So, did the people who whined about early adopters buy cheap BTC? - page 3.

SgtSpike

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Quote from: evoorhees on August 15, 2011, 12:51:05 PM

Quote from: SgtSpike on August 15, 2011, 10:38:10 AM

I don't have a problem with early adopters being rewarded. I DO have a problem with any single person holding more than 0.5% of the currency available.

Hmmm maybe I'm just weird, but this seems like the biggest non-issue of all the non-issues. Those who "adopted" earliest represented the greatest initial thrust behind the project. Bitcoin was a "silly nothing" when the early adopters got involved... and without them it would've forever remained as such. I sincerely hope those early adopters make a fortune, and I care not at all what "proportion" of Bitcoins any single person owns.

Those who hold the most coins have the greatest incentive to see them succeed, and if they decide to "dump" them, then all the complainers will get a great opportunity to buy for cheap! I really don't see the concern here... but it seems just like jealousy and a misunderstanding of how prices and markets work.

I'm not jealous. I just know that when the world looks at Satoshi and a few others as owning a large percentage of the currency (and thus having a large amount of power with regards to money supply, inflation/deflation, pricing, political movements, etc), the world is going to have a problem with it. It's one big roadblock to Bitcoins replacing any fiat currency.

You yourself may not have a problem with it, but it should at least concern you, from the perspective of having more people adopt and use bitcoin.

evoorhees

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Democracy is the original 51% attack

Quote from: SgtSpike on August 15, 2011, 10:38:10 AM

I don't have a problem with early adopters being rewarded. I DO have a problem with any single person holding more than 0.5% of the currency available.

Hmmm maybe I'm just weird, but this seems like the biggest non-issue of all the non-issues. Those who "adopted" earliest represented the greatest initial thrust behind the project. Bitcoin was a "silly nothing" when the early adopters got involved... and without them it would've forever remained as such. I sincerely hope those early adopters make a fortune, and I care not at all what "proportion" of Bitcoins any single person owns.

Those who hold the most coins have the greatest incentive to see them succeed, and if they decide to "dump" them, then all the complainers will get a great opportunity to buy for cheap! I really don't see the concern here... but it seems just like jealousy and a misunderstanding of how prices and markets work.

kokjo

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You are WRONG!

Quote from: SgtSpike on August 15, 2011, 10:38:10 AM

I don't have a problem with early adopters being rewarded. I DO have a problem with any single person holding more than 0.5% of the currency available.

+1 agreed! did just put that in my sig!

Vladimir

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Quote from: jancsika on August 15, 2011, 12:15:19 PM

Or maybe it's just me. Can someone please explain the lack of relationship I mentioned above, without resorting to "Satoshi designed the system so he/she deserves those coins," or, "whiners be hatin'," or, "RALLY!!!, etc."? In fact let's make it really clean by leaving miners/investors out completely-- I just want to know why Bitcoin is designed this way.

This is actually a very simple question to answer. This design allowed to solve bootstrap problem, also known as catch 22 or chicken and egg problem.

i.e. it is not a bug it is a feature as are many other properties of bitcoin.

jancsika

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The OP creates a false dichotomy between early adopters, who "risked a LOT and won" (OP's emphasis), and late adopters who "are only good at whining".

Here's a counterexample of an early adopter who is a "whiner" and also feels differently about the level of risk he took:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/early-speculators-reward-antidote-10755

But that's just an aside. As far as I can tell, Satoshi either didn't consider the consequences of having no relationship between block difficulty and block reward, or he/she purposefully wanted no relationship. This poor design will hinder wider adoption of Bitcoin because it simply doesn't make sense to newcomers that the same rewards are given regardless of how much security is being provided for the block chain.

But maybe the bigger problem is that this _makes_ sense to people who aren't newcomers.

Or maybe it's just me. Can someone please explain the lack of relationship I mentioned above, without resorting to "Satoshi designed the system so he/she deserves those coins," or, "whiners be hatin'," or, "RALLY!!!, etc."? In fact let's make it really clean by leaving miners/investors out completely-- I just want to know why Bitcoin is designed this way.

RodeoX

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The revolution will be monetized!

Even if you bought at $9 two days ago and sold today for $11, bitcoin would outperform your stocks for the entire year.
And I agree with the OP. Don't hate just because you can't pull the trigger.

N12

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Quote from: SgtSpike on August 15, 2011, 10:38:10 AM

I don't have a problem with early adopters being rewarded. I DO have a problem with any single person holding more than 0.5% of the currency available.

Agreed. It can be a problem for stability.

Also, what people here are forgetting is that early adopters usually have CPU mined their wealth. Running a CPU consuming app for a few weeks is neither risky or wild. That’s something people even do for free to help a cause, like folding@home.

Putting your money in Bitcoin or today’s mining hardware is certainly risky though.

SgtSpike

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Quote from: Explodicle on August 15, 2011, 11:21:51 AM

Quote from: SgtSpike on August 15, 2011, 10:38:10 AM

I don't have a problem with early adopters being rewarded. I DO have a problem with any single person holding more than 0.5% of the currency available.

In hindsight maybe a slower curve or earlier hype would have been better for economic stability, but at this point I feel like changing the rules would do more harm than good. A new fork wouldn't gain acceptance before the Bitcoin early adopters all sell out and the problem solves itself. It's not like they don't "deserve" it, so what's the big deal?

What's the big deal?

The big deal is, no one will accept Bitcoins to replace any major currency once they realize how much the early adopters hold.

Right now, the world's richest man holds what, 60 or 70 billion USD? The 1.5 million BTC that Satoshi holds now would effectively become at least one TRILLION dollars if BTC replaced the USD. That's just too much to be acceptable by any reasonable person. WAY too much.

Explodicle

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Quote from: SgtSpike on August 15, 2011, 10:38:10 AM

I don't have a problem with early adopters being rewarded. I DO have a problem with any single person holding more than 0.5% of the currency available.

In hindsight maybe a slower curve or earlier hype would have been better for economic stability, but at this point I feel like changing the rules would do more harm than good. A new fork wouldn't gain acceptance before the Bitcoin early adopters all sell out and the problem solves itself. It's not like they don't "deserve" it, so what's the big deal?

FlipPro

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Quote from: The_Duke on August 15, 2011, 10:42:02 AM

Quote from: SgtSpike on August 15, 2011, 10:38:10 AM

I don't have a problem with early adopters being rewarded. I DO have a problem with any single person holding more than 0.5% of the currency available.

This.

And comparing buying BTC at $0.001 each (or mining them with hundreds per week) or at $6 each is kinda idiotic.

If your so worried about it why not just mine IXcoin? You can be an early adopter right now!

ixcoin.org

...

Seriously what do you want?

The_Duke

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Lead Core BitKitty Developer

Quote from: SgtSpike on August 15, 2011, 10:38:10 AM

I don't have a problem with early adopters being rewarded. I DO have a problem with any single person holding more than 0.5% of the currency available.

This.

And comparing buying BTC at $0.001 each (or mining them with hundreds per week) or at $6 each is kinda idiotic.

SgtSpike

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I don't have a problem with early adopters being rewarded. I DO have a problem with any single person holding more than 0.5% of the currency available.

evoorhees

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Democracy is the original 51% attack

Quote from: Gabi on August 15, 2011, 04:11:47 AM

Cause they were all like "omg early adopters bought tons of btc for a so low price! This is not fair!"

Well, did you buy them at 6$ now? What? You didn't? Guess what? I expected that.

Why? Cause omg price is low, crash, fail, blabla? But but but that's exactly what early adopters faced, an almost unknown currency at very low price, they risked a LOT and won (BTC price then increased). While you are only good at whining Grin

BTC at 6$ was a chance to buy them at a low price even in august 2011, if you whined about early adopters AND you missed that then you are just a whiner Roll Eyes

Why i open that thread? Cause i'm tired of reading about ppl who is good only to whine about early adopters and of course can't be bothered to risk when price is low.

+1!!!!!! The term "early adopter" should be changed to "wild risk taker". I think a lot of people just want to be given a bunch of valuable stuff, and have no risk attached

Vladimir

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Quote from: Gabi on August 15, 2011, 04:11:47 AM

BTC at 6$ was a chance to buy them at a low price even in august 2011, if you whined about early adopters AND you missed that then you are just a whiner Roll Eyes

This also applies to those who sold below 10$ (or 1000$). Wanna be seen as an early adopter, than hold on to most of your bitcoin until 2015 or something.

Nobody remembers those who bought some BRK/A shares at 10$ and sold at 11$. Those who bought than and still owns a few percent of those are entirely different matter.

hugolp

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+1

I approve this message.

Gabi

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If you want to walk on water, get out of the boat

Cause they were all like "omg early adopters bought tons of btc for a so low price! This is not fair!"

Well, did you buy them at 6$ now? What? You didn't? Guess what? I expected that.

Why? Cause omg price is low, crash, fail, blabla? But but but that's exactly what early adopters faced, an almost unknown currency at very low price, they risked a LOT and won (BTC price then increased). While you are only good at whining Grin

BTC at 6$ was a chance to buy them at a low price even in august 2011, if you whined about early adopters AND you missed that then you are just a whiner Roll Eyes

Why i open that thread? Cause i'm tired of reading about ppl who is good only to whine about early adopters and of course can't be bothered to risk when price is low.

Topic: So, did the people who whined about early adopters buy cheap BTC? - page 3. (Read 4920 times)