:49 PM

Quote from: kotajikikox on November 02, 2024, 08:20:34 AM

and are there any cities you think can be a surprise to the gambling industry and could potentially threaten both Macau and Las Vegas?

Yes Osaka in japan when it will open its doors in 6 years (2030). The giant casino complex will be located on an artificial island in Osaka Bay, the Yumeshima island, and it will be the biggest casino complex of Asia and even maybe of the world. Japanese and inhabitants around are reputed for being big gamblers, way more than americans and europeans, so many people are likely to go there.

Another city I think has the potential in the future is Abu Dhabi. They are planning on building casino resorts in the port or in the Yas Island. I genuinely am excited to see how gambling can boom in the emirates. They already have a lot of tourists, wealthy and high prolific ones as well, so imagine a casino ring in the emirates? Seems exciting.

For now though they are still trying to fight with regulations and all the logistics. But if Japan is stepping up their game in 2030, then we might see Abu Dhabi in the fight as well.

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Macao? Most people don’t even know where that city is. Last Vegas might have lost its mojo lately but it will be the king city of gambling forever imo. Macao, monaco, curaçao whatever, these will come and go but Las Vegas will always be there and print money for those who invested in it.

I just checked and found out Macao is in China. I see it is an autonomous region but still, it is in China. One day Xi might wake up and decide to ban gambling altogether like how he banned btc mining.

kotajikikox

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Quote from: Fiatless on November 02, 2024, 08:49:57 AM

Macau's location and political affiliations might limit the growth of the gambling business. The country is a special administrative region of China, and many people will not be comfortable there. The Chinese government's tight societal regulations might discourage foreign travellers from China. Tourists might also be discomforted by China's authoritarian government and abuse of human rights.

Even though gambling is only illegal in mainland China, some people may not understand that Macau falls under special administrative region which makes gambling legal in the city. So, I get your point that tourists may not have the same impression of Macau and Las Vegas due to conflicting political systems in China. They might grow hesitant to actually go and gamble in Macau in fear of getting in trouble with the government.

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Thailand and Japan are now competing with Macau. Unlike Macau, where mainland Chinese visitors account for 70% of the total, Thailand and Japan have a good balance of visitors from all over the world, including Europe and the United States.

Macau needs to do something that can attract more tourists in the region and encourage them to gamble. I also think that they need to do a better job in informing the public about the city as it is often grouped together with mainland China which is very strict and would not be the go-to place of gamblers. I saw a research once where it is comparing Thailand's promotional campaign and studying it to see how can Macau replicate the same.

As for Japan, from what I know they have quite strict laws about gambling so despite many tourists I do not think they go to Japan to gamble.

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