Speculation on the price of BTC if Bitfinex does a Gox - page 2.

Wind_FURY

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Quote from: User705 on April 23, 2017, 11:40:23 PM

Is it possible that it's not insolvency but KYC/AML? Bitfinex is having issues not because it's MT Gox but because it was just like the Chinese exchanges and especially the tether crypto which is literally the definition of money laundering. The only exchanges allowed to be left standing are full KYC/AML exchanges. The issue is the huge amount of daily money that needs to be put into BTC and all the other crypto just to maintain current price levels and if the only way that can be done is through full KYC/AML exchanges it's unlikely the price levels will be maintained.

That could be it. But you should remember that Bitfinex was hacked and had funds stolen that amounted to $65m. That is a very huge loss. So the issue that they might be insolvent should always be there and should not be avoided or ignored. MtGox was in an exact same position years ago. Roger Ver said they were solvent but they were really not. We know how that story ended.

Red-Apple

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Quote from: User705 on April 23, 2017, 11:40:23 PM

Is it possible that it's not insolvency but KYC/AML? Bitfinex is having issues not because it's MT Gox but because it was just like the Chinese exchanges and especially the tether crypto which is literally the definition of money laundering. The only exchanges allowed to be left standing are full KYC/AML exchanges. The issue is the huge amount of daily money that needs to be put into BTC and all the other crypto just to maintain current price levels and if the only way that can be done is through full KYC/AML exchanges it's unlikely the price levels will be maintained.

i think it is a good assumption. they all claim some stuff in their site or in their TOS about KYC/AML but deep down they are not really following it.
and i mostly say it is good assumption because of the things that are happening to other exchanges. you can see that OkCoin and Btc-e have already announced they have problems with their wire transfer too.

1Referee

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Quote from: alyssa85 on April 24, 2017, 05:17:59 AM

This. Gradual death is fine - lots of exchanges have gradual deaths, it is the nature of capitalism. The important thing is that financial losses are few, and the more people who get their money out, the better, because they can just trade somewhere else and life will go on.

Problem is that people are easily tricked into believing something. Last year when Bitfinex lost a huge load of coins due to a "hack", people were furious and told that this exchange was pure trash, that it can't be trusted, that it wasn't a hack, etc. But now they have "paid back" their debt, people did a 360 and now even see it as a decent exchange. What a bunch of sheeps are they! It's mind boggling how people dare to store even a slight number of coins there. And then you have whales with thousands of coins and millions in funds in their account. It's beyond insane that such an exchange gets rewarded while it shoud have dried out last year.

alyssa85

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Quote from: European Central Bank on April 23, 2017, 09:41:11 PM

Quote from: aardvark15 on April 23, 2017, 02:34:34 PM

The price could easily dip to half what it is now if Bitfinex closed and customers lose their Bitcoins. That would be below $700. But if think it would be temporary and there would be some recovery but it would not get to $1300 for a while.

The amount of coins in their cold wallet has been dwindling rapidly. That tells us that everyone who wants out is getting out fine and there are no reports of crypto problems. And if it does die there'll be far fewer coins lost as it drags on.

If it can't solve its problems then it's gonna be a gradual death that's publicly observable and not an implosion. There won't be any shocks to the system but there will be a slow burning effect.

This. Gradual death is fine - lots of exchanges have gradual deaths, it is the nature of capitalism. The important thing is that financial losses are few, and the more people who get their money out, the better, because they can just trade somewhere else and life will go on.

JariKriting

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bitcoin price in bitfinex not effect another exchanger
you can see yesterday in bitfinex bitcoin price incraese to 1350 dollar, but another exchanger not follow bitfinex price

User705

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Is it possible that it's not insolvency but KYC/AML? Bitfinex is having issues not because it's MT Gox but because it was just like the Chinese exchanges and especially the tether crypto which is literally the definition of money laundering. The only exchanges allowed to be left standing are full KYC/AML exchanges. The issue is the huge amount of daily money that needs to be put into BTC and all the other crypto just to maintain current price levels and if the only way that can be done is through full KYC/AML exchanges it's unlikely the price levels will be maintained.

European Central Bank

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Quote from: aardvark15 on April 23, 2017, 02:34:34 PM

The price could easily dip to half what it is now if Bitfinex closed and customers lose their Bitcoins. That would be below $700. But if think it would be temporary and there would be some recovery but it would not get to $1300 for a while.

The amount of coins in their cold wallet has been dwindling rapidly. That tells us that everyone who wants out is getting out fine and there are no reports of crypto problems. And if it does die there'll be far fewer coins lost as it drags on.

If it can't solve its problems then it's gonna be a gradual death that's publicly observable and not an implosion. There won't be any shocks to the system but there will be a slow burning effect.

Wind_FURY

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Quote from: zimmah on April 23, 2017, 09:26:28 AM

It won't have a large effect.

We have already gone through a situation like it, and we survived that too, so this time we'll have something to look back to and say "hey, last tme wasn't so bad".

A lot of people are already jumping ship and using kraken now or other exchanges.

It is clear that you are not one of the victims of MtGox. If you were you will not be posting something like that. You will be devastated that it is happening again and that now other people will go through what you have gone through because they think they can look back and say "hey, last time was not so bad".

Try depositing all the Bitcoin you have in Bitfinex.

dothebeats

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Highly unlikely for finex to pull off such a feat especially when there are no signs of it lingering around to point us to the said question. Sure enough, everything can happen. We never knew beforehand that Gox will pull off a Gox, but again judging from the current state of finex, this will not happen.

york780

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Quote from: Propane on April 23, 2017, 02:39:49 PM

It seems unlikely to me to talk about Bitfinex going the Mt Gox way. Talking about this possibility is for me the best way to create panic and to lead to this scenario. For this reason I will not be speculating on something I do not believe will happen.

Thats why u are brand new :-). Bitfinex exit pump is strong rightnow. Look at the huge premium man! Its going to explode!

Propane

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It seems unlikely to me to talk about Bitfinex going the Mt Gox way. Talking about this possibility is for me the best way to create panic and to lead to this scenario. For this reason I will not be speculating on something I do not believe will happen.

aardvark15

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The price could easily dip to half what it is now if Bitfinex closed and customers lose their Bitcoins. That would be below $700. But if think it would be temporary and there would be some recovery but it would not get to $1300 for a while.

Maheshkumar_Hrangkhawl

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It seems like the problems are temporary. They are still allowing withdrawals in crypto-currency. So even if you have to pay 5% to 10% premium, it is possible to withdraw your money from Bitfinex.

BTW, I am not a big fan of Bitfinex. Anyone remember this?

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/bitfinex-exchange-owner-admits-to-using-inside-information-to-trade-on-own-platf-931003

Teraboy

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Quote from: aardvark15 on April 22, 2017, 09:55:53 PM

Quote from: PlanetOfBets on April 21, 2017, 03:44:36 AM

Quote from: york780 on April 21, 2017, 02:46:30 AM

Quote from: Maheshkumar_Hrangkhawl on April 21, 2017, 02:28:24 AM

Quote from: Wind_FURY on April 20, 2017, 10:45:30 PM

Quote from: Hazir on April 20, 2017, 10:42:06 AM

It is not about Bitfinex anymore. Major bitcoin exchanges stopped accepting US dollar deposit as well.
They all claim that there is a problem with wired deposits and banking system.
This situation created fake demand for bitcoin, because people are buying BTC with the fiat money to withdraw it.

This is bad news. The lowest price that was said in this thread where Bitcoin might fall to is at $800. But if all major exchanges stopped fiat deposits and withdrawals, could the fall be lower than initially expected? Back to $500 perhaps?

May be $800 or $900, but not $500. First of all, Bitfinex is not the largest Bitcoin exchange out there, nor it is the oldest one. And secondly, indications are that the ongoing issues are temporary.

The indicators that are saying that btc is getting overbought and topping? Yes my friend, a top is temporary.

Now people can not withdraw their money from Bitfinex, it's completely stopped. Even if everyone is at a loss, Bitcoin is after them, they have an artificial rise. It started to climb slowly as the difference in other stock markets opened so well. I advise you to be careful because of the problem with the rise in Bitfinex.

I don't use Bitfinex, but if people can't take their money or coins out, this sounds like what happened at Cryptsy. I never recovered my coins from there. I hope it's only temporary and they fix the problem.

More volume on bitfinex flow to another exchange site, and it will decrease the impact if sometimes bitfinex will be turned another cryptsy or bitfinex hack 2.0. Too difficult to fixed the account has blocked by the bank institution.

zimmah

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It won't have a large effect.

We have already gone through a situation like it, and we survived that too, so this time we'll have something to look back to and say "hey, last tme wasn't so bad".

A lot of people are already jumping ship and using kraken now or other exchanges.

RoommateAgreement

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Bazinga!

Quote from: aardvark15 on April 22, 2017, 09:55:53 PM

I don't use Bitfinex, but if people can't take their money or coins out, this sounds like what happened at Cryptsy. I never recovered my coins from there. I hope it's only temporary and they fix the problem.

it has always been money and NOT cryptocurrencies.
things are different with bitfinex and it is nothing like Cryptsy. Cryptsy was a filthy scam that blocked everything and ran away.

and that is one of the reasons why many believe it is solvent. it is because of the "bank" that nobody can move fiat in or out of the exchange. but since cryptocurrencies are decentralized, nobody can block them and bitfinex has been paying the customers from their cold storage and they are withdrawaing.

aardvark15

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Quote from: PlanetOfBets on April 21, 2017, 03:44:36 AM

Quote from: york780 on April 21, 2017, 02:46:30 AM

Quote from: Maheshkumar_Hrangkhawl on April 21, 2017, 02:28:24 AM

Quote from: Wind_FURY on April 20, 2017, 10:45:30 PM

Quote from: Hazir on April 20, 2017, 10:42:06 AM

It is not about Bitfinex anymore. Major bitcoin exchanges stopped accepting US dollar deposit as well.
They all claim that there is a problem with wired deposits and banking system.
This situation created fake demand for bitcoin, because people are buying BTC with the fiat money to withdraw it.

This is bad news. The lowest price that was said in this thread where Bitcoin might fall to is at $800. But if all major exchanges stopped fiat deposits and withdrawals, could the fall be lower than initially expected? Back to $500 perhaps?

May be $800 or $900, but not $500. First of all, Bitfinex is not the largest Bitcoin exchange out there, nor it is the oldest one. And secondly, indications are that the ongoing issues are temporary.

The indicators that are saying that btc is getting overbought and topping? Yes my friend, a top is temporary.

Now people can not withdraw their money from Bitfinex, it's completely stopped. Even if everyone is at a loss, Bitcoin is after them, they have an artificial rise. It started to climb slowly as the difference in other stock markets opened so well. I advise you to be careful because of the problem with the rise in Bitfinex.

I don't use Bitfinex, but if people can't take their money or coins out, this sounds like what happened at Cryptsy. I never recovered my coins from there. I hope it's only temporary and they fix the problem.

Wind_FURY

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Quote from: Leonard2016 on April 22, 2017, 09:27:39 PM

Quote from: Maheshkumar_Hrangkhawl on April 21, 2017, 02:28:24 AM

Quote from: Wind_FURY on April 20, 2017, 10:45:30 PM

Quote from: Hazir on April 20, 2017, 10:42:06 AM

It is not about Bitfinex anymore. Major bitcoin exchanges stopped accepting US dollar deposit as well.
They all claim that there is a problem with wired deposits and banking system.
This situation created fake demand for bitcoin, because people are buying BTC with the fiat money to withdraw it.

This is bad news. The lowest price that was said in this thread where Bitcoin might fall to is at $800. But if all major exchanges stopped fiat deposits and withdrawals, could the fall be lower than initially expected? Back to $500 perhaps?

May be $800 or $900, but not $500. First of all, Bitfinex is not the largest Bitcoin exchange out there, nor it is the oldest one. And secondly, indications are that the ongoing issues are temporary.

most people only see the surface. they see a topic using the word GOX and then remember hearing some distant thing about GOX running away but price going up before it then they think the same is happening here too. hence the $500
they never think about 1000 other differences of GOX and Bitfinex, or differences between 2011 and 2017!
and these differences have already been said a hundred times.

Yes but in their differences there are also similarities. The biggest sign that traders are leaving Bitfinex is the premium price of Bitcoin. That means everyone there is buying to withdraw in Bitcoin. How long can the exchange keep this up? They will have to block all BTC withdrawals soon to survive.

blakegrr

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i think there would be no effect on the price if that happened.

Leonard2016

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Quote from: Maheshkumar_Hrangkhawl on April 21, 2017, 02:28:24 AM

Quote from: Wind_FURY on April 20, 2017, 10:45:30 PM

Quote from: Hazir on April 20, 2017, 10:42:06 AM

It is not about Bitfinex anymore. Major bitcoin exchanges stopped accepting US dollar deposit as well.
They all claim that there is a problem with wired deposits and banking system.
This situation created fake demand for bitcoin, because people are buying BTC with the fiat money to withdraw it.

This is bad news. The lowest price that was said in this thread where Bitcoin might fall to is at $800. But if all major exchanges stopped fiat deposits and withdrawals, could the fall be lower than initially expected? Back to $500 perhaps?

May be $800 or $900, but not $500. First of all, Bitfinex is not the largest Bitcoin exchange out there, nor it is the oldest one. And secondly, indications are that the ongoing issues are temporary.

most people only see the surface. they see a topic using the word GOX and then remember hearing some distant thing about GOX running away but price going up before it then they think the same is happening here too. hence the $500
they never think about 1000 other differences of GOX and Bitfinex, or differences between 2011 and 2017!
and these differences have already been said a hundred times.

Topic: Speculation on the price of BTC if Bitfinex does a Gox - page 2. (Read 4095 times)